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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:27 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Synbad wrote:
club29 wrote:
None of us really know if he is good as captain or not. Time will tell. I am sure he has some learning to do.

The cats went out of their way to get him the other way. Hunt had a purple patch kicking a great goal from the boundary. Skinning Murph on a turn over and then getting away from the captian.
It was a tactic. Murphy would have got challenged at half time and then responded. That in itself is a good example.
He is an attacking weapon. He will need help defensively from those picked because they have that in their nature. Either that or Murphy responds to a tagger by tagging him back and agreeing to a nil all draw. Not sure we want to see that. I am sure we all want to see murphy shake the tagger and run riot. Unfortunately that means any turn over can go the other way through his player to mess with his head if the oppo are coached right. That is where he needs cover.

Carrazzo did the same thing to Pendlebury last year.

Goals that Murphy's tagger gets should be seen as a team failure not always a Murphy failure.

The cats didn't make ablett captain they made lower middle of the road players captain.
It doesn't need to be your best players anymore.


You'd have to trust MM,s call on this appointment though Synners, MM made it clear that captain appointment wouldn't necessarily have to be your best player but rather your best leader. MM openly stated his selection criteria so you would have to accept that this choice was made by MM and was based on what he considered the best of AVAILABLE choices.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:56 pm 
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formerly cj69

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SydMatt wrote:
I believe these three losses are the best thing that has happened to us in years.

When you look at it through non-blue coloured glasses we haven't done anything for years. We have beaten a tired side in an elimination final. We have won a few big home and away games, but when we have really needed to step up, we haven't even been close. Close losses in Prelims would be close, anything less than that is not close. Who's to blame, not really sure as I am not on the inside. Personally, it doesn't seem to be the drafting, I like a lot of the players (who didn't see that JR would fit in the Pies quite well and I think there is a very good player in Watto) but when compared to other clubs, player development does seem to be really poor.

When Carlton are allowed to attack, we play the best looking football in the league, hands down. That does not win pressure games. I am getting the feeling that MM has come to the realisation that he has more on his plate than what he bargained for, that like the football world (media), and me, he was seduced by our attacking nature.

A lot of what needs to be remedied to be a winning side now, is attitudinal. We do have the players to win. We do have weaknesses, but nothing that can't be negated. There is an obvious bit of play this year that sums up where I think we are at, and what MM has to work on. Against Collingwood, Murph got the ball on the wing and was charging forward. Tom Bell was beside him calling for hands. For Tom to have called for hands he must have looked up and seen the the space in front of them was clear. With that being the case, instead of calling for hands he should have automatically turned around and looked for an opponent coming up from behind to shepherd, meaning Murph had even more space, instead of Murph having to direct him to shepherd. This isn't a look after the captain thing, in the reverse position, Murph should automatically shepherd. This sort of thing does not happen with us. It might be simplistic, but when you see the way that the Hawks worked for each other against the Pies on Sunday, we are a long way off that standard of care for team mates and the jumper. And that is attitudinal, it can be taught. Until it is automatic, we will struggle against the quality sides.

I watched us live most closely back from 99 to 04. When we had a good side in this time, you could tell whether we were going to win or lose in the first 10 minutes by the way we came out tackling and shepherding. Yes it is a different game, time, playing list etc, but that sort of attitude is what is needed. That hard work early will then allow the game to open up to our current strengths, our attack and pace.

To me, MM is the coach to fix it. He has left all other clubs in strong positions. Everything seems to be simpler than the last 6 years and 6 games... No jingo, no speak, just simple honesty. We need the players to fully hop on board.

We can still make the finals and I believe that we will. It is going to take a whole hearted effort and whole lot of reprogramming of the attitude of the list. We have not been far away and could have quite easily been 2w 1l. The fact that we aren't will galvanise MM. You know that he won't give up and will take the players along for the same ride. Those that don't, won't be there next year, quite simply. I'm along for the ride.

Go Blues


Yep :thumbsup:

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:57 pm 
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formerly cj69

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Not concerned about Murphy one bit. He'll be fine

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:58 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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club29 wrote:
None of us really know if he is good as captain or not. Time will tell. I am sure he has some learning to do.

The cats went out of their way to get him the other way. Hunt had a purple patch kicking a great goal from the boundary. Skinning Murph on a turn over and then getting away from the captian.
It was a tactic. Murphy would have got challenged at half time and then responded. That in itself is a good example.
He is an attacking weapon. He will need help defensively from those picked because they have that in their nature. Either that or Murphy responds to a tagger by tagging him back and agreeing to a nil all draw. Not sure we want to see that. I am sure we all want to see murphy shake the tagger and run riot. Unfortunately that means any turn over can go the other way through his player to mess with his head if the oppo are coached right. That is where he needs cover.

Carrazzo did the same thing to Pendlebury last year.

Goals that Murphy's tagger gets should be seen as a team failure not always a Murphy failure.




Excellent points club.
A great ploy by an outstanding playing group and half decent coaching.
We have failed to support our leader in the past and it seems it hasn't changed thus far.
My disappointment in this matter is again with our senior playing group and Malthouse.
It's quite obvious that he has been targeted from the onset of the season. You attack the head and the body will fall.
If Malthouse needs a process he should start with the basics of team ethics and solidarity.
You win as a team and you lose as a team.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:08 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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redback wrote:
club29 wrote:
None of us really know if he is good as captain or not. Time will tell. I am sure he has some learning to do.

The cats went out of their way to get him the other way. Hunt had a purple patch kicking a great goal from the boundary. Skinning Murph on a turn over and then getting away from the captian.
It was a tactic. Murphy would have got challenged at half time and then responded. That in itself is a good example.
He is an attacking weapon. He will need help defensively from those picked because they have that in their nature. Either that or Murphy responds to a tagger by tagging him back and agreeing to a nil all draw. Not sure we want to see that. I am sure we all want to see murphy shake the tagger and run riot. Unfortunately that means any turn over can go the other way through his player to mess with his head if the oppo are coached right. That is where he needs cover.

Carrazzo did the same thing to Pendlebury last year.

Goals that Murphy's tagger gets should be seen as a team failure not always a Murphy failure.




Excellent points club.
A great ploy by an outstanding playing group and half decent coaching.
We have failed to support our leader in the past and it seems it hasn't changed thus far.
My disappointment in this matter is again with our senior playing group and Malthouse.
It's quite obvious that he has been targeted from the onset of the season. You attack the head and the body will fall.
If Malthouse needs a process he should start with the basics of team ethics and solidarity.
You win as a team and you lose as a team.



FMD RB, You'd make a great parliamentary opposition leader. :wink:


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:10 pm 
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formerly BlueRob
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jenx wrote:
DenimUndies wrote:
Big Kahuna Boot wrote:
..apparently GWS were sniffing around Knockers last year, and could be interested again this year.. ..what do they have that we want?, and could be a plausible trade for big Knocks..


Rather trade Hampson

Straight swap warnock for Jaksh.

Heard he wasn't chuffed at going to GWS


Malthouse for Jaksh ... then get Ratten back .... :smoking: :thanks:

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:12 pm 
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formerly BlueRob
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Synbad wrote:
club29 wrote:
DenimUndies wrote:

So in your view CLUB whats an acceptable pass mark for OUR coach ?


You don't want to ask me that DenimUndies. I am irrational when it comes to Malthouse. I still get great enjoyment out of seeing him lose. Unfortunately that comes at cost for me these days.

If he wins everygame for the rest of the season i will still say he cashed in on other peoples hard work and doesn't deserve any accolades and say it was just a case of the stars aligning.

So while he was making prelims and gfs what was it? Four grand finals and a bunch of prelims in a decade you were hating him.... He comes to us you still hate him but you rather enjoyed a coach that we were employing to win us one elim final and mismanage our list ?
You're funny!..... Lol



Yea .. lets not worry too much ... after all he only took 10 years to win his first GF ... and 10 years to win his last.

How does that song go ... RELAX ....

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:23 pm 
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John Nicholls

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:52 am
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Synbad wrote:
club29 wrote:
None of us really know if he is good as captain or not. Time will tell. I am sure he has some learning to do.

The cats went out of their way to get him the other way. Hunt had a purple patch kicking a great goal from the boundary. Skinning Murph on a turn over and then getting away from the captian.
It was a tactic. Murphy would have got challenged at half time and then responded. That in itself is a good example.
He is an attacking weapon. He will need help defensively from those picked because they have that in their nature. Either that or Murphy responds to a tagger by tagging him back and agreeing to a nil all draw. Not sure we want to see that. I am sure we all want to see murphy shake the tagger and run riot. Unfortunately that means any turn over can go the other way through his player to mess with his head if the oppo are coached right. That is where he needs cover.

Carrazzo did the same thing to Pendlebury last year.

Goals that Murphy's tagger gets should be seen as a team failure not always a Murphy failure.

The cats didn't make ablett captain they made lower middle of the road players captain.
It doesn't need to be your best players anymore.


I agree.

I think he will grow into it. Get older , grumpier and a bit nastier. Right now he doesnt appear a great captain to us outsiders.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:29 pm 
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John Nicholls

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Synbad wrote:
club29 wrote:
DenimUndies wrote:

So in your view CLUB whats an acceptable pass mark for OUR coach ?


You don't want to ask me that DenimUndies. I am irrational when it comes to Malthouse. I still get great enjoyment out of seeing him lose. Unfortunately that comes at cost for me these days.

If he wins everygame for the rest of the season i will still say he cashed in on other peoples hard work and doesn't deserve any accolades and say it was just a case of the stars aligning.

So while he was making prelims and gfs what was it? Four grand finals and a bunch of prelims in a decade you were hating him.... He comes to us you still hate him but you rather enjoyed a coach that we were employing to win us one elim final and mismanage our list ?
You're funny!..... Lol


Having it in for the coach makes processing a loss a lot different. Easier infact. Dead simple. Can see why you did it all those years.........all them..... long...... long .....years.


Last edited by club29 on Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:29 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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DenimUndies wrote:
DenimUndies wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
chelodina wrote:
"It's not about win-loss. It's about process."



That would have to be the dumbest most stupid thing I have ever heard anyone say when it comes to sport

Its all about winning you idiot Mathouse - i think his problem and what he should have said was

"This is not about Carlton this is about me "


How does one achieve WINS SB?


SB your being selfishly opportunistic, no matter what the coach does, your gonna focus on ways to facilitate argument/s for your preconceived personal dislike of his selection.



Playing sport any sport is about winning and Carlton more than any other team has not been winning.
This club needs wins and needs them now - membership is suffering fans are falling off.
For this ego maniac to come out and say its not about winning its about process is a joke.
Malthouse was hired and Ratten sacked because they want to win a flag - Process is not going to win you a flag - winning does .
This Malthouse appointment is all about Malthouse its not about the club it is fulfilling his ego . All of a sudden we have supporters saying that the group of players we have is not good enough - bollox
He has brought a crappy out dated game plan and its not working . I don't want to see another pig headed old man drag the club through the depths of dispair and turning over the list just because his ideas are not working ala Pagan . The level of commitment and effort put in by the playing group over the first 3 rounds should have brought about 3 wins . It was the way they went about it following the game plan that ended up in losses .
I hope this bloke has more sense than that other oldman we hired a few years back

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:36 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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club29 wrote:
Synbad wrote:
club29 wrote:
DenimUndies wrote:

So in your view CLUB whats an acceptable pass mark for OUR coach ?


You don't want to ask me that DenimUndies. I am irrational when it comes to Malthouse. I still get great enjoyment out of seeing him lose. Unfortunately that comes at cost for me these days.

If he wins everygame for the rest of the season i will still say he cashed in on other peoples hard work and doesn't deserve any accolades and say it was just a case of the stars aligning.

So while he was making prelims and gfs what was it? Four grand finals and a bunch of prelims in a decade you were hating him.... He comes to us you still hate him but you rather enjoyed a coach that we were employing to win us one elim final and mismanage our list ?
You're funny!..... Lol


Having it in for the coach makes processing a loss a lot different. Easier infact. Dead simple. Can see why you did it all those years.........all them..... long...... long .....years.

Exactly. I can't believe I was doing it the other way for so long. The best bit is that orthodox easter comes around about the time we are playing Melbourne.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:36 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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I took it as meaning in the short term we are not going to live & die by the immediate W-L ratio, & that the bigger picture was about being in the finals after R22. For that we need to get the process right.

I’ve stated I’m not overly happy with the Malthouse appointment but I don’t think this is really worth jumping up & down about. I watched the interview. One thing I will say for him is I feel a lot more assured by his press conferences than I did Ratten’s

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:37 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Bleep


Last edited by DenimUndies on Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:06 pm 
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formerly King Kenny
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DenimUndies wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
chelodina wrote:
"It's not about win-loss. It's about process."



That would have to be the dumbest most stupid thing I have ever heard anyone say when it comes to sport

Its all about winning you idiot Mathouse - i think his problem and what he should have said was

"This is not about Carlton this is about me "


How does one achieve WINS SB?


Use DNS, WINS is long past it.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:07 pm 
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Serge Silvagni

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In mick we trust


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:18 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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King Kenny wrote:
DenimUndies wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
chelodina wrote:
"It's not about win-loss. It's about process."



That would have to be the dumbest most stupid thing I have ever heard anyone say when it comes to sport

Its all about winning you idiot Mathouse - i think his problem and what he should have said was

"This is not about Carlton this is about me "


How does one achieve WINS SB?


Use DNS, WINS is long past it.


As in IT KK?


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:23 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Synbad wrote:
club29 wrote:
DenimUndies wrote:

So in your view CLUB whats an acceptable pass mark for OUR coach ?


You don't want to ask me that DenimUndies. I am irrational when it comes to Malthouse. I still get great enjoyment out of seeing him lose. Unfortunately that comes at cost for me these days.

If he wins everygame for the rest of the season i will still say he cashed in on other peoples hard work and doesn't deserve any accolades and say it was just a case of the stars aligning.

So while he was making prelims and gfs what was it? Four grand finals and a bunch of prelims in a decade you were hating him.... He comes to us you still hate him but you rather enjoyed a coach that we were employing to win us one elim final and mismanage our list ?
You're funny!..... Lol



"It's not about <making prelims and grand finals>. It's about process."


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:25 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Hi

Does anyone know when we should expect Mick's 5-year plan?


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:27 pm 
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formerly BlueRob
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chelodina wrote:
Hi

Does anyone know when we should expect Mick's 5-year plan?


Na ... MM only does 10 year plans ... :mad:

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:32 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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While we're at it, WHEN THE HELL DO WE GET SMORGYLAND????

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