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PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2021 8:46 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:38 pm
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Apparently Clarkson didn’t think the Hawks were strong enough round the ball in the last few weeks so made them do boxing last week and players agreed performances not strong enough -we wouldn’t do boxing we would be handing out the Kleenex and a nice group of choir boys would all sing kumbya
Tough up the lot of you you are embarrassing your self and your supporters the whole competition continues to laugh at you
Do something about it collectively
And coaches and coach stop pandering to them toughen up


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:34 pm 
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Geoff Southby

Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:14 pm
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CK95 wrote:
Can't disagree with your logic Frank

The unlogical side of me just can't think of Buckley in Carlton colours though (and I actually really like Bucks)

Reckon he'll take a year or so off & do media anyway.


Just keep getting pies previous coach?

But yes if we are looking for a new coach and he still had the fire in the belly, I’d talk to him.

I get the feeling he is looking forward to at least a year or two off with a cushy media role (and he is a very good media performer).


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2021 10:31 am 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Fri May 18, 2007 2:10 pm
Posts: 1578
Drewgirl wrote:
If these guys would have any pride they would come out with some anger and hunger. But every week they are the same uncaring, scaredy cats. The irony is they are frustrated about not winning but are not willing to do something about it.

And I also include poor he deserves better Cripps like the media are saying. If he would pull his finger out and be at his best and lead, we would be in a better situation at the moment.

Right now, he just stands there looking dumbfounded when he loses the ball, and he thinks he is a speedster and tries to take players on. The amount of holding the ball against his this year is staggering.

I blame all of them. Except Walsh !!


I think Weitering, Jones, Ed and Eddie probably get a pass too


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2021 11:18 am 
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Wayne Johnston
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frank dardew wrote:
Apparently Clarkson didn’t think the Hawks were strong enough round the ball in the last few weeks so made them do boxing last week and players agreed performances not strong enough -we wouldn’t do boxing we would be handing out the Kleenex and a nice group of choir boys would all sing kumbya
Tough up the lot of you you are embarrassing your self and your supporters the whole competition continues to laugh at you
Do something about it collectively
And coaches and coach stop pandering to them toughen up


Our boys would get the coach sacked by running to management for bullying.
Successful culture and standards driven by such clubs, don’t belong at ours anymore.


Last edited by SurreyBlue on Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:17 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 15745
Location: Bondi Beach
Scotty12000 wrote:
I wonder how many on our list would even take a swing or even react beyond a meek "okay, that's your opinion" if you told them they were weak as piss onfield to their face...doesn't seem like there's a lot of finger pointing going on at Ikon.

Could it be the right time for Leading Teams?

https://thenewdaily.com.au/sport/sport-focus/2018/03/23/leading-teams/

Quote:
Luke Hodge remembers it like it was yesterday. The search for answers. The initial shock. The acknowledgement that change was needed.

In the tourist hotspot of Mooloolaba on Queensland’s Sunshine Coast, Hawthorn players were attempting to dissect the club’s 2012 AFL grand final loss to Sydney, a result that came just a year after an agonising three-point preliminary final defeat to Collingwood.

Hodge, as fiercely proud as he is competitive, said the “chokers tag” attached to the club was burning inside him.

Coach Alastair Clarkson was seeking answers, too, and called in ‘Leading Teams’, the football industry-popular organisation focused on leadership and high performance, for what co-founder Ray McLean called an “audit”.

McLean, who has worked with sporting teams across every major code in Australia, had spent time with the Hawks before.

But as he always does, he started with a series of what he calls “pivotal early questions”, asking players how they think they are viewed by opposition sides, how they want to be perceived and what behaviours are accepted by the group that shouldn’t be.


How do our players think they are viewed by opposition sides? Do they even have an idea and DTGAF?
How do they want to be perceived?
What behaviours are accepted by the group that shouldn't be?

We can all answer these questions clearly and extensively...can they?


That's great Scotty.

I hope the Review asks these questions too.
Players' perceptions of themselves, their team, their game plan, their coach, the way they are viewd by opponents, and whgat they would like to do to change it, if needed.

We all know what needs to be addressed.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2021 3:04 pm 
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Ken Hands

Joined: Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:31 pm
Posts: 466
If he wants to salvage anything from the season, he needs to use these remaining 10 games to set some standards. Do NOT play players who will not do the team things - tackle, chase, go when it’s your turn etc. If he can’t do this, he can see himself out. Very frustrating watching the same players put in the same weak efforts for the same bad results every week. Have some pride in the jumper that was worn by players like Sticks, Bruce Doull, Ken Hands, John Nicholls etc.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:21 pm 
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Robert Walls
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Anyhow,if this bloke needs a whole batch of new assistants,he needs to find another job.It all flows from the senior coach,not the other way round......................puttin' the horse before the cart.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:43 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
Posts: 2935
Mickstar wrote:
Anyhow,if this bloke needs a whole batch of new assistants,he needs to find another job. :thumbsup: It all flows from the senior coach,not the other way round......................puttin' the horse before the cart.


:clap: :thumbsup: :clap: :thumbsup:

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:46 pm 
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Wayne Johnston
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Mickstar wrote:
Anyhow,if this bloke needs a whole batch of new assistants,he needs to find another job.It all flows from the senior coach,not the other way round......................puttin' the horse before the cart.


This is a discussion I’ve had with plenty of Carlton supporters previously. It’s a great debate. :thumbsup:


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 11:41 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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It hasn't been that way since the 20th Century.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:36 am 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:17 pm
Posts: 1469
Mickstar wrote:
Anyhow,if this bloke needs a whole batch of new assistants,he needs to find another job.It all flows from the senior coach,not the other way round......................puttin' the horse before the cart.


The professional AFL era demands a quality off field set up which includes the assistant coaches. Implementing player and game systems requires a team approach. Otherwise, you will get found out. Too difficult for a senior coach to carry that sort of load. Although, doesn’t mean the senior coach does not have the most important role in that set up.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 11:51 am 
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Wayne Johnston
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WOW wrote:
Mickstar wrote:
Anyhow,if this bloke needs a whole batch of new assistants,he needs to find another job.It all flows from the senior coach,not the other way round......................puttin' the horse before the cart.


The professional AFL era demands a quality off field set up which includes the assistant coaches. Implementing player and game systems requires a team approach. Otherwise, you will get found out. Too difficult for a senior coach to carry that sort of load. Although, doesn’t mean the senior coach does not have the most important role in that set up.


Exactly.

The senior coach oversees the plan but the assistants or line coaches scope, analyse, create and implement the execution of each section of the plan. This is the reason many assistants now exist.
The days of the coach overseeing every line and game execution changed a couple of decades ago and some might even remember older coaches struggling with such change.
The very reason you might see a coach now on the bench encouraging and working with his players more or he is sitting at the front of the box bellowing our instructions to his assistants in the back.
Comments like ‘they have pushed an extra up through the middle - what a we doing’ or ‘why do we have a match mis match on ******’, illustrate the game plan. He wants these fixed by his team and expects them to work it out.

Just my 2 cents.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:37 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Mickstar wrote:
Anyhow,if this bloke needs a whole batch of new assistants,he needs to find another job.It all flows from the senior coach,not the other way round......................puttin' the horse before the cart.


Agree the fella either has got it or he just doesn’t , not matter how much of a nice guy he may be , our team’s performance , results show lack luster wins and very few.
We need a more rugged edged, high footy IQ leader , to show the way, these attributes just can’t be taught.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 2:05 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2011 3:17 pm
Posts: 2375
SurreyBlue wrote:
WOW wrote:
Mickstar wrote:
Anyhow,if this bloke needs a whole batch of new assistants,he needs to find another job.It all flows from the senior coach,not the other way round......................puttin' the horse before the cart.


The professional AFL era demands a quality off field set up which includes the assistant coaches. Implementing player and game systems requires a team approach. Otherwise, you will get found out. Too difficult for a senior coach to carry that sort of load. Although, doesn’t mean the senior coach does not have the most important role in that set up.


Exactly.

The senior coach oversees the plan but the assistants or line coaches scope, analyse, create and implement the execution of each section of the plan. This is the reason many assistants now exist.
The days of the coach overseeing every line and game execution changed a couple of decades ago and some might even remember older coaches struggling with such change.
The very reason you might see a coach now on the bench encouraging and working with his players more or he is sitting at the front of the box bellowing our instructions to his assistants in the back.
Comments like ‘they have pushed an extra up through the middle - what a we doing’ or ‘why do we have a match mis match on ******’, illustrate the game plan. He wants these fixed by his team and expects them to work it out.

Just my 2 cents.



If he has to wait for his assistants to work it out then address it then he isn't a coach of any sort.
Like Mickstar said it flows down.
He is the main man. He plans, he directs, he implements, he adjusts.
If he is just a figure head then he just needs to pack his bags and piss off.
I don't care how the other clubs are set up we are not in others positions. We need someone to take charge and implement change, focus, direction and non negotiables. That can only come from one position at the moment and the only one who can have a real influential effect on our future at this point in time is the head coach not his assistants, not the board, not the leadership group and not by the fans.
If he is the one to take us forward then show some leadership now of see you later and thanks for waisting another 2/3 years.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 3:40 pm 
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Robert Walls
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A good coach needs a good team of assistant's around him no doubt.............but he has to be a good coach in the first place.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 3:51 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Not wanting to pump my own tyres, but after we decided to make zero changes to our coaching group last year, I predicted with near certainty that we'd not see improvement in 2021 and that everyone getting hyped about our chances would be disappointed.

That's how important a competent coaching TEAM is.

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#GUILTY


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 6:02 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Just get Buckley. Gets the best out of his what's at his disposal, always has.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 6:08 pm 
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Trevor Keogh
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Navy Blue Horse wrote:
Just get Buckley. Gets the best out of his what's at his disposal, always has.


Yes I wouldn’t mind Bucks but I can’t see it happening. Unless Caro can suggest otherwise?


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 6:14 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Buckley is so overrrated it isn't even funny.

Seems people forgot his teams were going backwards year on year for five years before they invested big on the midfield... Adams and Treloar cost them three first round picks.

Luckily for the opposition he had no clue how to put a forward line together but the midfield was all guns blazing.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 6:20 pm 
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Trevor Keogh
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Walsh wrote:
Buckley is so overrrated it isn't even funny.

Seems people forgot his teams were going backwards year on year for five years before they invested big on the midfield... Adams and Treloar cost them three first round picks.

Luckily for the opposition he had no clue how to put a forward line together but the midfield was all guns blazing.


I’m assessing Buckley NOW.

He’s come a long way.

Has a LOT to offer.


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