TalkingCarlton :: View topic - denis having a real rant

if you watch the game - during the 3rd qtr we had a classic turn over involving 1 maybe 2 players.

don't want to give their names away....however, immeadiately after the incident the camera shot to the box and i am convinced denis was saying " he does it every f.......n time" to tony elshaugh.....and he wasn't happy.

if anyone saw it, have you any comments who they were directed at?.....i have a feeling i know......

verbs wrote:

And your point is?

Even though its the Wizard Cup, he wants better decision making from his players. Lets not forget, this is the same guy that probably has the same passion for winning against his grandkids at marbles

How about Tony's composure though - priceless

Lets face it the Pagan game plan aint too complicated, just hard for some players to stick to.

if you fluff up wheter your kouta, or digby and fevola (that was just comical in the last) then pago is entitled to have a go.

Author:	london blue [ Sun Mar 13, 2005 11:24 pm ]
Post subject:	denis having a real rant - directed at who?
if you watch the game - during the 3rd qtr we had a classic turn over involving 1 maybe 2 players. don't want to give their names away....however, immeadiately after the incident the camera shot to the box and i am convinced denis was saying " he does it every f.......n time" to tony elshaugh.....and he wasn't happy. if anyone saw it, have you any comments who they were directed at?.....i have a feeling i know......

Author:	verbs [ Sun Mar 13, 2005 11:33 pm ]
Post subject:
And your point is?

Author:	Bluesboy70 [ Sun Mar 13, 2005 11:41 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: denis having a real rant - directed at who?
london blue wrote: if you watch the game - during the 3rd qtr we had a classic turn over involving 1 maybe 2 players. don't want to give their names away....however, immeadiately after the incident the camera shot to the box and i am convinced denis was saying " he does it every f.......n time" to tony elshaugh.....and he wasn't happy. if anyone saw it, have you any comments who they were directed at?.....i have a feeling i know...... Wiggins running about 30m through the centre, not giving the first option and getting caught holding the ball. I had the same reaction myself !!!

Author:	Bluesboy70 [ Sun Mar 13, 2005 11:45 pm ]
Post subject:
verbs wrote: And your point is? Even though its the Wizard Cup, he wants better decision making from his players. Lets not forget, this is the same guy that probably has the same passion for winning against his grandkids at marbles

Author:	verbs [ Sun Mar 13, 2005 11:55 pm ]
Post subject:
Bluesboy70 wrote: verbs wrote: And your point is? Even though its the Wizard Cup, he wants better decision making from his players. Lets not forget, this is the same guy that probably has the same passion for winning against his grandkids at marbles Irrelevant!! The POINT of the POST was???? What??? White-ant some poor Carlton kid who has just been part of a great team effort to win the Wizard Cup which Pagan said from the outset he wanted to win? Watch the game again and have a look at more than half-a-dozen similar turnovers from half-a-dozen kids and without the BS camera focus. Don't believe everything you lip read on TV!!!

TalkingCarlton http://www.talkingcarlton.com/phpBB3/

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Author:	camel [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 7:31 am ]
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I don't think london blue was trying to white ant anyone, I reckon he was pretty genuine with his question. If the last couple of years have showed us anything it is that no player is safe. If we give up on a continuous improvement philososphy we'll be screwed before R1 even starts. So, Denis as the senior coach, who is working marvels building a group of blokes to play together as a team unit, sees fit to get cranky at a player then so be it.

Author:	verbs [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 7:58 am ]
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Curious timing

Author:	BlueJean [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 8:02 am ]
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In the heat of the moment, anything that is even the slightest bit of a mistake, we are more than likely to go APE at! It was an intense part of the game, therefore no surprises re Denis' reaction. One thing is for sure though, is that Denis dont put up with much hey! How about Tony's composure though - priceless.

Author:	mikkey [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 8:25 am ]
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Quote: How about Tony's composure though - priceless That was not composure. He was scared stiff.

Author:	The Vet [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 8:41 am ]
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they showed Pagan as well when Stevo in the clear tried to short pass into 50 and fluffed it badly. Pagan turned to Elshaugh and said something savoury, although my lip reading skills aren't good enough to discern it. Pagan's just a passionate coach! Love it.

Author:	Fishman Dan [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 9:18 am ]
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Stop getting up this topic - it's a good'un. He's not white-anting, and we are allowed to be critical of this team as well as supportive. And as for the cause - it would have been Houlihan being run down from behind because he takes TOO LONG TO GET RID OF THE FOOTY! As for the lip-reading, that would make sense - he gets run down far too often. He either doesn't listen to team mates around him, or he's indecisive. Either way - moments later there was a shot of him on the bench, on the dog'n'bone to the box.

Author:	therubbernub [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 9:50 am ]
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I thought it was an informative topic as well(well until verbs started his rant). I know we are at the mercy of the coverage(as to what and when we see Denis ) but I was surprised at his reaction and wondered myself.... thanks for the replies especially FD. I think what verbs is missing in the point of the post is that by understanding what Denis was going ape shit about we get some understanding of what is DP's "unbreakable team rules" as was pointed out by someone else, when stevens made a mistake it did not get the same reaction. Lets face it the Pagan game plan aint too complicated, just hard for some players to stick to. I think it is at those moments that Denis gets a bit hot under the collar.

Author:	verbs [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 10:04 am ]
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therubbernub wrote: Lets face it the Pagan game plan aint too complicated, just hard for some players to stick to. It's not too difficult to actually say what you mean either, just hard for some people I guess. I think it's at those moments verbs gets a bit hot under the collar.

Author:	thegezman [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 10:10 am ]
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i think after campo's lace out pass to sampi in the 3rd has the same reaction (unless i'm getting confused with the stevo one), my reaction was much the same. also at few other times, lance just made the wrong decision. that point in the last, lappin was free. also in the second davies was under pressure and leading to the boundry but lance went to him. there were several other incidents from a number of players and i'm sure they all would have gotten similar reactions from pago. wiggo was stiff as he team mates didnt give him much of a chop out or a decent option to pass to, so atleast was was trying to get something going. he just needed to get the ball off quicker. if you fluff up wheter your kouta, or digby and fevola (that was just comical in the last) then pago is entitled to have a go.

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Author:	Fishman Dan [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 10:22 am ]
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thegezman wrote: if you fluff up wheter your kouta, or digby and fevola (that was just comical in the last) then pago is entitled to have a go. Any coach is entitled to, and Pagan will do his noodle. As would any right-minded coach. The Roos attitude of "live and let live" won't go far this year, and i think we'll start to see a decline in the Swans. I was a fan of Eade's zero-tolerance, it did a lot to help younger Swans develop. The same goes for Pagan, if you botch it up, expect a red-hot phone handset with your name on it.

Author:	therubbernub [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 11:14 am ]
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I think often coaches just get "generally frustrated" by one off poor decisions by various players, but when it is a repeating mistake by a player that you would assume has had this worked on at training etc, then the coaches reaction goes up a level especially pagans. It is the later scenario that I think we witnessed.

Author:	Bluebernz [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 11:24 am ]
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And the thing with Wiggins is that everytime he gets the ball, you can almost feel his rush of blood and he starts running round like a headless chook! Luv his hardness and all but would be great if he learns that the game is played in different tempos.

Author:	dannyboy [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 12:29 pm ]
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I thought it was after Judd's goal that pagan went off.

Author:	therubbernub [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 2:45 pm ]
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No it was just after Staker missed a goal from the pocket. Digby tried to coralle him against the boundary but he ran around him and had a shot

Author:	CarltonClem [ Mon Mar 14, 2005 3:25 pm ]
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At first remembrance it was Wiggins' "ball" decision...he did something similar when Stevens fluffed his short pass. I was very disappointed with Wiggins on Saturday night.