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R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
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Author:  Braithy [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 10:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
london blue wrote:
Two weeks ago we played freo with one ruck and should have been beaten

Our issue is not a ruck issue.

Like freo, Adelaide kept possession very well and cut through our zones. It stymied our ability to turn over. It made us look slow. As Voss has said we are learning and we are building.

The sky isn’t falling.



you'll see saturday arvy ... while it's not falling (it's only football), but our season is slipping. soft tissue injuries and Voss's insistence in bludgeoning the other team to death at stoppage and winning clearances - it's not a gf winning formula.

while vossy was travelling down that little path of smashing teams at the coalface last season, we were bottom 4. in every metric we were bottom 4 and on the ladder we what, slipped to 3rd last?

ironic the only thing that saved our season was a pcl injury to pittonet, so voss had to change it up - cue fogerty & boyd's selections and going smaller and the forward pressure/ high turnover game and the run and spread from stoppage.


saad and gov cannot be replaced down back, and fogerty is a huge loss as well - he's central to the high turnover game.
Author:  Braithy [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 10:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
Mickstar wrote:
English , Darcy , Lobb . Seemed to work very well for the Dogs tonight . Just sayin ' .




pittonet is so unequivocally worse than those three. you're talking about the slowest guy in the afl, who is lucky to lay a single tackle or get a contested mark per game.


he's a back up ruck who's handy to have when the number 1 goes down.
Author:  Blue Vain [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 10:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
london blue wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
london blue wrote:
Two weeks ago we played freo with one ruck and should have been beaten

Our issue is not a ruck issue.

Like freo, Adelaide kept possession very well and cut through our zones. It stymied our ability to turn over. It made us look slow. As Voss has said we are learning and we are building.

The sky isn’t falling.


So just to confirm, you're comparing a last gasp win against an undefeated team on neutral ground to a loss against a winless side on our home deck? A team that had lost 8 of its last 10 home games?

It's not that difficult. Yes "Adelaide kept possession very well and cut through our zones." Because we didn't pressure them exiting our front half. Our turnover game comes from our forward line. Where the ruckman rests.
We went from number 1 turnover team in the AFL to average in 1 game. We averaged 19 forward 50 tackles and had 24 against Freo. (More than double the AFL average). We had only 11 inside 50 tackles against Adelaide and 7 of their goals originated from our forward line.
We can only present the facts. If you refuse to see a correlation, it's your choice.


I’m not disputing facts, that’s your story and not a fact.


The statistical data represent the facts. They are an indication of what has ACTUALLY occurred.
It's not my story. :? It's the reality.
Anything else is opinion. But as you said, I believe in those running the ship as well. I can't blame them for trying different structures. Especially with injuries mounting.
They'll assess the data no doubt and make decisions based upon it. Including the most important data that everyones judged by, wins and losses. :thumbsup:
Author:  keogh [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 11:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
I hope Binns doesn’t fall into the category of a player never given a chance
Author:  Sydney Blue [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 11:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
They run through the middle in waves if you concede the middle you lose the game. If you force a turnover they are vulnerable on rebound.
Most of their forward entries come via Lachie Whitfield he is the start of the chain -if we dont give them the middle and force them wide and don't allow Whitfield time and space we should beat them. I am not sure who goes to Whitfield or if we have a match up for him
They take a lot of marks inside 50 but their defence out of their forward 50 is pretty poor - Hogan, Riccardi, Brown and Greene are formidable in attack but will allow the ball to leave their forward half with ease.
Walsh and Crippa should have day out and put them down for 30 plus - their midfield with the exception of Ward back themselves and don't pay any attention to their opponents.

Not confident but I think GWS has had a fairly soft draw so far and if it wasn't for Owens brain fades last week and Saints obsession with across the body shots at goal I think they would have lost and Saints were woeful last night
Author:  bluechampion [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 11:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
Whilst I'm a little surprised we've gone so tall, I also understand why.

I'd like to see Fantasia as the sub and Durdin given a look in the centre bounce, just because we have very little break-away pace in the midfield.
Author:  Blue Vain [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 1:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
Sydney Blue wrote:
They run through the middle in waves if you concede the middle you lose the game. If you force a turnover they are vulnerable on rebound.
Most of their forward entries come via Lachie Whitfield he is the start of the chain -if we dont give them the middle and force them wide and don't allow Whitfield time and space we should beat them. I am not sure who goes to Whitfield or if we have a match up for him
They take a lot of marks inside 50 but their defence out of their forward 50 is pretty poor - Hogan, Riccardi, Brown and Greene are formidable in attack but will allow the ball to leave their forward half with ease.
Walsh and Crippa should have day out and put them down for 30 plus - their midfield with the exception of Ward back themselves and don't pay any attention to their opponents.

Not confident but I think GWS has had a fairly soft draw so far and if it wasn't for Owens brain fades last week and Saints obsession with across the body shots at goal I think they would have lost and Saints were woeful last night


Fair assessment Syd. As much as I've been pushing for 1 ruck for the best part of 12 months, I can understand why the coaches have gone with 2. I'm not bloody minded on it always being one or the other at any cost. It depends on the circumstance.
We're missing so much talent from our team that a scrap seems the best option. GWS are super talented and their ball use is as good as anyones but they're not a good pressure side and they don't work as hard as some when the ball is with the opposition.

Briggs has been superb this year (other than last week against Marshall) so perhaps the coaches are looking to work him over. Our defenders will have to be a lot better this week. Weitering just cant choose to be the deepest defender and let his opponent hit up at the ball. He has to defend properly.
The Giants average more marks per inside 50 than anyone so if we give their forwards space, they will chop us up.
I'd like to see us get back to that brutality around the contest we saw at stages last year. I wouldn't be surprised to see us push an additional forward up to the stoppages as well. With Taylor missing, we can possibly back our forwards in to compete outnumbered and hopefully lock the ball in for repeat stoppages.
We can't afford to let it rebound out if we're carrying a ruck down there as the defensive pressure will fall to too few, so the work rate will need to be 100%.

We need Crippa to have a BIG one.
Author:  Braithy [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 4:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
oohhh, i think if we push a forward up to stoppage bcos they're missing taylor, we could get done. imo giants have 3 key defenders who would all be number ones on any other team that doesn't have Sam Taylor in it.

i don't think the giants will miss a beat with their outs (cogs and taylor) bcos they bat so deep and those guys getting a chance will be hungry, along with talented.
Author:  Mickstar [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 4:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
No way would I be running scared of GWS . They are away from home and are not travelling that well IE just fell in against Saints . Our midfield has been ordinary so far and I feel they are due . Bottle it up , make it a scrappy congested game and we win this going away .
Author:  london blue [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 6:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
Mickstar wrote:
No way would I be running scared of GWS . They are away from home and are not travelling that well IE just fell in against Saints . Our midfield has been ordinary so far and I feel they are due . Bottle it up , make it a scrappy congested game and we win this going away .

Love your positivity and pragmatism Mickstar
Author:  SurreyBlue [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 6:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
Mickstar wrote:
No way would I be running scared of GWS . They are away from home and are not travelling that well IE just fell in against Saints . Our midfield has been ordinary so far and I feel they are due . Bottle it up , make it a scrappy congested game and we win this going away .


Agree. Last week our heads were not 100% and our pressure was non-existed. Voss will have them cherry ripe this week.
Author:  Lowey_47 [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 7:41 pm ]
Post subject:  R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
I tipped this! Carlton to win that is)

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk
Author:  CK95 [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 8:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
Mickstar wrote:
No way would I be running scared of GWS . They are away from home and are not travelling that well IE just fell in against Saints . Our midfield has been ordinary so far and I feel they are due . Bottle it up , make it a scrappy congested game and we win this going away .
Backs to the wall stuff tomorrow mate. I don't mind that we're down a few numbers, it'll test 'em.

It should be a good game of footy.

Sent from my Nokia G21 using Tapatalk
Author:  Mickstar [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 8:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
SurreyBlue wrote:
Mickstar wrote:
No way would I be running scared of GWS . They are away from home and are not travelling that well IE just fell in against Saints . Our midfield has been ordinary so far and I feel they are due . Bottle it up , make it a scrappy congested game and we win this going away .


Agree. Last week our heads were not 100% and our pressure was non-existed. Voss will have them cherry ripe this week.


Yes Suzz , our heads were not 100% with it last week I agree . It was hard to pick what was wrong but it was not right . Our Skipper seemed off and I reckon he knew it and will play a blinder tomorrow . Reckon Orazio will be prominent also .
Author:  Mickstar [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 8:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
PS .............. Goldie and Draper are going OK .................. just sayin" , again .
Author:  daggs001 [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 9:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
SurreyBlue wrote:
Mickstar wrote:
No way would I be running scared of GWS . They are away from home and are not travelling that well IE just fell in against Saints . Our midfield has been ordinary so far and I feel they are due . Bottle it up , make it a scrappy congested game and we win this going away .


Agree. Last week our heads were not 100% and our pressure was non-existed. Voss will have them cherry ripe this week.


Crippa has a new baby in the house. I have had the good fortune to experience that feeling 3 times . I was operating on fumes only for the first few weeks. Especially with the first child.
Author:  SurreyBlue [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 9:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
daggs001 wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
Mickstar wrote:
No way would I be running scared of GWS . They are away from home and are not travelling that well IE just fell in against Saints . Our midfield has been ordinary so far and I feel they are due . Bottle it up , make it a scrappy congested game and we win this going away .


Agree. Last week our heads were not 100% and our pressure was non-existed. Voss will have them cherry ripe this week.


Crippa has a new baby in the house. I have had the good fortune to experience that feeling 3 times . I was operating on fumes only for the first few weeks. Especially with the first child.


Me too. Only I slept better than the baby and wife. :razz:
Author:  Blue Vain [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 10:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
Mickstar wrote:
PS .............. Goldie and Draper are going OK .................. just sayin" , again .


Interesting Mick. 2 marks between them for the night.
I thought Draper was garbage. 5 disposals, 1 mark, 1 tackle, gave away a stupid 50 that resulted in a goal and then missed a goal himself from 15m directly in front.
Goldstein has been a great pick up for them though and has made Draper almost redundant IMHO.
Author:  Mickstar [ Fri Apr 19, 2024 11:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
Blue Vain wrote:
Mickstar wrote:
PS .............. Goldie and Draper are going OK .................. just sayin" , again .


Interesting Mick. 2 marks between them for the night.
I thought Draper was garbage. 5 disposals, 1 mark, 1 tackle, gave away a stupid 50 that resulted in a goal and then missed a goal himself from 15m directly in front.
Goldstein has been a great pick up for them though and has made Draper almost redundant IMHO.


Nah , Goldie is doing what he is doing coz he is getting a good copout by Draper . Sharing the load . Draper has a menacing presence . He gets in opponent's head's . Bit of Mumford about him . Mumford's stats were pretty meagre but his influence was huge . Still , that's just my opinion ' Vain " . On another note got a smokie for us in the midseason draft. ?
Author:  sinbagger [ Sat Apr 20, 2024 8:36 am ]
Post subject:  R6: Carlton Vs GWS (Pre Match Discussion)
Mickstar wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
Mickstar wrote:
PS .............. Goldie and Draper are going OK .................. just sayin" , again .


Interesting Mick. 2 marks between them for the night.
I thought Draper was garbage. 5 disposals, 1 mark, 1 tackle, gave away a stupid 50 that resulted in a goal and then missed a goal himself from 15m directly in front.
Goldstein has been a great pick up for them though and has made Draper almost redundant IMHO.


Nah , Goldie is doing what he is doing coz he is getting a good copout by Draper . Sharing the load . Draper has a menacing presence . He gets in opponent's head's . Bit of Mumford about him . Mumford's stats were pretty meagre but his influence was huge . Still , that's just my opinion ' Vain " . On another note got a smokie for us in the midseason draft. ?


Draper won the match for them by lying on the ball at the end.
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