Blueboy74 wrote:
tap in 79 wrote:
Now Carlton is getting some positive PR spin by saying they will go after McGovern & Gaff.
All spin. Why would any A grade free agent want to come to Carlton?
It isn’t just free agency that keeps tier 3 teams in the basement it is trading.
I was looking at the example of Tom Mitchell going from the Swans to Gill’s Hawks.
Pick 14!!!! Effectively that is all the Hawks had to give up to get a ball magnet. Surely a trade of that nature should be worth more than pick 14. Why don’t Hawthorn have to give up something of real market value? Trading seems to perpetuate the inequities as Mitchell nominated his club of choice and bingo!
2 first round draft picks minimum real market value
His dad played for Carlton not Hawthorn. He wouldn’t come here in a raging fit.
Now I wonder why Hawthorn, Geelong and Sydney make the finals EVERY year almost?
In comparison, Teams like Richmond & Bulldogs have built their teams in a more honourable way, I just look at Geelong, Sydney & Hawthorn & see their team building as a cynical exercise of extorting in built inequities within the trading, drafting system.
I'll be brief as you never listen anyway.
- Mitchell fell out with Longmire and a heap of team mates. For whatever reason Horse played him in the NEAFL or as a sub regularly in his first 5 seasons. His trade value was lowered due to these circumstances.
- If you are going to use a one off example to prove your point perhaps think about the fact that in this example the team on the receiving end of Hawthorn's "good fortune" in the Mitchell deal, is one of the other teams you are trying to prove is exorting the system in Sydney. For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.
- Correct me if I'm wrong, but when you are ranting about Hawthorns free agency/system rorting advantage do you ever bring up the fact they lost Lance Franklin for just Pick #19?.
- And finally if you are going to bring up one off trade examples from the 2016 exchange period to prove how Hawthorn have an unfair advantage, why not take us through the O'Meara deal where they gave up something like Picks #7, #23, #26 and #36 for O'Meara and #68?
I actually think your counter-arguments are valid, very valid. They have credence.
Just a couple of points to counter the counter argument though.
1- Tom Mitchell- He was averaging 30 possessions or thereabouts at the Swans. Everyone knew he was a gun player. It wasn't a mystery like picking up an 18 year old rookie in the draft. Why did they fall out with him? was it because he was seeking to return to Melbourne?
Personally, I wouldn't care if he fell out with everyone from the president to the bootstudder, if you are picking up 30 possessions per match in the engine room...fall out with as many people as you like.
2- Yes, Hawthorn got extorted by the deal for Franklin. That clearly wasn't market value. I agree.
But think about the club he went to...Sydney. A club that he chose as it was consistently a Tier 1 club and had extra money in the salary cap...further entrenching their stint at the top. How many games has Sydney beaten Carlton in in the last 2-3 years largely on the back of Franklin's goal kicking? Why did the AFL give them an allowance to basically keep them at the top?
Re: Franklin trade for Hawthorn.
Tier 1 clubs can afford to lose out on the odd trade, tier 3 clubs cannot. Why? because they are still a destination club - hence why Mitchell basically told the Swans I want to get to Hawthorn. The players clearly have too much power in where they want to end up as it stands.
Tier 3 clubs aren't in the real game, they are sideshows. Tier 3 clubs are perpetually trading for B or C grade players eg Carlton getting that bloke who played reserves at Geelong Lang and Mullett from North. There is no easy fix.
Carlton can't spend up big to get a Kernahan, Bradley and a Motley, Footscray can't spend up big to get a Royal, McGuiness etc and turn around their fortunes quickly. Again, Carlton will go to the draft at the end of the year and sell the "big white hope" on one young 18 year old with no real experience. Contrast to that in the 1980s when Carlton got Kernahan. We knew what we were getting- the best player in the SANFL.
My argument is get rid of the draft. It entrenches inequities, or radically change the draft. Do what the NRL is doing. They have no draft. Try something eg. No recruitment of 18 year olds, give them a year or two in the SANFL, WAFL etc so we have a better read.
3- The O'Meara trade is your 3rd point. I hope they lose out big time on this, so far it is looking good. This is one key way that I can hope Hawthorn will be brought back to the pack. Bad trades - eg the Vickery one. If they start making a few more like this perhaps things will change, but I doubt it. Hawthorn have the resources, they will make the finals again this year, barring injuries. Surprise ! Surprise!