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Pago Pago Then and Now!
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Author:  BrizzyBlue [ Mon Jan 16, 2006 4:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Pago Pago Then and Now!
Players Pre - Pago Pago who have been Traded, Retired, or De-listed since he arrived.

Matthew Allan
Callan Beasy
Simon Beaumont
Craig Bradley
Blake Campbell
Scott Camporeale
Ang Christou
Sam Cranage
Andrew Eccles
Simon Fletcher
Anthony Franchina
Scott Freeborn
David Gallagher
Adrian Hickmott
Trent Hotton
Darren Hulme
Michael Mansfield
Glenn Manton
Adam Mathews
Jonathon McCormick
Andrew McKay
Corey McKernan
Andrew Merrington
Justin Murphy
Adam Pickering
Jim Plunkett
Brett Ratten
Lindsay Smith

I believe I have worked out most of them, but left Rookies and bit players out who didn’t really play a part.

Players Pre - Pago Pago who remain on 2006 List.

Justin Davies
Brendan Fevola
Ryan Houlihan
Anthony Koutoufides
Matthew Lappin
Luke Livingston
Ian Prendergast
Trent Sporn
Bret Thornton
Jarrad Waite
Lance Whitnall
Simon Wiggins
12

Players Post – Pago Pago who remain on 2006 List acquired by Trades, National, Pre-Season or Rookie Drafts.

Jordan Bannister
Daniel Batson ®
Adam Bentick
Eddie Betts
Luke Blackwell
Paul Bower
Chris Bryan
Andrew Carrazzo
Callum
Chambers
Adrian Deluca
Jake Edwards
Brad Fisher
Craig Flint ®
Barnaby French
Adam Hartlett
Ryan Jackson®
Josh Kennedy
Troy Longmuir
Cory McGrath
Dylan McLaren
Marc Murphy
Aisake O’hAilpin ®
Setanta O’hAilpin
Anthony Raso
Jordan Russell
Jason Saddington
Heath Scotland
Kade Simpson
Jesse D Smith ®
Nick Stevens
David Teague
Andrew Walker
32

Comparison of Despatches to Acquisitions: W = Win, F = Future, L = Loss & E = Even.

Matthew Allan : Barnaby French - W
Callan Beasy : Setanta O’hAilpin - W
Simon Beaumont : Adam Hartlett - W
Craig Bradley : Nick Stevens - L
Blake Campbell : Luke Blackwell - W
Scott Camporeale : Kade Simpson - W
Ang Christou : Paul Bower - W
Sam Cranage : Callum Chambers – E
Andrew Eccles : Cory McGrath - W
Simon Fletcher : Josh Kennedy - W
Anthony Franchina : Jordan Bannister - L
Scott Freeborn : Eddie Betts - W
David Gallagher : Troy Longmuir - W
Adrian Hickmott : Brad Fisher - W
Trent Hotton : Chris Bryan - W
Darren Hulme : Marc Murphy - W
Michael Mansfield : Jordan Russell - W
Glenn Manton : Jason Saddington - W
Adam Mathews : Jake Edwards - W
Jonathon McCormick : Heath Scotland - W
Andrew McKay : David Teague - L
Corey McKernan : Dylan McLaren - W
Andrew Merrington : Aisake O’hAilpin ® - W
Justin Murphy : Andrew Walker - W
Adam Pickering : Adrian Deluca - W
Jim Plunkett : Andrew Carrazzo - W
Brett Ratten : Adam Bentick - F
Lindsay Smith : Anthony Raso - W

As you can see, I have rated Braddles as almost irreplaceable however Stevo has it all in front of him. Franga was the consummate tagger. Nobody on our list comes close except an emerging 1AW, but he will be an attacking weapon from here on in, I’m sure. How do you replace Macka? You can’t because he played tall, backed his judgement and was as tough as old boots. I don’t see anybody emerging that fits that mould.
The rest of the list were really difficult to match up and as you can see they don’t compare perfectly, however it should give an indication of the overall improvement to our list since Pago Pago arrived. Keep in mind I am trying to rate players on their potential and opposing them to the despatches value at the time of leaving. EG: Kade Simpson already was more value to the team than Campo last year, but Paul Bower is taken purely on trust that he will be better than an injury riddled Ang when he went.

Of the remaining 12 that were inherited, I believe these 7 players are the same or slightly lower in value to the list: :(

Anthony Koutoufides
Matthew Lappin
Luke Livingston
Ian Prendergast
Trent Sporn
Lance Whitnall
Simon Wiggins

These 5 have improved since the arrival, but fitness, commitment and attitude remain a worry for a couple of them: :?

Justin Davies
Brendan Fevola
Ryan Houlihan
Bret Thornton
Jarrad Waite

The way I see our 2006 List is it has been vastly improved overall. What say you? 8)
Author:  AGRO [ Mon Jan 16, 2006 8:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pago Pago Then and Now!
BrizzyBlue wrote:
Sam Cranage : Callum Chambers – E



If Callum Chambers only decent game for us is the 2005 Wizard Cup Grand Final we are absolutely 100 gazillion light years ahead with him on our list rather than Sam Cranage. :roll:


I once recall in a player profile Sam said he needed to improve in 3 key areas "Pace, Strength and Skills" - no worries Sam. :roll:
Author:  bosman [ Mon Jan 16, 2006 8:40 pm ]
Post subject: 
Where's Lawrence Angwin and Karl Norman....Better look under section E, nope not there...
Author:  grrofunger [ Mon Jan 16, 2006 8:42 pm ]
Post subject: 
They aint there because they took the E :oops:
Author:  thegezman [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 9:33 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Simon Beaumont : Adam Hartlett - W
hows that w win. Beaymont was more than serviceable, except for the 'strike'. harlo has done nothing of not yet, so you'd have to say a F



Quote:
Blake Campbell : Luke Blackwell - W
E or F whats blackers done yet?


Quote:
Scott Camporeale : Kade Simpson - W
F, unless you consider the fatc that campo is gone as a win

Quote:
Ang Christou : Paul Bower - W


thats just laughable. if bower turns out as good as ang i'll be mighty pleased.

Quote:
Adrian Hickmott : Brad Fisher - W
you're selling hicky short there. I'd put this a s F, but fisher is heading in the right direction.

Quote:
Trent Hotton : Chris Bryan - W
Hotts had three years where he was more than servicable, bryan still behind here.

Quote:
Michael Mansfield : Jordan Russell - W
Glenn Manton : Jason Saddington - W
Adam Mathews : Jake Edwards - W
all of these would have to be F or E at this point

Quote:
Lindsay Smith : Anthony Raso - W

Evens
Author:  Dukes [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 10:25 am ]
Post subject: 
I think the comparison is the players we have on the list versus what they could be giving us now. If so, the ratings are valid. It's whether the newbies on the list can deliver a similar output to the likes of Beaumont, Manton, Campo, McKay and even Franga that will determine whether we rise up the ladder. A look at those names just proves how many sh!t players have passed through the club over the last 5 years.

Not many on the deaprted list have hurt us ... except for the champions who retired of course - bit it's hardly the coach's fault that he arrives when McKay, Bradley and Ratten are on their last legs.
Author:  BrizzyBlue [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:23 am ]
Post subject: 
Dukes wrote:
I think the comparison is the players we have on the list versus what they could be giving us now. If so, the ratings are valid. It's whether the newbies on the list can deliver a similar output to the likes of Beaumont, Manton, Campo, McKay and even Franga that will determine whether we rise up the ladder. A look at those names just proves how many sh!t players have passed through the club over the last 5 years.

Not many on the deaprted list have hurt us ... except for the champions who retired of course - bit it's hardly the coach's fault that he arrives when McKay, Bradley and Ratten are on their last legs.


Ah, someone who actually read the post. Whilst I may have a current player who is yet to debut, but has shown top form in minor comps (TAC, WAFL, SANFL, VFL etc.) as a W or an F, it is comparing their value to a previous player at the time the previous player was despatched.

Quote: "Keep in mind I am trying to rate players on their potential and opposing them to the despatches value at the time of leaving. EG: Kade Simpson already was more value to the team than Campo last year, but Paul Bower is taken purely on trust that he will be better than an injury riddled Ang when he went". :roll:
Author:  TheGame [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:28 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Kade Simpson already was more value to the team than Campo last year


No sorry that's rubbish.

http://www.footywire.com/fw/web/ft_play ... 6&pid2=300
Author:  thehalford [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:31 am ]
Post subject: 
Stats never tell the full story. I reckon Kade had more impact in the last few games than Campo did all season. The only bit Sc*nt did better than Kade in was disposals.

Put it this way - given the choice between Campo and Kade to be on our list - based purely off 2005 performance, I'd choose Kade due to impact, not volume of touches that go nowhere.
Author:  The Tyrant [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:33 am ]
Post subject: 
I liked Beasy
Author:  TheGame [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:34 am ]
Post subject: 
We'll see how Simpson goes when he starts getting tagged. Campo is tagged every minute he is on the field.
Author:  TheGame [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:35 am ]
Post subject: 
The Tyrant wrote:
I liked Beasy


So did I. Never given a fair go IMO.
Author:  The Tyrant [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:37 am ]
Post subject: 
TheGame wrote:
The Tyrant wrote:
I liked Beasy


So did I. Never given a fair go IMO.


I agree.. but some have implied he was a bit of a space cadet
Author:  thegezman [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 2:05 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Ah, someone who actually read the post. Whilst I may have a current player who is yet to debut, but has shown top form in minor comps (TAC, WAFL, SANFL, VFL etc.) as a W or an F, it is comparing their value to a previous player at the time the previous player was despatched.


i read the thread. i stand by what i've said.
I reckon you overrate some of our kids purely on hype. to say bower in 06 will equal ang's last season is guesswork based on hype. he may not play a game for all we know. so i cant see how at this early stage you can call that a Win, Evens or Future maybe.

Same applies to Bryan, Hotts will still doing as much if not more in his last season at the club that Bryan did in 05. they are actually pretty similar players in terms of there rolls
Author:  Chitty's Finger [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 2:20 pm ]
Post subject: 
thegezman wrote:
Same applies to Bryan, Hotts will still doing as much if not more in his last season at the club that Bryan did in 05. they are actually pretty similar players in terms of there rolls


Fat rolls? Or roles? :wink: I guess the role they have in common is undersized ruckman?

Agree with what you said though gezman. BUT you cant link these players to players when Pago Pago came in as we didn't have an underage class of early draft picks coming through. Its hard to link the two - hacks in 2003 to youngplayers in 2006 but I understand what Brizzy is trying to do? We should all be very vyer happy that this is the case.

As for Beasy, he got more chances than a few others I reckon.
Author:  AGRO [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:07 pm ]
Post subject: 
TheGame wrote:
We'll see how Simpson goes when he starts getting tagged. Campo is tagged every minute he is on the field.



Hard to get tagged when you play on from taking the kick out. :roll:

Lets discount Scott's disposals by at least 6 per game then make a comparison. :wink:
Author:  TheGame [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:31 pm ]
Post subject: 
AGRO wrote:
TheGame wrote:
We'll see how Simpson goes when he starts getting tagged. Campo is tagged every minute he is on the field.



Hard to get tagged when you play on from taking the kick out. :roll:

Lets discount Scott's disposals by at least 6 per game then make a comparison. :wink:


Talk about exaggeration, I'll take 2 disposals off.
Why do you think Campo and Stevo take took the kick ins for? Because the coach tells them to because the rest of them can't kick to save themselves.
Author:  Dukes [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:44 pm ]
Post subject: 
TheGame wrote:
AGRO wrote:
TheGame wrote:
We'll see how Simpson goes when he starts getting tagged. Campo is tagged every minute he is on the field.



Hard to get tagged when you play on from taking the kick out. :roll:

Lets discount Scott's disposals by at least 6 per game then make a comparison. :wink:


Talk about exaggeration, I'll take 2 disposals off.
Why do you think Campo and Stevo take took the kick ins for? Because the coach tells them to because the rest of them can't kick to save themselves.


Agreed ... a lot of people are getting carried away with some of our younger brigade before they have proven to be consistent performers at AFL level. Some have shown glimpses (Walker, Simpson, Bryan, Bentick, Waite) but just as many (Livingstone, Wiggins, Sporn) have shown very little.

We sometimes forget how many times the likes of Camporeale, Beaumont and Manton produced match winning performances for us in years past. Hopefully the new guys can step up to the required level but we're last for a reason ...
Author:  AGRO [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 4:43 pm ]
Post subject: 
TheGame wrote:
AGRO wrote:
TheGame wrote:
We'll see how Simpson goes when he starts getting tagged. Campo is tagged every minute he is on the field.



Hard to get tagged when you play on from taking the kick out. :roll:

Lets discount Scott's disposals by at least 6 per game then make a comparison. :wink:


Talk about exaggeration, I'll take 2 disposals off.
Why do you think Campo and Stevo take took the kick ins for? Because the coach tells them to because the rest of them can't kick to save themselves.


I haven't got a problem with the fact that its the coaches instruction that Camporeale and Stevens take the kickouts because they are the best kicks in the club - the problem I have is with the fact that Camporeale fans say he has got a 20 disposal a game average and everyone thinks he is a hero.

Just dont count his play on from kick out stats - and please the only exaggeration around here is you and the size of your ego - Camporeale when he takes the kick outs plays on at least 50% of the time - I was being conservative estimating 6 times a game.
Author:  steve [ Tue Jan 17, 2006 7:41 pm ]
Post subject: 
I was under the impression that kick outs weren't counted in stats???
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