That's funny because 25 minute later Walls was on and suggesting, in reference to Malthouse and his involvement in the Neeld appointment at Melb, the very same thing.

Not that Walls is bitter.

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I hope Essendon* folds.

HTF would Dermie know who the best tactician is.

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"I had to eat"

I want a big scalp, port did it, Brisbane did it, under mickey mouse we haven't

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Between our dreams and actions lies this world

We didn't under Alfred E. Neuman, either, what me worry!!

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

So we've had 'Get Malthouse' and 'Trust Malthouse' threads. Hopefully the next one is 'Hail Malthouse', not 'Sakc Malthouse'.

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"I had to eat"

Yes we did and also some good wins interstate.

The problem was they were inconsistent, extremely infrequent and unreliable.

Hawthorn were the only team we didnt beat under Ratts. Fev hit the post on that one.

I'd say the wins over the Cats were the biggest scalp.

Would be good to get a big scalp this year though. Maybe start with Swans this week.

Our wins against top 4 sides few and far between and rarely (if ever) won 4 games in a row.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

still haven't won 4 in a row, Ratten also had a win against the Swans, good measuring stick for this week.

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Between our dreams and actions lies this world

What you say in your last post is true but not what you said in your post previous to that.

? Borderline trolling.

Sydney are twice the team now that they were in the first half of 2011. They won something like 11 of their first 20. Even Melbourne managed a draw with them.

On the flip side it is as ridiculous as saying we've now made great strides under Malthouse because we managed to beat Port this year, or didn't get monstered by the Crows in Melbourne.

What about the fact we managed to beat West Coast in Perth? You know we "once got within a kick of them in a final 2 years ago", therefore according to some giving us pretty much one hand on the 2013 cup, until apparently Malthouse came along and flowered it all up.

Pro Malthouse posters would be ridiculed for bringing up these examples and rightly so.

Why is everyone obsessed on here with 1 off performances, as guides to where we are/should be at. Get on a Port v Brisbane GF I guess then.

Pass mark for this year. Who cares? Win a final, lose a final? 5th, 9th, 11th, what does any if it mean if you are no better prepared for a flag tilt than you were 12 months earlier, and most importantly playing a brand of football that will stand up to finals pressure against genuine great sides.

Of course I want I want us to finish as high as possible this year, but not at the expense of future development, hence I'll back a selection of Boots over Duigan, Menzel over Ellard, or putting games into Buckley/Graham even if it at the expense of a win or ladder position or 2 in the final wash up. It's not going to cost us a flag.

Past 12 months or so we've had poor player development, a reserves coach walk mid year, our coach and high preformance manager not speaking, poor injury management, our coach and football manager fall out, a dysfunctional board, our head recruiter demoted, some questionable drafting, and ludicrous contract extensions yet some will have believe that its all MM's fault because we are 6-6, and not 12-0.....

.....and perhaps if he had the 2010 version of Chris Judd he might be.

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"They're [REDACTED]'

fair point re Judd, he won it for us that night, just give me results not honourable losses and I'll be happy

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Between our dreams and actions lies this world

ok we will... just for YOU!!!

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

Geez that is a good post. Well done BB74!

Just last week on 360 Alan Richardson said that Judd's game against the Swans was the single most influential effort he has seen from a footballer in his life.

Lets hop Judd does that for us again and MM for the first time.
That would be nice.

We need a scalp!

Beat the Swans and pies in consecutive weeks.
Oops...don't want to get my hopes too high...its the fall...the fall cuts deep.
I'm confident.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

+2

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I hope Essendon* folds.

Great post.
Says it all really

I like Great post. It would be good to have the luxury of encouraging growth and devcelopment of the list than winning a few meaningless games. I expect top 8 finish as a minimum. If not, lets get better post season.

Jobe Waison on OTC tonight said that its the defensive side of their game they're working on: to be the best defensive side.
Goddard brought with him the Ross Lyon philosophy on defense first.

I believe the personnel we see this year will change in a big way next year and in 2015, with a deeper list, many more rotations and pressure for positions and much much better disposal by hand and foot.

Its not about 2013.

We all know that even with Waite in we're lacking a CHF, or CHB to release Hendo forward. And if one gets injured...well we're back to square one. We need Jammo fit for the next 5 years.

My biggest concern is what happens to Carlton post Judd, Scotland, Simpson, Carrazzo and Waite. The answer probably is that we'll have a team better equipped to withstand the pressure of FINALS FOOTY when theyre gone and replaved by more defensive players who we hopefully poached (trade), draft (2 first rounders) and attracted (FA).

We're after a flag. I say judge MM in 2015 not 2013.
We're not that good, and weren't top 4 material and haven't been for the past 10 years....we nearly have been.....but basically we've been average with a close chance to go higher in 2011 but we lost by 5 pts....so we start again and get us better

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

I agree, but crawl before you walk, process whatever you want to call it. Belief, confidence, leadership when the game is on the line, and a couple of better users of the ball might just be the difference when you are so close. It's a fine line.

In politics there always comes a time when the recently elected has to stop blaming the previous Government for it's failings. That will happen with us, but not after 12 weeks and 1 non-active trade period (regardless of whether you are in the 'to busy selling books', or 'hampered by salary restraints' camp).

This will soon become a Malthouse list, and therefore with it comes more accountability. It is rare for an incoming coach to lop heads before even taking the reigns. Most recent example was Buckley having the Pies a year before making hard calls on players such as Wellingham and Dawes.

If you want to pass judgement purely on win/loss it still wouldn't settle these arguments. If we were 12-0 'pro Malthouse' would give all credit to MM, 'pro Ratts' would say that he deserves credit for putting together this group, but cruelled by injuries and robbed of a chance to see it flourish.

0-12 'pro Malthouse' would be saying even the greatest coach couldn't polish a turd. 'pro Ratt's' would obviously laugh at the failings over a washed and over-rated fool, who could only succeed with a perfect list, and the right people around him.

At the moment we are dead in the middle hence the argument remains in a circular holding pattern regardless of whether the thread title is Trust Mick, Sakc Mick, or @#$%&! Mick.

Much was made of our start, and comparison's to Fremantle's 2012 under new Coach Ross Lyon was regularly used by many of why they believed it is no excuse to use 'getting used to a certain style' as a reason for losing due to the fact they were 5-2 after Round 7.

What these posters never mentioned was that Fremantle then went on to lose 5 of their next 6 to be 6-8 at the end of Round 14 which included heavy losses to Hawthorn and West Coast. They then went on to win 9 of there last 10 before losing to Adelaide in the Semi's.

Whether we can do the same is purely guess work, and probably difficult considering our draw. It would be fascinating to know what - if any - was the turning point, or whether it just clicked naturally.

I hope the second half of this year we can use as a launching pad for 2014, but am not going to put a certain ladder position on it, as such conclusions can be misleading ie Essendon* making the 'finals' in 2009 when 8th on points was closer to 12th than it was 7th...

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"They're [REDACTED]'

Nice work instructing players on wet weather tactics at half time

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Between our dreams and actions lies this world