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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Wed May 05, 2021 5:04 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 22924
Location: Bondi Beach
Crusader wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
Crusader wrote:
Bid matching will also create openings, as points are credited in exchange for moving back in the order.

As was the case with our first pick last year.


Geez ... this is out of my league.

Thanks :thumbsup:

When you get a chance ... please explain.
Thanks in advance
Pauline

What I wrote was probably the least good way of explaining what goes on... if a club uses the points value of pick 27, 29, 35 & 40 to match a bid at pick 3, then every pick from 41 onwards would move up three spots (four surrendered picks, minus the one they bought). Any left over points will give the matching team another pick later in the draft. In this case, the 70-odd points left over would slot in at pick 67.

In Freo's case, they didn't have the full points value to match our bid on one of their academy guys in the 2019 draft, so the deficit was accrued against the value of their first pick in 2020.

Basically, the whole @#$%&! show is harder to track than the weather, but any club-to-club deals get squared away on the night.


That's a good axplanation Cru :thumbsup:

Makes sense

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2021 6:58 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:52 am
Posts: 8927
Location: Nth Fitzroy
If losing Cripps got us Cerra and Dunkley ( with another pick perhaps) would that be a good result?

I hope Cripps sorts himself out and comes back strong but if he has to go...


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2021 7:07 pm 
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Have to wait and see how the season pans out. He may be the difference second half of season getting the club to play finals.

He is badly and sadly out of sorts but happy to back in our champ to come good.


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 Post subject: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2021 7:21 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 2:15 pm
Posts: 20207
Location: North of the border
If Kruez is fit I would take him mid season draft

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2021 8:15 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 10:49 am
Posts: 1626
Sydney Blue wrote:
If Kruez is fit I would take him mid season draft

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Golly I would take Mike Fitzpatrick


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2021 9:52 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Mon Jul 12, 2010 4:49 pm
Posts: 1071
I'd take Wow Jones. At least he'd belt someone.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2021 11:02 pm 
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It's fair to say we have an epic off season on our hands - again

Players coming out of contract

Carlton Players Out of Contract in 2021 Carlton Player Contracts
Name Years Service Status
Brodie Kemp 2 Non-Free Agent
Eddie Betts 2 Non-Free Agent
Edward Curnow 11 Unrestricted Free Agent
Harry McKay 6 Non-Free Agent
Jack Newnes 2 Non-Free Agent
Jack Silvagni 6 Non-Free Agent
Josh Honey 2 Non-Free Agent
Lachlan Fogarty 1 Non-Free Agent
Levi Casboult 12 Unrestricted Free Agent
Lochie O'Brien 4 Non-Free Agent
Luke Parks 1 Non-Free Agent
Marc Murphy 16 Unrestricted Free Agent
Marc Pittonet 2 Non-Free Agent
Matt Cottrell 3 Non-Free Agent
Matt Owies 3 Non-Free Agent
Matthew Kennedy 4 Non-Free Agent
Michael Gibbons 3 Non-Free Agent
Nic Newman 3 Non-Free Agent
Oscar McDonald 1 Non-Free Agent
Patrick Cripps 8 Restricted Free Agent
Sam Petrevski-Seton 5 Non-Free Agent
Sam Ramsay 2 Non-Free Agent
Will Setterfield 3 Non-Free Agent


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 Post subject: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2021 11:47 pm 
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Geoff Southby

Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:14 pm
Posts: 5990
Location: Melbourne
club29 wrote:
If losing Cripps got us Cerra and Dunkley ( with another pick perhaps) would that be a good result?

I hope Cripps sorts himself out and comes back strong but if he has to go...


I’d do that in a heartbeat.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2021 7:06 am 
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Geoff Southby

Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:36 am
Posts: 5959
What we are now seeing is the poor recruiting from the last 6 years coming to fruition.
I was one of the first to be critical of the large number of hacks we picked from other AFL clubs.
But the rot truly set in in 2017 when SOS picked Kennedy (picked him twice with 13 and 28)and Darcy Lang then with pick 3 and 10 picked Dow and O’Brien
Schumacher as well
Other than DeKoning he totally [REDACTED] up then compounds the problem by trading away 5 players for McGovern and another mid Setterfield the following season
Disaster every corner you look
Now we are saddled with Martin Williams and Saad

Bad trades ridiculous contracts picking spuds with top 10 picks kills you in the end

The effort was there yesterday but we simply sent good enough
Setterfield Dow O’Brien Kennedy are running around in the VFL
If they are any good they should be dominating and there not

How much time do fellow posters give these players before the penny drops that they simply not up to it


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 Post subject: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2021 9:41 am 
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Wayne Johnston

Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 12:18 pm
Posts: 8166
Location: Australia
Walsh wrote:
It's fair to say we have an epic off season on our hands - again

Players coming out of contract

Carlton Players Out of Contract in 2021 Carlton Player Contracts
Name Years Service Status
Brodie Kemp 2 Non-Free Agent
Eddie Betts 2 Non-Free Agent
Edward Curnow 11 Unrestricted Free Agent
Harry McKay 6 Non-Free Agent
Jack Newnes 2 Non-Free Agent
Jack Silvagni 6 Non-Free Agent
Josh Honey 2 Non-Free Agent
Lachlan Fogarty 1 Non-Free Agent
Levi Casboult 12 Unrestricted Free Agent
Lochie O'Brien 4 Non-Free Agent
Luke Parks 1 Non-Free Agent
Marc Murphy 16 Unrestricted Free Agent
Marc Pittonet 2 Non-Free Agent
Matt Cottrell 3 Non-Free Agent
Matt Owies 3 Non-Free Agent
Matthew Kennedy 4 Non-Free Agent
Michael Gibbons 3 Non-Free Agent
Nic Newman 3 Non-Free Agent
Oscar McDonald 1 Non-Free Agent
Patrick Cripps 8 Restricted Free Agent
Sam Petrevski-Seton 5 Non-Free Agent
Sam Ramsay 2 Non-Free Agent
Will Setterfield 3 Non-Free Agent


Sadly only Mackay and Parks are the only ones we have to keep from that list, maybe Kemp and Cripps too if we really believe they can overcome their injuries (and I don’t trust anyone in the club to know that with any certainty). Of the others they’re either too old to worry about or too marginal to notice their absence.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2021 11:59 am 
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Ken Hunter
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Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 9:02 pm
Posts: 11420
Location: Melbourne
club29 wrote:
If losing Cripps got us Cerra and Dunkley ( with another pick perhaps) would that be a good result?

I hope Cripps sorts himself out and comes back strong but if he has to go...


Yes on both points.

I love Cripps but I love Carlton more and if letting him go takes us forward I'm for it. Honestly if he goes to Fremantle I will pretty much forget about him anyway.

I wonder if his contract negotiations (or lack of) are destabilising for others at the club too.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2021 1:23 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 22924
Location: Bondi Beach
club29 wrote:
If losing Cripps got us Cerra and Dunkley ( with another pick perhaps) would that be a good result?

I hope Cripps sorts himself out and comes back strong but if he has to go...


Yes

We play better when Cripps is not in the midfield this year.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2021 7:46 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Location: afl.virtualsports.com.au
Tom Browne
@TomBrowne7
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53s
West Coast is circling Patrick Cripps. The issue is salary space. I’m told they’d look at trading Yeo with OP concerns, but it’d be difficult to clear his $800,000.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2021 8:07 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 22924
Location: Bondi Beach
Clowns at 360 have changed their tune towards Carlton.
More of a pat on the back for first 3 quarters.

That Carlton have the 2 best bookends: Weitering & McKay.
Add Jones and Betts to them and there's a lot to build on from there.
I'm not sure about Betts but they would have liked to say Charlie Curnow.
Saad and Williams under performing, and both very good HB's.

The problem Robbo says is the stuff in between.
I think Whaetely would've liked to have said between the ears.

No mention of Cripps or Docherty, nor anyone else.

I don't know why Russell and co are not being questioned re injuries, strength and endurance.
I think the defensive set of of Teague's is really taxing, but effective for as long as it lasts.
Carlton haven't been able to respond to a big effort from the opposition. Flaky.

Teague has to sort out the players who are going to win it for him, or develop for the position.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 7:47 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 22924
Location: Bondi Beach
Filling the Small forward position has been an ongoing quest for Carlton since Betts and Garlett left the club.

The return of Betts is just a temporary band aid to help expedite the development of potential small forward specialists: Fisher (pick 27) Durdin (pick 31) and Owies. We have options, and Fisher is almost proven for that role imo.

The opinion of most fans is that Gibbons is a midfielder rather than a small forward: a role which requires great acceleration, repeat efforts, ability to lay a strong tackle, put body pressure on opponents, blocks, smarts, creativity and of course a couple goals a game. Gibbons lacks the acceleration, and because of that the repeat efforts with that weapon to create spillage. Gibbons is Ok, but imo depth.

https://www.carltonfc.com.au/news/934766/analysis-how-s-corey-durdin-tracking-in-the-vfl-

In reference to Durdin:

Quote:
As Head of Development Luke Power told Carlton Coaches’ Corner, it was his willingness and tenacity in getting at the opposition which shone through for the coaching staff.



Quote:
“His ability to close space, put body on and put himself right into tackles is amazing for a player of his age. He’s got a hunger to pressure and get after the opposition, which is something we’re very excited about.
“It’s his closing speed that really stands out so much.”
One instance which clearly stood out in the second quarter of the weekend’s game was a triple effort from the first-year Blue.


Quote:
For Power, it was the perfect example from a player who he believes displays a selflessness beyond his years.
“It’s not something we see once a game from Corey, we see it multiple times,” he said.
“We call it ‘manic pressure’ and when we’re coding manic pressure after a game he’s usually got 10-12 instances of this.
“The thing we love about Corey is he’s so selfless with his attitude, which is a rare trait for such a young player. He likes to put blocks on and buy time and space for his teammates, and also his ability to get after the opposition is something we’re looking forward to seeing.”


All the qualities we are looking for in a small forward specialist: manic pressure, selflessness.

Interesting interview with Lions small forward specialist highlighting his resurgence as a small forward after a slow start to 2021, he identifies the need to conserve enery to have it ready to explode when needed. That playing midfield forward gassed him. Interesting, and makes sense. Means the midfield depth has to be spread across the team, leaving the Small forward as the opportunist next to the big kahuna.

https://www.afl.com.au/news/612326/the-move-that-had-lion-gassed-and-why-he-s-happier-in-front-of-goal

Quote:
"I didn't have the start I wanted," Cameron told ABC post-game.
"I played in the midfield at the start of the year and I was gassed when I went forward so I spoke to Fages and said 'can I just play forward and just try and get my looks from there'.
"When I was playing in the midfield and coming forward, I was already tired and didn't bring any pressure.


Fingers crosses the 3 we have serve us well for the next decade, post Betts

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Last edited by bondiblue on Thu May 13, 2021 2:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 10:12 am 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 9:36 am
Posts: 7778
Interesting post. Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 3:27 pm 
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Bert Deacon

Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:51 pm
Posts: 546
malcom blight said we are 2 quality mids short ( find them in draft ) and to keep PC


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 3:40 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2005 8:41 pm
Posts: 2371
jamespul65 wrote:
malcom blight said we are 2 quality mids short ( find them in draft ) and to keep PC

Good call. I was taught to never swear.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 4:53 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Location: Half back flank
muzza wrote:
jamespul65 wrote:
malcom blight said we are 2 quality mids short ( find them in draft ) and to keep PC

Good call. I was taught to never swear.




:lol:

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2021
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 8:09 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 22924
Location: Bondi Beach
jamespul65 wrote:
malcom blight said we are 2 quality mids short ( find them in draft ) and to keep PC


We can do that, but a couple may also be right under our nose.

Need a replacement for Casboult to Fwd/ Ruck

DeKoning No 1 ruck over Pitto. That was done last year.

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