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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 4:03 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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keogh wrote:
Tell me Braithy why is Houston so good to give up even pick 11 or 12
Do you play him at HB and try Saad in the middle
Is our window open
What we desperately needs is another big key back to support Weitering
Young is simply back up
Lemmey has the size to do it
At least train him up to play key defender in his third pre season
Our small forwards are shit
The one that gets a pass mark is Matt Owies
Why hasn’t he signed
Meanwhile Motlop Fantasia and Durdin have been shit but seem safe
I would turf the first two off in a heartbeat
Durdin can offer something if his shoulders get fixed
One we need more pace
That’s where you would use our first rounder on a quick midfield kid in a midfielders draft

But no
We have to panic now and load up on a HBF
I think I’m a reasonable judge of a footballer
I thought giving pick 26 28 and McAdam for Mc Govern was lunacy not too mention the $700000 5 year deal
The guy has delivered one passable year in 6
Martin cost us around $85000 a goal or $7500 a possession
His gone and I thought he was not much chop
Zac Williams
Now there is a guy who plays similar to Houston
$850000 a season for 6
Next to useless
All Houston has done is okay HBF
He is beautiful kick and reads it pretty well
But not worth a first rounder
And he not what we need unless he becomes a quick mid
He ain’t quick
Unless he becomes a effective small forward
Unproven
He is 186 cm so not going to support Weitering in the big man department down back
So why the love?



Houston is quick mate? quicker than everyone on our list not named saad. the times he's gone to wing, he's a jet. can play all three lines, so there's all kinds of flexibility with a guy like that, and he's the best kick in the afl. elite tackler and interceptor he is a pure footballer. a commodity we don't have anything like.

his kicking alone - walsh and kennedy were top 5 worst F50 entry kicks this season. our turnover from D50, league 3rd worst and ball movement from back to front was literally the worst.

houston fixes so much of all of that. he'd quarterback our backline right now like tom stewart does which allows newman to go into a lockdown role (his most suited role, imo) and it will also release saad as the oppo puts time into houston.

williams was never in the world of houston. he was a flat out halfback who wanted time in the middle and we promised it; so he left his club for us. then he turned up to preseason fat, and proceeded to get injured. houston isn't of that dna. he's an AA halfback who is the best in the league at what he does.

that's why i want him.

i also want to move on from a half dozen players on our list, get an a-grade mid and load up on picks - keeping #11 is a must and doable. draft another small forward to cover owies. then the campo twins

that is an offseason that primes us for a flag,


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 4:08 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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Posts: 6934
bondiblue wrote:
Braithy wrote:
keogh wrote:
Stewart didn’t have an opponent till this year
Scott stuck him in the guts cause he had to
To his credit he has been ok but not as good this year
As for selling the farm in relation to Geelong you don’t do your research very well
We basically gave up Tuohy for Smedts and some GWS spuds
Stengle they got for a bag of chips
Want me to keep
Going
And as for Cameron where did they get some of those draft picks
Because West Coast gave up the farm for Tim Kelly a player got as mature age from South Fremantle for pick 24
In pains me to say that Geelongs recruiting and List Management strategy shits over us



... stewart has been ok? over the journey he's been top 5 or 6 in the league for me. the drive off halfback he gives them, it sets everything up for them; and we could get a player of the same ilk?

how about dangerfield? two firsts and a player from memory? that's a hefty sum, but they've won a flag with him, and maybe another with him this year as a 34 yr old. so you'd say it was worth the price?

... we'll make players available and hopefully someone will pay us for cerra like they did tim kelly and we'll flip that into someone like houston. maybe we'll find someone for harry too, and bring in a gun mid to upgrade cerra.

i'm such an impatient turd, i know... i also know we don't draft or develop very well. and this list is close, we could deliver voss a flag potential list for the next 3 years this summer - then the rest is up to him. i really want that for us


Wouldnt teams want the reliable Kennedy more than Cerra and his hammie battle scars?

Where there's smoke.....

so the names we've heard rumoured as trade bait are: Owies, Carroll, Harry, Kennedy, Cerra, Young. Obviously haven't got a Fwd-Ruck on the radar to replace Pitto.

I reckon someone will come for Young, and I hope we don't let him go without replacing him. Maybe that's why Sam Durdin is still on the list.


sos will be back, o'keefe shows a little doesn't he? and lemmey could take the next step? i also like drewgirl's idea of scrouing the state leagues for a big body ruck with some athleticism like lloyd meek - an old 69th pick in a draft and forgotten about in freo and comes from nowhere to be an excellent ruck. there's more out there just like him.

i think 2025 will be a huge year for cowan. 3rd year in the system - it's always that 3rd preseason the cream rises to the top, eh


Last edited by Braithy on Mon Sep 16, 2024 4:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 4:12 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Braithy wrote:

he played plenty of wing at times for port. that 60m goal on the siren to win them that game (was it against the pies?), he was on the wing.



Bombers. I've liked him ever since :grin:

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 4:13 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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haha it was too. the f'n bombers.

i remember it was big. i jumped out of my chair like we'd won :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 4:13 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:36 am
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He is a significant mark up from Williams but he essentially has only played HB
Again given his history it’s a big risk to trade a first rounder for a player like him
Anyway we agree to disagree


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 4:16 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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I think what we need is young quick agile goal kicking mids.

Our midfield is so Hewett-Kennedy-ish. Agility should be high on our list of priorities

The modern game is Warner & Heeney, Butters & JHF

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 4:18 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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keogh wrote:
He is a significant mark up from Williams but he essentially has only played HB
Again given his history it’s a big risk to trade a first rounder for a player like him
Anyway we agree to disagree



ah mate. i respect everything you say. and everything is a risk. draft, or trade. we could get a flag winning list together this summer just to learn voss isn't up to coaching us to it.

... when houston was drafted they genuinely didn't know where he'd play. forward, middle or back. he's athletic and versatile. and that really appeals to me.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 4:59 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24714
Location: Bondi Beach
keogh wrote:
He is a significant mark up from Williams but he essentially has only played HB
Again given his history it’s a big risk to trade a first rounder for a player like him
Anyway we agree to disagree


He is worth a first rounder, not two, and this year, not pick 11 because we know what we are after and what we are not after....

... first rounders like top 10 SPS Stocker Dow LOB or later firsts like Bootsma Philp ...

Houston is worth a first rounder...next year's and this year's 3rd.

Saad and Cerra were worth first rounders.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 5:02 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24714
Location: Bondi Beach
CK95 wrote:
I think what we need is young quick agile goal kicking mids.

Our midfield is so Hewett-Kennedy-ish. Agility should be high on our list of priorities

The modern game is Warner & Heeney, Butters & JHF


We've got the grunt.
We need some more outside speed to compliment Cerra.

Cripps Hewett Lord with Cerra and another quick.

Wilson should be in that picture in a couple years...who knows...maybe next year he has a great preseason.....mmmmm

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 5:04 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24714
Location: Bondi Beach
Braithy wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
Braithy wrote:
keogh wrote:
Stewart didn’t have an opponent till this year
Scott stuck him in the guts cause he had to
To his credit he has been ok but not as good this year
As for selling the farm in relation to Geelong you don’t do your research very well
We basically gave up Tuohy for Smedts and some GWS spuds
Stengle they got for a bag of chips
Want me to keep
Going
And as for Cameron where did they get some of those draft picks
Because West Coast gave up the farm for Tim Kelly a player got as mature age from South Fremantle for pick 24
In pains me to say that Geelongs recruiting and List Management strategy shits over us



... stewart has been ok? over the journey he's been top 5 or 6 in the league for me. the drive off halfback he gives them, it sets everything up for them; and we could get a player of the same ilk?

how about dangerfield? two firsts and a player from memory? that's a hefty sum, but they've won a flag with him, and maybe another with him this year as a 34 yr old. so you'd say it was worth the price?

... we'll make players available and hopefully someone will pay us for cerra like they did tim kelly and we'll flip that into someone like houston. maybe we'll find someone for harry too, and bring in a gun mid to upgrade cerra.

i'm such an impatient turd, i know... i also know we don't draft or develop very well. and this list is close, we could deliver voss a flag potential list for the next 3 years this summer - then the rest is up to him. i really want that for us


Wouldnt teams want the reliable Kennedy more than Cerra and his hammie battle scars?

Where there's smoke.....

so the names we've heard rumoured as trade bait are: Owies, Carroll, Harry, Kennedy, Cerra, Young. Obviously haven't got a Fwd-Ruck on the radar to replace Pitto.

I reckon someone will come for Young, and I hope we don't let him go without replacing him. Maybe that's why Sam Durdin is still on the list.


sos will be back, o'keefe shows a little doesn't he? and lemmey could take the next step? i also like drewgirl's idea of scrouing the state leagues for a big body ruck with some athleticism like lloyd meek - an old 69th pick in a draft and forgotten about in freo and comes from nowhere to be an excellent ruck. there's more out there just like him.

i think 2025 will be a huge year for cowan. 3rd year in the system - it's always that 3rd preseason the cream rises to the top, eh


SOS. I hope so. I hope he gets his kicking at goal right.
O'Keefe turns 20yo next year...a few years away

Lemmey also 20yo next year, but has a way to go...hasnt impressed me thus far TBH...but he's a big heavy 200cm, so may take a while.

WINDOW IS NOW

Those boys are post Crippa window.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 5:32 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2005 3:08 pm
Posts: 3248
Just drove past Harry’s house…..he’s home, maybe going nowhere :-)


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 6:49 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Posts: 4148
Kennedy asked to look for options next year according to Ch7


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 6:54 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2006 8:59 am
Posts: 8628
Madness

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 6:57 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Posts: 2129
Braithy wrote:
keogh wrote:
Braithy wrote:
do you watch much footy, keogh? bcos there's no way houston is overrated, and he has plenty of leg speed - would make a good winger. but at half back, he quarterbacks the team, gets on his bike and runs and delivers it into F50 the best in the league.

anddddddd ... picking kids and developing them? isn't that quite literally what we've been doing for the last 25 years?


this current list is so close to another prelim and beyond, i can smell it. we need to get after it this summer and bring home number 17. we have deadwood in the club, lets sift thru it, clear some out, upgrade some important areas and make 2025 something to remember.

I watch too much footy
That’s where Houston plays
The easiest position on the ground
That’s why he ain’t worth selling the farm
How many times does it happen early spring when Carlton pay overs
Look at Geelong


very interesting. Tom Stewart plays the same position as houston, and stewart is in the convo for their most important piece. he sets their whole attack up from halfback. and defends like a lion. and many people, including me, say they'd take houston over stewart bcos he's 4 years younger.

geelong's drafting is league best. no one comes close to them, and no one knows how they do it. as good as mannagh or humpheries are, they not anywhere near similar to houston. and to even say that, i'm not sure you've seen houston play or watch much footy.

but to say geelong aren't topping up in free agency is wild. cameron, tuohy, henderson, stengle, gary rohan, dangerfield, oli henry all free agents. all off the top of my head. and this summer they'll buy Bailey Smith. so save me the cats don't give up the farm for players - they give plenty up.


we've waited 30 years since our last flag. it's time to go all out and get another one, yeah?


I agree....Geelong are the best in recruiting, that Wells is a gun.... but how much of their success is due to the free hand given to them by the AFL? 30%? 20%? 40%? 15%? We will never know.. All we know is that their name is written on the premiership cups of 2007, 2009, 2011 & 2022.

The father-son debacle is a loophole they gleefully exploited. Yet another makey-makey uppy uppy rule the AFL introduced that distorted results.

Ablett
Hawkins
Scarlett

Without them, St Kilda would have won in 2009 and Collingwood would have won in 2011 (yes, I know Ablett didn't play in 2011 victory). It distorts results.

Carlton's best father-son?
Lance Whitnall.
Doesn't really compare, does it?
Oh but "the romance of it" all.

No more romance, just level the playing field. Either radically change the "father-son" or get rid of it. I've waited 30 years for my team to have success. I don't see "romance" whilst watching other teams with father-son picks win premierships.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 6:57 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Assuming the cap must be very tight


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 7:01 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2006 8:59 am
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Apparently Owies and Young also free to consider other clubs.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 7:18 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Crazy Voss is striking……damn


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 7:25 pm 
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formerly Fevola

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Surely Crazy Voss doesnt have all the say. Say it ain’t so. This is what i was worried about when we got him.

He wouldnt be getting rid of everyone to bring older names would he?

Please someone tell me that its a joint group decision and not just him.

This could blow our club up like Malthouse did.

I hope the boys are professional enough that this has to happen as we need change to get better. We cant keep on going with the same players.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 7:26 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:48 pm
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I’m all for getting better. There’s being ruthless and then there’s being stupid.

As long as this ruthlessness is also being applied to ALL our coaches too. Can’t just be the players only.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2024
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 8:06 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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MPH78 wrote:
I’m all for getting better. There’s being ruthless and then there’s being stupid.

As long as this ruthlessness is also being applied to ALL our coaches too. Can’t just be the players only.


Pretty sure the stupid lies in part with the Head of List Management who might just have stuffed up how many decent picks we have in a strong draft as opposed to the extensive list coming out of contract next season in what is believed to be a weaker draft. Why the Young contract to 2026? Won't get much for him if he leaves and we don't have the upper hand by telling a contracted player to explore their options. Happy to get what we can for the players who either don't see a future with the club or vice versa. Pretty sure we know all there is to know about these footballers.


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