Realistically, who should we get as new coaches?

AIRCAV · **Posted:** Wed Jul 21, 2010 4:28 pm

Malthouse - he'll do me. As much as I hate him at times, he has taken a list that barely boasts a single All Australian and has consistently over delivered.

But for the cheating AFL, he would have won a flag

DocSherrin III · **Joined:** Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:09 pm **Posts:** 17216

AIRCAV wrote:

But for the cheating AFL, he would have won a flag

?? Not referring to the Anthony Rocca point that was definitely a point are you?

moshe25 · **Joined:** Wed May 11, 2005 1:23 am **Posts:** 11671

jimmae wrote:

.......Brett Kirk - Really not sold on him as a person.........

Any particular reason? Strikes me that he's one of the real Class A citizens of the AFL. Tough, intelligent, got the most out of his limited ability, awesome leader, loyal as the day is long, keeps a low profile.......

Is there something we don't know about that you do?

jimmae · **Posted:** Wed Jul 21, 2010 4:47 pm

moshe25 wrote:

jimmae wrote:

.......Brett Kirk - Really not sold on him as a person.........

Any particular reason? Strikes me that he's one of the real Class A citizens of the AFL. Tough, intelligent, got the most out of his limited ability, awesome leader, loyal as the day is long, keeps a low profile.......

Is there something we don't know about that you do?

No, and I'm aware that everyone trots that out when his name is mentioned. I also pay good attention to the way he carries himself at times on-field, and stories I've heard about some of his antics off-field. Call it a hunch.

AIRCAV · **Posted:** Wed Jul 21, 2010 4:59 pm

Dr.SHERRIN wrote:

AIRCAV wrote:

But for the cheating AFL, he would have won a flag

?? Not referring to the Anthony Rocca point that was definitely a point are you?

Nope, I'm referring to the cheat of $800k on the salary cap which was probably worth 5 key players.

As funny as many find it because it happended to the pies, t could happen to us one day against a GWS or GC17 that we play against a team that is 'cheating' the salary cap more than we ever did, all with the AFL's blessing.

cimm1979 · **Posted:** Wed Jul 21, 2010 5:36 pm

moshe25 wrote:

jimmae wrote:

.......Brett Kirk - Really not sold on him as a person.........

Any particular reason? Strikes me that he's one of the real Class A citizens of the AFL. Tough, intelligent, got the most out of his limited ability, awesome leader, loyal as the day is long, keeps a low profile.......

Is there something we don't know about that you do?

I thought I read somewhere he's off to sit atop some mountain and eat mushrooms. Didn't think he was interested in footy coaching.

chubbyruss · **Joined:** Tue Sep 05, 2006 8:59 am **Posts:** 8631

Kirk will probly require neck surgery for ducking his head all of his career

club29 · **Posted:** Wed Jul 21, 2010 6:52 pm

AIRCAV wrote:

Dr.SHERRIN wrote:

AIRCAV wrote:

But for the cheating AFL, he would have won a flag

?? Not referring to the Anthony Rocca point that was definitely a point are you?

Nope, I'm referring to the cheat of $800k on the salary cap which was probably worth 5 key players.

As funny as many find it because it happended to the pies, t could happen to us one day against a GWS or GC17 that we play against a team that is 'cheating' the salary cap more than we ever did, all with the AFL's blessing.

I am sure the footy show paying collingwoods wages through the early 2000's and soft draw after soft draw and the best resources any club has ever had balance out the extra cash the brisbane got to convince players to stay in Bris.

Should get a flag this year though.

Sanderson sounds good to me.

blue4 · **Joined:** Thu Oct 18, 2007 8:04 pm **Posts:** 976

Get Mark Ricciouto as an assiatnt and groom him for head coach.

With his Italian heritage he will fit right in Lygon street,

club29 · **Posted:** Wed Jul 21, 2010 7:26 pm

blue4 wrote:

Get Mark Ricciouto as an assiatnt and groom him for head coach.

With his Italian heritage he will fit right in Lygon street,

Not sure he is the bloke we want. Ask people who live in adelaide about him.

blue4 · **Joined:** Thu Oct 18, 2007 8:04 pm **Posts:** 976

Very cryptic....

Ine thing you can be guaranteed with the Roo - he wears his heart on his sleeve...he wont use stats to make excuses.

Warby · **Posted:** Wed Jul 21, 2010 7:35 pm

I've heard good things about another Geelong Asst. Coach......Brendan McCartney.

camel · **Posted:** Wed Jul 21, 2010 9:10 pm

Dr.SHERRIN wrote:

camelboy wrote:

Dr.SHERRIN wrote:

...I'd be very surprised if he ever has a coaching role at Carlton...

Do you mean under the current regime, or ever?

Oh not in short-term for sure. There'd have to be one or two people leave Carlton before SOS went back. He was pretty hurt about things that were written about him back in the dark days and also the fact that when he left the Carlton board in '03 and told the club he wanted to be an assistant coach, they were very adamant that there was no role for him at the place when in actual fact, there probably was.

Then after he left and had nothing to do with Carlton he told Channel 10 he wouldn't call Carlton games which a few people thought was a bit silly...then Kernahan launched Elliot's book which didn't have very nice things to say about SOS and seeing as Sticks and JE still have a good friendship...both of those men would have to make way completely for SOS to return in any working capacity.

Sounds like high school doesn't it?

Yeah, that's what I thought you had in mind.

Ciccio · **Posted:** Wed Jul 21, 2010 11:12 pm

love the thread but agree like most posters I would not have a clue about who is really a good assistant - not close enough but will not stop me from trying

if I was Ratts I would
a) invite someone/s that I respected for their knowledge of the modern game and get them to do an appraisal of the game plan, coaching panel, football structure etc. I would target someone who emulates the style of game that I would like. Paul Roos may not be willing to coach again, but I would not hesitate in asking him to complete a full review. The swans may not represent the style that Ratts wants so Roos may not be the right person, but you get my drift. Geelongs style may be closer to what to Ratts wants so perhaps Tom Harley is more appropriate.
b) with the finding of the review above and with his own thoughts sit with Steven Icke at the end of yr and identify the area most in need of attention and target an assistant that can potentially address that area. Ross Lyon acknowledged his offensive game plan was not good enough, targetted the best offensive team Geelong and recruited Leigh Tudor. Their scoring output improved dramatically.

Now for the fun part - where I pick names

Matty Lloyd. Not the first time I have mentioned his name I think he would be super. I think his one year in the media will make him even more valuable because he will have watched a lot of games and it is now his job to analyse teams and comment on their style strengths, weakness etc. I would target him aggressively but I am not sure he will leave luxury of the media

Chris Bond. Not entirely sure why but I have a good feeling he would be a great acquisition. He has been in the system a while and would bring a lot of experience. He was rejected for the top job so not sure he would come anyway.

Choco Williams - this guy can coach, despite his recent record. May not handle being an assistant and is probably in need of a break but I would at least have a conversation with him

Simon Goodwin. Worth an interview and will at least bring the zoning methodology Adelaide excel at with him.

get rid of the hacks · **Joined:** Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:53 am **Posts:** 1194

dannyboy wrote:

by that criteria GROTH
the forum may as well be deleted into the ether now.

It's nothing like other issues

99% of posters have never seen the prospective coaches in action as coaches or heard anything re thier ideas/philosophies about coaching.
This list list may be missing 19 out of the 20 best candidates in each field and we wouldn't even realise.

We can discuss players, recruits and other aspects of footy and things blue, which we have some exposure to, and knowledge of, but this topic has nearly every body on here with so little knowledge it's not worthwhile, bar a handful of posters at absolute best.

I mean whats the point of discussing Tredrea as a potential coach if you have had absolutely zero exposure to him.

Then their is the whole side of personal dynamics where we are also in the dark.

I read cries for SOS to come back as a defensive coach, but SOS put his hand up for the main job at the time Ratts was appointed, so there may be personal issues we know little about with him.

Not many will be able to contribute significant insights here.

And I have avoided the sack Ratts thread bcoz although our game plans are failing, our list is still both mid range and immature, and I know jack $hit re how each individual coach is performing.

I have only really commented on Teague who I have heard at numerous 1/4 & 3/4 time addresses. That part of his coaching doesn't impress me but even that is only a small glimpse into his coaching world.

get rid of the hacks · **Joined:** Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:53 am **Posts:** 1194

Cazzesman wrote:

get rid of the hacks wrote:

I don't really get this whole thread.

You wanna pick a coach on a footy forum with a whole bunch of very poorly informed ppl on the subject (no disrespect to any1)

Why make a list of candidates you have never spoken with or have any knowledge re their coaching capacity at all ?

Whats the point on speculating about ppls skill sets when you are completely in the dark.

Some guys you propose you would have had no exposure to, and others u may have seen only in the media.

Stick to fighting crime in undies and a cape Batman.

Hack I'm impressed with your reply.
:thumbsup:

Regards Cazzesman

Just thought I'd save you the effort and spare you from being called a "know it all" by some banana.

17th Premiership · **Joined:** Fri Dec 15, 2006 8:22 am **Posts:** 2754

I agree that a change or two of our assistants could be the first port of call, and i expect will be mandatory if ratten stays.
i also agree that i know nothing about this but from my v distant impressions. i would be interested in sanderson if he is available as an assistant. he could also be someone who could step up after 2011 if required... but have not included him below based on likelihood that he joins port.
i am looking more from the perspective of who we should look at moving on.
for starters, i feel good about montgomery. was a bit suspect about riley but then he goes and wins some award for best assistant coach, so i guess that means that those who DO know something rate him...

the ones that look particularly vulnerable to me are teague & lappin. i would look for a strong forward or midfielder, who played or coached in a successful team. matthew lloyd could be good here. midfielder could be good b/c much of it is about how the ball comes in from the midfield nd what the midfield expect to see when they look up... eg. buckley at colligwood seems to be doing ok.
for the bullants, we really need someone who is expert at developing players. a good man manager. not someone who is simply labelled a 'development coach'. matty lloyd's brother, simon, sounds good here. but probably not if we go with matty above.

i like having harvey around b/c it really upsets saints fans but I am 50/50 about him. goodwin could be good here. nigel lappin would be better. Maybe move Harevy into Teague's role and bring n.lappin in to replace harvey...

i am happy to keep bradley (& use williams more) in part time midfield roles - more about individual play & tactics rather than team strategy.

Also, I would see if there's some room for Harley, as part of the reshuffle.

so:

Out: M.Lappin, Teague, Harvey
In: From... N. Lappin, S.Lloyd, M.Lloyd, Harley

Don't think everyone needs to change. 2 or 3 could make a huge difference.

Blue Vain · **Joined:** Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am **Posts:** 18005

Happy to offer a few suggestions and yes, I've seen these people coach and have heard their thoughts/philosophies on football.

Ratten.
Fantastic development coach IMO. Has a great understanding of game sense training and set plays. To be blunt and I know I'll cop criticism for this, I suspect he may be out of his depth and lacks sophistication and the intelligence required. Some people have exceptional skills in some areas but that doesn't make them great at all aspects of a nominated role. I believe Ratts would be a great acquisition as a development/assistant coach but his media and match day skills are under real question.

Mark Neeld.
Smart bloke, lateral thinker and plenty of development experience. A real candidate to step up into a senior role.

Sanderson.
Has the smarts that Ratts lacks IMO and really impresses me with his communication skills. Another excellent candidate for the senior job.

Broadbridge.
Absolutely impressed by this guy. He'll never be a senior coach as he's too quirky and thinks too much outside the box too often. But he sees the game and understands the nuances of it as well as anyone. A brilliant foil for someone like Neeld or Sanderson and would offer thoughts on the game that they would never see without his input. A brilliant assistant to any panel IMO.

Mark Riley.

I'd keep him. Rate him as a coach of young men. Excellent record as a coach of young men and a great personality to have involved in a coaching group.

Shane Watson.
Impressed with his abilities as a coach of young people and his views on the game. Would make a good forward coach IMO.

Warby · **Posted:** Thu Jul 22, 2010 11:58 am

What a shame Denis Pagan's unavailable.......Premiership Coach......we couldn't go wrong could we?............ :razz:

walkers a gun · **Joined:** Fri Sep 14, 2007 12:35 pm **Posts:** 167

gbatman wrote:

With all the talk on this board and other Carlton forum boards about sacking Ratten and cleaning out the assistant coaches I have come to wonder a few things.

Who would you get as head coach of Carlton? What senior coaches are coming out of contract or are not coaching that would fit us? What highly qualified assistant coaches are there at other clubs?

What about our assistants? What retired/retiring players should we be trying to get?

I think when we got Ratts we ticked a lot of boxes. Premiership player, Onfield leader, tough player, good player, best and fairest winner and from a successful club and played during a successful era.

I think where we really went wrong was with our assistants. Lappin, Bradley and Teague are all exCarlton players. Montgomery, Riley, Harvey, Harris, and Capuano don't all tick a great deal of boxes either.
We lack diversity in our assistant coaching panel. Too many exCarlton players, Ratts should be the only one. Also there are too many players from clubs who didn't have a great era and win premierships and never got to see what it takes so to speak.
The role of assistant coaches is to bring different things to the table, to have the ability to see things others don't, to specialise in all areas of the game. We need to source assistants from as many differnet clubs as possible who have had success. We also need a good player who has played the game as a key position player in a coaching role. Some one who thinks like a tall who might have ideas to help develop our talls and open the forward line up and structure it better. We need people who can bring a new attitude, game plan, structure and disciplines to Carlton. A new way of doing things.

These are a few options for 2011 that I have come up with. What's your wish list?

Senior Coach candidates:

Brett Ratten - might get going, might not be him, might be the players not being able to follow his instruction or just not having a go, who knows.

Peter Dean - Not getting away from the exCarlton players but was a good successful player who has been around other clubs (Bushrangers/Western Bulldogs IIRC) for a while and coached well, could be worth a shot.

Mick Malthouse - Premiership coach and has proven he can get 100% out of his players by taking average Collingwood lists far into finals and has won WCE to premierships. Isn't he coming out of contract?

Nigel Lappin - Assistant coach of Geelong and dule premiership player for the Lions and a very good player himself.

Chris Scott - Dule Brisbane premiership player and assistant coach at Fremantle.

Forward Coach Options:

Matthew Lloyd - All time great forward who was a tough and talented KPP. With all the ExEssendon players of his era doing well in coaching roles at the moment he could be well worth a shot. He's a great fit for our club with all our young talls around.

Warren Treadrea - All Time great CHF and premiership player for Port Adelaide. Also a good fit for Carlton perhaps.

Alastair Lynch - Dule premiership defender for Brisbane. Also has expierence as a defender.

Scott Lucas - Essendon* premiership CHF. Fairly smart player.

Backline Coach Options:

Tom Harley - Dule Geelong premiership captain and dule premiership player. Expierence as a tall defender.

Leo Barry - Sydney Premiership full back.

SOS - Legendary dule Carlton defenderand full back of the century who has been at St Kilda for a number of years and have the best rated defence in the AFL. If Ratts goes he'd be perfect as assistant coach. Expierence as a tall forward.

Glenn Archer - Might work out well. Might command respect as a coach as he did on the field.

Midfield Coach Options:

Brett Kirk - Sydney premiership centerman known for his tough approach to the game.

Josh Carr - not the most glorified player but a premiership centerman for Port Adelaide who also played at Fremantle.

Tyson Edwards - Premiership player for Adelaide and star of the game.

Skills Coach:

Stewart Dew - Very Skillful and tough player who played in premierships with Hawthorn and Port Adelaide.

Have I missed any one?

I almost fell off my chair reading this. Most of ur suggestions are unproven and thats our big problem at the moment.

Tyson edwards, Josh carr, Brett Kirk, Glenn Archer, Leo Barry, Tom Harley, Scott Lucas, Warren tredrea, Matthew Lloyd are all massive gambles and without a malthouse or roos at the helm these guys will give us nothing.

Look at our coaches box at the moment... who do u think could walk into any other club and get a job??? I SAY NONE OF THEM.

Realistically, who should we get as new coaches?

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