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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 12:45 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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club29 wrote:
Murphy has had an interrupted two years. Shoulder, face, knee and groins. Has had very limited pre season last two seasons. This is why his form is rubbish. He is trying to be a leader and playing on anyway but his body is not letting him. He is best sitting it out and getting set for next year. In 2011 form he can build himself into a good leader but while he is down and out and doubting himself he is no good to at all as a leader.

We know he can play. Lets get him right.

yes but hes no captain....

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 12:54 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 12:18 am
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Location: Melbourne
Synbad wrote:
club29 wrote:
Murphy has had an interrupted two years. Shoulder, face, knee and groins. Has had very limited pre season last two seasons. This is why his form is rubbish. He is trying to be a leader and playing on anyway but his body is not letting him. He is best sitting it out and getting set for next year. In 2011 form he can build himself into a good leader but while he is down and out and doubting himself he is no good to at all as a leader.

We know he can play. Lets get him right.

yes but hes no captain....


But we won't strip him of the captaincy as that would show we made a mistake and Carlton never makes mistakes. Does Murphy chuck it in to concentrate on footy. I think Henderson would make a good captain, not sure who else is good enough or young enough to do it.

Alternitavely Murphy can try and prove us wrong and harden the flower up and play like a leader. That would be my preference as it would solve a problem that we really shouldn't have.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 12:59 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Murphy isnt a hard footballer.
So players from opposition clubs look at captains games and exploit chinks in their armour.
They will continue to breach Murphs weaknesses and exploit him and that sets the tone for the team

Murph is a skilfull player.. he isnt a warrior

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:02 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 18022
Synbad wrote:
club29 wrote:
Murphy has had an interrupted two years. Shoulder, face, knee and groins. Has had very limited pre season last two seasons. This is why his form is rubbish. He is trying to be a leader and playing on anyway but his body is not letting him. He is best sitting it out and getting set for next year. In 2011 form he can build himself into a good leader but while he is down and out and doubting himself he is no good to at all as a leader.

We know he can play. Lets get him right.

yes but hes no captain....


That's why Mick shouldnt have made the decision to make him captain,
The players know their peers better than a new coach coming in.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:05 pm 
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Serge Silvagni

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Firstly we played freemantle. Now a top 4 side and imo will be in the gf.
We matched it with them for 3/4's. The reason we used a lot of handball early on was to try to wear them out whilst maintaining possession. Possibly a recognition by mm that we were not as fit. Something born out in the last quarter.
Mm correctly identified that their gut running was our weakness. Hence he didnt want to play warnock who would decrease our mobility. Imo a strategy would have been to play warnock but use kreuzer as a forward, his marking has recently become much more aggressive, and may have been a real asset. Obviously rowe would not have played
Carrots subbing off hurt us big time. One player down very early on in a match where you are challenged by a fitter side...you do the math. Not to mention that carrots is one of our harder ball winners. A big loss.
I am not a fan of the 3 amigos playing together.it just doesnt work. They lack intensity at the ball when challenged physically, which is every match against the top sides. Trade 2 of the 3.
I thought Watson forward was a coaching move designed to disrupt freeos setup and drilled game plan, by making them second guess their zones. Ditto for Touhy, who kicked some magnificent goals. Bravo mick.

Without doubt we lost it , yet again , through the midfield. I was at a loss from day one as to why murphy was elected captain. Its surely not for his media ability, and his form this year has been patchy at best. Without judd dominating and taking the best tag, he is getting found out big time. Judd has come back to the pack, still very good, but he is stoppable now. Carrazzo injury hurt us.
Clearly our priority should be 2 big bodied midfielders. One free agent will shake loose and come to mick. Use the free amigos to attract a gun midfielder via trade. Then target the best midfielder we can in the draft.

If waite was available i would have played him on the wing. His mobility and marking would have been very handy. I think its time to stop thinking of him as a kpp and use him in a less physically taxing role. Having said that i think he could be like richo, whos body was ok to go longer because of the amount of time out of the game he has had. Another 3-4 years for mine, just not kpp.

Watson stepping up is a big bonus. Yes there are gaps in his game but he is a keeper. However like rowe and casboult before him the opposition will work him out and he will need to work on this. But as a third man up either in defence or attack he should shine.
Mciinnes coming back will help. I am not of the view that laidler is finished. Quality player that needs to get his body right for next year.

For those bagging mm for the result, get a grip. He is smart and working towards a better structure. He is trying players in different positions to see what his options are for next year and the actual trading needs for 2013/14. We are beating the sides that we should beat ( last 3 weeks) and still losing to the top sides.....because that is where we are at , the lower half of the eight. Stop moaning when we get beaten by better sides. Out of our losses for the year i believe only the stkilda and second rd collingwood losses have been unacceptable.
The other 6 losses
Rd1 richmond by 5 points. In hindsight a good result
Rd 2 collingwood by 17 points. Imo acceptable, given the intensity build up etc and the relatively new game plan etc.
Rd 3 cats by 16 points. Expected loss
Rd11 Essendon* by 5 in hindsight a good result
Rd 12 hawks by 15 expected loss
Rd 14 sydney by 22. Expected loss

Perspective please. These are not the results of a team that is that far away.... Calls for a complete rebuild is ridiculous. You have heard mm say it many times , and it frustrates all of us to hear it, but he us right. Forget about the ladder and concentrate on where we are improving. But even mick has his limits, i think he truly thought we were a chance yesterday and was disappointed by the result. From that perspective i rate it as our third worse loss for the year. Behind collingwood and saints. But even then, we were right in it until the last quarter. We needed to build on our mid third quarter lead, instead a combination of bad luck , free kicks and we squandered that lead. That then gave them the momentum and confidence, to reestablish their game plan and it was game over, we had spent our bullets physically and mentally and they took over. But make no mistake freo are a top side, so its no disgrace to lose that way. What it does show is how Important it is for us to find players that will show leadership in those critical game turning moments, players that will drag the yarrans, betts, garletts, lucas's, armfields, back into the game. Murphy, where were you son?

So when trade week comes, i expect malthouse will be looking at players both carltons and other clubs, very differently than will the typical supporter. There will be raised eyebrows, headlines and a lot of teeth gnashing about " the malthouse list cleanout". Imo he will get the results next year that we all crave for. We are not that far away!


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:12 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 12:18 am
Posts: 1321
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padre wrote:
Firstly we played freemantle. Now a top 4 side and imo will be in the gf.
We matched it with them for 3/4's. The reason we used a lot of handball early on was to try to wear them out whilst maintaining possession. Possibly a recognition by mm that we were not as fit. Something born out in the last quarter.
Mm correctly identified that their gut running was our weakness. Hence he didnt want to play warnock who would decrease our mobility. Imo a strategy would have been to play warnock but use kreuzer as a forward, his marking has recently become much more aggressive, and may have been a real asset. Obviously rowe would not have played
Carrots subbing off hurt us big time. One player down very early on in a match where you are challenged by a fitter side...you do the math. Not to mention that carrots is one of our harder ball winners. A big loss.
I am not a fan of the 3 amigos playing together.it just doesnt work. They lack intensity at the ball when challenged physically, which is every match against the top sides. Trade 2 of the 3.
I thought Watson forward was a coaching move designed to disrupt freeos setup and drilled game plan, by making them second guess their zones. Ditto for Touhy, who kicked some magnificent goals. Bravo mick.

Without doubt we lost it , yet again , through the midfield. I was at a loss from day one as to why murphy was elected captain. Its surely not for his media ability, and his form this year has been patchy at best. Without judd dominating and taking the best tag, he is getting found out big time. Judd has come back to the pack, still very good, but he is stoppable now. Carrazzo injury hurt us.
Clearly our priority should be 2 big bodied midfielders. One free agent will shake loose and come to mick. Use the free amigos to attract a gun midfielder via trade. Then target the best midfielder we can in the draft.

If waite was available i would have played him on the wing. His mobility and marking would have been very handy. I think its time to stop thinking of him as a kpp and use him in a less physically taxing role. Having said that i think he could be like richo, whos body was ok to go longer because of the amount of time out of the game he has had. Another 3-4 years for mine, just not kpp.

Watson stepping up is a big bonus. Yes there are gaps in his game but he is a keeper. However like rowe and casboult before him the opposition will work him out and he will need to work on this. But as a third man up either in defence or attack he should shine.
Mciinnes coming back will help. I am not of the view that laidler is finished. Quality player that needs to get his body right for next year.

For those bagging mm for the result, get a grip. He is smart and working towards a better structure. He is trying players in different positions to see what his options are for next year and the actual trading needs for 2013/14. We are beating the sides that we should beat ( last 3 weeks) and still losing to the top sides.....because that is where we are at , the lower half of the eight. Stop moaning when we get beaten by better sides. Out of our losses for the year i believe only the stkilda and second rd collingwood losses have been unacceptable.
The other 6 losses
Rd1 richmond by 5 points. In hindsight a good result
Rd 2 collingwood by 17 points. Imo acceptable, given the intensity build up etc and the relatively new game plan etc.
Rd 3 cats by 16 points. Expected loss
Rd11 Essendon** by 5 in hindsight a good result
Rd 12 hawks by 15 expected loss
Rd 14 sydney by 22. Expected loss

Perspective please. These are not the results of a team that is that far away.... Calls for a complete rebuild is ridiculous. You have heard mm say it many times , and it frustrates all of us to hear it, but he us right. Forget about the ladder and concentrate on where we are improving. But even mick has his limits, i think he truly thought we were a chance yesterday and was disappointed by the result. From that perspective i rate it as our third worse loss for the year. Behind collingwood and saints. But even then, we were right in it until the last quarter. We needed to build on our mid third quarter lead, instead a combination of bad luck , free kicks and we squandered that lead. That then gave them the momentum and confidence, to reestablish their game plan and it was game over, we had spent our bullets physically and mentally and they took over. But make no mistake freo are a top side, so its no disgrace to lose that way. What it does show is how Important it is for us to find players that will show leadership in those critical game turning moments, players that will drag the yarrans, betts, garletts, lucas's, armfields, back into the game. Murphy, where were you son?

So when trade week comes, i expect malthouse will be looking at players both carltons and other clubs, very differently than will the typical supporter. There will be raised eyebrows, headlines and a lot of teeth gnashing about " the malthouse list cleanout". Imo he will get the results next year that we all crave for. We are not that far away!


How is the Essendon* loss a good result, we were 5 goals up, seriously explain how that's a good result?


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:14 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

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Posters can continue to bag the shit out of the players but we've been a top contested footy team for years. Yes we have plenty of deficiencies but the ability of our players to win the hard ball has been better than most.
Its the uncontested possessions where we're being smashed overall. 17th in the AFL. The contested ball reflects your ability to access the ball but the uncontested possessions reflect your ability to maintain possession. Our archaic style of kicking to contests is unsuitable and will never bring us success.

Have a look at the top 7 teams in the AFL for uncontested possessions. Freo, Geelong, Port, Richmond, Hawthorn, Essendon*, Colingwood.
What do they all have in common? Top 8 sides.
The blind ignorance of the majority here slamming our players is pathetic. You can win every hard ball available but if you're coughing it up by kicking to contests, it will eventually wear you down.
You cant expect to retain possession of the ball when half your side is tagging or defending when YOU have possession of the ball.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:17 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
Posts: 3561
bax wrote:
ThePsychologist wrote:
99prelim wrote:

And FFS, can some people stop blaming MM.

His errors this year have been cosmetic (3 rucks, Yarran sub, no Laidler, yada yada) For 2013, I'll cut him some slack and defer to his experience as to why he made those choices.

Our structural problems (and they've been discussed) existed well before MM.


Why does MM escape scrutiny? The St Kilda game was lost due to his dumb selections. What crime has Laidler commited to be overlooked all year where other clubs are now circling to get him? Why haven't 18 more games been put into players like Bell and Casboult who are rough around the edges but are tough and hard and worth persisting with more than Curnow/ Cachia or Rowe.

Why hasn't Graham been promoted?

Walker had his best season as a fowrard and Yarran as a backman, so why turn thier positions around? We play 4 small forwards not 3, people keep forgetting Armfield who for some reason gets a another contract, just as Warnock got a 3 year contract last year.

Why play Simpson back and rob us of his drive forward from centre, why is Gibbs suddenly play back again when he was starting to do well in the midfield?

There's so much I see MM doing wrong and I keep thinking he's trying to do the right thing and harden this team up but at what expense, who appart from Toughy and Henderson have improved this year?

And what of the expected clean out at the end of the year, is he going to move on our talented players and keep the duds with heart? I agree there are at least 10 players that need to be moved on, problem is they may differ from Mighty Mick's, for the sake of our club moving UP the ladder he better bloody well get it right!!



Did you not read my post. All your questions are valid. Only Mick knows the answers. I said that in the scheme of things, they are cosmetic. I also said that for 2013, I'll cut him slack. If you want to burn him at the stake, that's your perogative.

PS. Let's say that Laidler had played more, there were no 3 rucks against St Kilda and that players were played in positions you thought they were better suited for.

And....as a result, we were 11-7 and sitting in 6/7th spot. What would be happening?

We'd all be backslapping each other, excited by the fact that if Ess were penalised, we could even get top 4 this year, and saying that top 4 is ours next year FOR SURE!

Well you know what, just like Warne's diuretic tablet, it would have been a masking agent that covers over all our leadership, list imbalance, list quality, recruiting and list development issues.

We have a seriously sh1t list. IMHO, I'm fine with MM having a look at it first hand for 12 months before making the call at the end of the year.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:26 pm 
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Serge Silvagni

Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 7:56 pm
Posts: 934
bax wrote:
padre wrote:
Firstly we played freemantle. Now a top 4 side and imo will be in the gf.
We matched it with them for 3/4's. The reason we used a lot of handball early on was to try to wear them out whilst maintaining possession. Possibly a recognition by mm that we were not as fit. Something born out in the last quarter.
Mm correctly identified that their gut running was our weakness. Hence he didnt want to play warnock who would decrease our mobility. Imo a strategy would have been to play warnock but use kreuzer as a forward, his marking has recently become much more aggressive, and may have been a real asset. Obviously rowe would not have played
Carrots subbing off hurt us big time. One player down very early on in a match where you are challenged by a fitter side...you do the math. Not to mention that carrots is one of our harder ball winners. A big loss.
I am not a fan of the 3 amigos playing together.it just doesnt work. They lack intensity at the ball when challenged physically, which is every match against the top sides. Trade 2 of the 3.
I thought Watson forward was a coaching move designed to disrupt freeos setup and drilled game plan, by making them second guess their zones. Ditto for Touhy, who kicked some magnificent goals. Bravo mick.

Without doubt we lost it , yet again , through the midfield. I was at a loss from day one as to why murphy was elected captain. Its surely not for his media ability, and his form this year has been patchy at best. Without judd dominating and taking the best tag, he is getting found out big time. Judd has come back to the pack, still very good, but he is stoppable now. Carrazzo injury hurt us.
Clearly our priority should be 2 big bodied midfielders. One free agent will shake loose and come to mick. Use the free amigos to attract a gun midfielder via trade. Then target the best midfielder we can in the draft.

If waite was available i would have played him on the wing. His mobility and marking would have been very handy. I think its time to stop thinking of him as a kpp and use him in a less physically taxing role. Having said that i think he could be like richo, whos body was ok to go longer because of the amount of time out of the game he has had. Another 3-4 years for mine, just not kpp.

Watson stepping up is a big bonus. Yes there are gaps in his game but he is a keeper. However like rowe and casboult before him the opposition will work him out and he will need to work on this. But as a third man up either in defence or attack he should shine.
Mciinnes coming back will help. I am not of the view that laidler is finished. Quality player that needs to get his body right for next year.

For those bagging mm for the result, get a grip. He is smart and working towards a better structure. He is trying players in different positions to see what his options are for next year and the actual trading needs for 2013/14. We are beating the sides that we should beat ( last 3 weeks) and still losing to the top sides.....because that is where we are at , the lower half of the eight. Stop moaning when we get beaten by better sides. Out of our losses for the year i believe only the stkilda and second rd collingwood losses have been unacceptable.
The other 6 losses
Rd1 richmond by 5 points. In hindsight a good result
Rd 2 collingwood by 17 points. Imo acceptable, given the intensity build up etc and the relatively new game plan etc.
Rd 3 cats by 16 points. Expected loss
Rd11 Essendon*** by 5 in hindsight a good result
Rd 12 hawks by 15 expected loss
Rd 14 sydney by 22. Expected loss

Perspective please. These are not the results of a team that is that far away.... Calls for a complete rebuild is ridiculous. You have heard mm say it many times , and it frustrates all of us to hear it, but he us right. Forget about the ladder and concentrate on where we are improving. But even mick has his limits, i think he truly thought we were a chance yesterday and was disappointed by the result. From that perspective i rate it as our third worse loss for the year. Behind collingwood and saints. But even then, we were right in it until the last quarter. We needed to build on our mid third quarter lead, instead a combination of bad luck , free kicks and we squandered that lead. That then gave them the momentum and confidence, to reestablish their game plan and it was game over, we had spent our bullets physically and mentally and they took over. But make no mistake freo are a top side, so its no disgrace to lose that way. What it does show is how Important it is for us to find players that will show leadership in those critical game turning moments, players that will drag the yarrans, betts, garletts, lucas's, armfields, back into the game. Murphy, where were you son?

So when trade week comes, i expect malthouse will be looking at players both carltons and other clubs, very differently than will the typical supporter. There will be raised eyebrows, headlines and a lot of teeth gnashing about " the malthouse list cleanout". Imo he will get the results next year that we all crave for. We are not that far away!


How is the Essendon** loss a good result, we were 5 goals up, seriously explain how that's a good result?

fair enough i understand where you are coming from, but despite our rivalry with them, i think we have to begrudgingly agree that they a very good football side this year. To only lose by 5 to a quality side , to me is an acceptable loss. But yes you have a point, which by the way reinforces the bigger point that i was making, that we are not far away......


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:28 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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Biggest problem we have is our mids... too light, too small, not skilled enough to play high intensity football

This year the 'gameplan' turns 30yo... no longer can we hide our deficiencies behind one man

Curnow, Cachia, Robbo, Ellard etc are plodders at best... Carrots getting on, Brock ok but one paced... Gibbs & Lucas??????????????? others that run though the middle are not genuine midfielders

Our skipper turns into the invisible man when hard tagged

Let's not mention our ruck stocks...

Great @#$%&! recruiting

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:38 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Right about now, I reckon North supporters would be sayin', "How'd we lose to this mob?"

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:39 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 2:15 pm
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Blue Vain wrote:
Posters can continue to bag the shit out of the players but we've been a top contested footy team for years. Yes we have plenty of deficiencies but the ability of our players to win the hard ball has been better than most.
Its the uncontested possessions where we're being smashed overall. 17th in the AFL. The contested ball reflects your ability to access the ball but the uncontested possessions reflect your ability to maintain possession. Our archaic style of kicking to contests is unsuitable and will never bring us success.

Have a look at the top 7 teams in the AFL for uncontested possessions. Freo, Geelong, Port, Richmond, Hawthorn, Essendon**, Colingwood.
What do they all have in common? Top 8 sides.
The blind ignorance of the majority here slamming our players is pathetic. You can win every hard ball available but if you're coughing it up by kicking to contests, it will eventually wear you down.
You cant expect to retain possession of the ball when half your side is tagging or defending when YOU have possession of the ball.



Could it also be the case that our players are not working hard enough to get into space . The run and spread is lacking . I know we kick long to contests which is just plain dumb as the ball is so hard to win why give it back
But do the players work hard enough a fair few turnovers were created last night through kicking to players that were flat footed

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:56 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

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Sydney Blue wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
Posters can continue to bag the shit out of the players but we've been a top contested footy team for years. Yes we have plenty of deficiencies but the ability of our players to win the hard ball has been better than most.
Its the uncontested possessions where we're being smashed overall. 17th in the AFL. The contested ball reflects your ability to access the ball but the uncontested possessions reflect your ability to maintain possession. Our archaic style of kicking to contests is unsuitable and will never bring us success.

Have a look at the top 7 teams in the AFL for uncontested possessions. Freo, Geelong, Port, Richmond, Hawthorn, Essendon***, Colingwood.
What do they all have in common? Top 8 sides.
The blind ignorance of the majority here slamming our players is pathetic. You can win every hard ball available but if you're coughing it up by kicking to contests, it will eventually wear you down.
You cant expect to retain possession of the ball when half your side is tagging or defending when YOU have possession of the ball.



Could it also be the case that our players are not working hard enough to get into space . The run and spread is lacking . I know we kick long to contests which is just plain dumb as the ball is so hard to win why give it back
But do the players work hard enough a fair few turnovers were created last night through kicking to players that were flat footed


Funny that.
We've had a good mix for the past few years. :?

We've been top 4 in the AFL for contested possessions and averaging top 8 for uncontested. A good mix IMO.
Suddenly we're 17th for uncontested. Whats changed other than a new senior coach, an old gameplan and a couple of midfield coaches with zero contemporary AFL experience.

Oh thats right. The players are shit and the club is shit.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 2:13 pm 
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Geoff Southby
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Well despite all of the blood letting I have to say I was super impressed by the Dockers. They could play in the GF; they're that good.... well, they're that 'instructed'... always doing the right thing and never letting our flakey outsiders get a second to breathe in. Very impressed.

I didnt expect us to win and thought it was a fascinating game. I was actually pleased with most of our game given our midfield was destroyed.

The disappointing bit for me was a few times you could see Carlton players hanging back waiting for the easy ball. That just doesn't happen. Also on the rebound we could have a few players out of action (not chasing, wrong wing, not covering space).


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 2:16 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:17 pm
Posts: 2058
molsey wrote:
Well despite all of the blood letting I have to say I was super impressed by the Dockers. They could play in the GF; they're that good.... well, they're that 'instructed'... always doing the right thing and never letting our flakey outsiders get a second to breathe in. Very impressed.

I didnt expect us to win and thought it was a fascinating game. I was actually pleased with most of our game given our midfield was destroyed.

The disappointing bit for me was a few times you could see Carlton players hanging back waiting for the easy ball. That just doesn't happen. Also on the rebound we could have a few players out of action (not chasing, wrong wing, not covering space).


good post

our effort was there

we simply don't have the cattle

people should not delude themselves but this will be close to a full rebuild ie 3-5 years


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 2:20 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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kingkerna wrote:
Lost to a better team, thought we tried our hearts out until the last when we were knackered (Yarran exception) game plan didn't help at all, but gee they were strong, reminded me of the cheats actually.
Use of betts was poor, thought Gibbs was outstanding in his role but the dice had to be rolled and move him into an attacking role.

Bring on next week and the other challenges.


Its always nice when someone can see it for what it is and post without emotion.

I think Betts may have been poor rather than the use of Betts, but otherwise agree with you.

People underestimate how good Freo were last night.

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"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 2:20 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2005 3:08 pm
Posts: 3255
Blue Vain wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
Posters can continue to bag the shit out of the players but we've been a top contested footy team for years. Yes we have plenty of deficiencies but the ability of our players to win the hard ball has been better than most.
Its the uncontested possessions where we're being smashed overall. 17th in the AFL. The contested ball reflects your ability to access the ball but the uncontested possessions reflect your ability to maintain possession. Our archaic style of kicking to contests is unsuitable and will never bring us success.

Have a look at the top 7 teams in the AFL for uncontested possessions. Freo, Geelong, Port, Richmond, Hawthorn, Essendon****, Colingwood.
What do they all have in common? Top 8 sides.
The blind ignorance of the majority here slamming our players is pathetic. You can win every hard ball available but if you're coughing it up by kicking to contests, it will eventually wear you down.
You cant expect to retain possession of the ball when half your side is tagging or defending when YOU have possession of the ball.





Could it also be the case that our players are not working hard enough to get into space . The run and spread is lacking . I know we kick long to contests which is just plain dumb as the ball is so hard to win why give it back
But do the players work hard enough a fair few turnovers were created last night through kicking to players that were flat footed


Funny that.
We've had a good mix for the past few years. :?

We've been top 4 in the AFL for contested possessions and averaging top 8 for uncontested. A good mix IMO.
Suddenly we're 17th for uncontested. Whats changed other than a new senior coach, an old gameplan and a couple of midfield coaches with zero contemporary AFL experience.

Oh thats right. The players are shit and the club is shit.


Thanks BV..
.."your good mix" didnt take us very far either...

.your point only mounts to a case that suggests that despite variations to the game plan our list is not right!


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 2:22 pm 
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Serge Silvagni

Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2012 3:12 pm
Posts: 942
Blue Vain wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
Posters can continue to bag the shit out of the players but we've been a top contested footy team for years. Yes we have plenty of deficiencies but the ability of our players to win the hard ball has been better than most.
Its the uncontested possessions where we're being smashed overall. 17th in the AFL. The contested ball reflects your ability to access the ball but the uncontested possessions reflect your ability to maintain possession. Our archaic style of kicking to contests is unsuitable and will never bring us success.

Have a look at the top 7 teams in the AFL for uncontested possessions. Freo, Geelong, Port, Richmond, Hawthorn, Essendon****, Colingwood.
What do they all have in common? Top 8 sides.
The blind ignorance of the majority here slamming our players is pathetic. You can win every hard ball available but if you're coughing it up by kicking to contests, it will eventually wear you down.
You cant expect to retain possession of the ball when half your side is tagging or defending when YOU have possession of the ball.



Could it also be the case that our players are not working hard enough to get into space . The run and spread is lacking . I know we kick long to contests which is just plain dumb as the ball is so hard to win why give it back
But do the players work hard enough a fair few turnovers were created last night through kicking to players that were flat footed


Funny that.
We've had a good mix for the past few years. :?

We've been top 4 in the AFL for contested possessions and averaging top 8 for uncontested. A good mix IMO.
Suddenly we're 17th for uncontested. Whats changed other than a new senior coach, an old gameplan and a couple of midfield coaches with zero contemporary AFL experience.

Oh thats right. The players are shit and the club is shit.

Oh god what's changed

Judd backwards
Murphy injured and backwards
Carazzo injured and backwards

Our 3 best mids are a shadow of 2011

If ratten coached this year we would be lucky to be 6 wins


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 2:24 pm 
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Serge Silvagni

Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2012 3:12 pm
Posts: 942
Blue Vain wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
Posters can continue to bag the shit out of the players but we've been a top contested footy team for years. Yes we have plenty of deficiencies but the ability of our players to win the hard ball has been better than most.
Its the uncontested possessions where we're being smashed overall. 17th in the AFL. The contested ball reflects your ability to access the ball but the uncontested possessions reflect your ability to maintain possession. Our archaic style of kicking to contests is unsuitable and will never bring us success.

Have a look at the top 7 teams in the AFL for uncontested possessions. Freo, Geelong, Port, Richmond, Hawthorn, Essendon****, Colingwood.
What do they all have in common? Top 8 sides.
The blind ignorance of the majority here slamming our players is pathetic. You can win every hard ball available but if you're coughing it up by kicking to contests, it will eventually wear you down.
You cant expect to retain possession of the ball when half your side is tagging or defending when YOU have possession of the ball.



Could it also be the case that our players are not working hard enough to get into space . The run and spread is lacking . I know we kick long to contests which is just plain dumb as the ball is so hard to win why give it back
But do the players work hard enough a fair few turnovers were created last night through kicking to players that were flat footed


Funny that.
We've had a good mix for the past few years. :?

We've been top 4 in the AFL for contested possessions and averaging top 8 for uncontested. A good mix IMO.
Suddenly we're 17th for uncontested. Whats changed other than a new senior coach, an old gameplan and a couple of midfield coaches with zero contemporary AFL experience.

Oh thats right. The players are shit and the club is shit.

Interesting since mick left collingwood , have they gone fwd or back ?


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 2:25 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 9:27 am
Posts: 28528
Location: Free Beer!!
club29 wrote:
Murphy has had an interrupted two years. Shoulder, face, knee and groins. Has had very limited pre season last two seasons. This is why his form is rubbish. He is trying to be a leader and playing on anyway but his body is not letting him. He is best sitting it out and getting set for next year. In 2011 form he can build himself into a good leader but while he is down and out and doubting himself he is no good to at all as a leader.

We know he can play. Lets get him right.


Great post club.

Some of his efforts are disappointing but he's simply not in a position to be the player and leader we need right now.

There was nothing wrong with his leadership in the 4 rounds Judd missed late last season.

I'm prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt.

_________________
"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010


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