Blue Sombrero wrote:
OK, I'll bite.
Dawes. 193 cm 105 kg. Power fwd who also rucks when needed. Uses body strength on the contest not that quick. Kick and mark player.
Walker 190cm 89 kg. Genuine midsize forward with pace and a big leap. Crumber. Can play midfield as a run and carry player.
Chalk and Cheese.
Dawes is a tall forward. Hence Collingwood is going in with two rucks and two tall forwards.
Hawthorn: Two rucks and two tall forwards. McAuley and Hale and Franklin and Roughead. Hale rests at FF and Roughy is permanent FP
Richmond: Rucks: Maric, Vickery, Tall forwards, Miller & Reiwoldt.
WCE: Rucks: Natanui, Cox, Tall forwards, Kennedy, Lynch.
Cats: Rucks: West, Orrenson, Tall Forwards, Pods, Hawkins.
We could use Warnock and Kreuzer rucking and Hampson and Waite as tall forwards in the same manner. Collingwood's experiment with using one ruck and Brown is dead and buried. They have to go with the trend (as they have this week) or die wondering. We should do the same as soon as Warnock is available.
Get the idea of Hampson being a ruckman out of your mind for this exercise. Just consider him as a tall forward, which is my argument here and on the Talking Hampson thread. I am NOT suggesting we play three rucks so PLEASE stop saying I want to play three ruckmen. We can and should beat Collingwood tonight because we have better recent form and our tails are up. That doesn't mean we can't try two rucks and two tall forwards if they lose and try it. Nor does it mean that because we win tonight that we don't need to be at the forefront of the changes that are coming to the game as surely as night follows day. Tonight, Hampson and Kreuzer will share the ruck duties because they have to. They provide us with height up front. They are both mobile. Thornton has been dropped for team balance. he is the same height at Bower but not as mobile. Horses for courses. He may play again when a player of his style is needed against a specific opposition. I agree with Russell's omission. He just hasn't been up to it so far but he isn't far off.
Should be a great game and great atmosphere. I'd love to be there. Please show Eddie's face when the game is lost. It's always a highlight of Carlton v Collingwood.
I disagree about walker and dawes. They play the same role for their team (except this year when Dawes has taken leigh browns role of forward who plays second ruck. he has been poor at this).
They both play second forward only walker is better. Compare the two's stats for contested marks, amount of times they are first targets, the amount of times they are outmarked and almost most important the amount of times the ball is swept away when they are targeted. Walker wins hands down and can also help out with the rotations through the midfield late in quarters which gives us the ability to hold our press intensity for longer and see out games.
The Collingwood line up you suggest proves your point is no different to the one they have used for the past few years structure wise with Wood replacing leigh Brown. I dont see how you could try and be smug about that proving your point because it doesnt. Throwing names of blokes who have played ruck once or twice like dawes and roughead in as ruckman to prove your point is also as silly as someone calling Thornton a ruck.
I do agree with you that all our three ruck talls can play in the one team but one will have to replace either Waite or Walker as a forward in my opinion. I cant see adding an extra super tall at the expense of a running player helping our team at all. It may work and i will be wrong. I am sure i will live but my main problem is with your suggestions that collingwood are doing it already and so are hawthorn which is not the case.
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