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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2023 6:22 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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99prelim wrote:
GreatEx wrote:
Do we really have to throw our Brownlow winning captain under the bus to save Paddy flippin' Dow?


You mean our Brownlow winning captain who goesn't have an ounce of leadership in him?...apart from, give it to me and I'll do it all on my own

And if it doesn't work on 10 occasions, my solution is to do it all on my own for the 11th time

"We're back, blues are back"

Yep...that one


I'm not oblivious to Cripps's deficiencies as a footballer or a leader. The reason I questioned your post is that Paddy Dow has his own deficiencies as a player (which happen to be the most commonly shared among our other mids, hence Kennedy and Hewett making sub appearances), but rather than be honest about those deficiencies you choose to drag down a bloke who's done a million times more for the club. It's a cheap shot.


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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2023 6:51 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

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GreatEx wrote:
Do we really have to throw our Brownlow winning captain under the bus to save Paddy flippin' Dow?

I'm with you GreatEx. Dow has played 63 AFL games and averages 13.6 disposals - most of which are a handball to a teamate under pressure. Furthermore he doesn't apply much defensive pressure. He was given a run against the Lions late last year and looked way out of his depth. There is a good reason no other club wanted him.

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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2023 7:26 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

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What have Dow's TOG numbers been like when in the ones? I thougth the criticism is he can't run out quarters and eventually sits out most of the last quarter both on and off the ground.


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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2023 7:31 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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GreatEx wrote:
99prelim wrote:
GreatEx wrote:
Do we really have to throw our Brownlow winning captain under the bus to save Paddy flippin' Dow?


You mean our Brownlow winning captain who goesn't have an ounce of leadership in him?...apart from, give it to me and I'll do it all on my own

And if it doesn't work on 10 occasions, my solution is to do it all on my own for the 11th time

"We're back, blues are back"

Yep...that one


I'm not oblivious to Cripps's deficiencies as a footballer or a leader. The reason I questioned your post is that Paddy Dow has his own deficiencies as a player (which happen to be the most commonly shared among our other mids, hence Kennedy and Hewett making sub appearances), but rather than be honest about those deficiencies you choose to drag down a bloke who's done a million times more for the club. It's a cheap shot.


By taking on the responsibility and trying to lift your team is not a deficiency, that's why they are regarded as a step above, it doesn't always work out. Our mids deficiencies is speed, that is what differs from most of our mids and dow, they can't chase once they loose the contest. Dow's deficiency is the lack of endeavor to chase, his decision making and disposal isn't the greatest either. He hasn't improved in that area at all, what does he expect.


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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2023 7:34 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Tue Aug 31, 2021 12:58 pm
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Johnson and Ginnivan reportedly both trained today, because of course they did. Lol.


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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2023 8:32 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
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bondiblue wrote:
99prelim wrote:

I mean he's doing everything his captain is role modelling...like not running both ways
Of course he deserved a block of games...his non-selection is not healthy in the locker room...remember that Dow wlll have team mates who are feeling for him being made a pariah by Voss
MV is angry at him because he refused to be traded and as a result, we had to offload Setterfield
That goes to the character of MV...pig headed and vindictive!!!!!
FWIW...and I know I'll be in the minority, but Dow has more upside than Setterfield


When you put it this way, my ears prick up.
I could believe that about MV and the Dow relationship.

Setterfield or Dow? That is the question.
Both young.

Do you want to believe that about Setterfield, Dow and MV or do you know?"
I like the story Dow wanted to stay and earn his spot in the AFL team.


It was even discussed on SEN...but I had intel from earlier in March from a genuinely reliable source

Yes it's true nobody wanted him at current contract, but he was not willing to consider a move

He told the club he has friends at Carlton and wanted to win his spot back

Let's just say that people weren't happy with this answer as they knew that one of he or Setterfield had to go for list/cap space

He is being made to pay for putting a spanner in the works, rather than putting him at AFL level to prove his worth

This has nothing to do with what he does without the ball blah blah...that just suits the narrative

And...this is just a crazy conspiracy theory of mine so please take it with HALF a grain of salt...imagine he was brought into the team and played well??? Now that would be an awkward

conundrum for MV. Let's keep him in the 2nds all year so they don't have to contend with that "problem'. Supporters would burn down Ikon park if he were dropped after having played well


Tell me the last Carlton player in the last 20 years who's been banging down the door for so many weeks, in a midfield that needs some zip and at a time the team isn't performing well???

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Last edited by 99prelim on Sat May 20, 2023 8:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2023 8:36 pm 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Thu May 11, 2006 6:11 pm
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CFC8795 wrote:
Who else was at this game at VFL Park in 1977?:banghead:
Collingwood 22.20 (152) Carlton 7.8 (50)

I was at the game. Went with a bunch of Collingwood supporters who repeated the scores all the way home. To this day I remember what the score was.
To make it worse we had to catch the bus and train and it took over 3 hours to get home.


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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2023 8:40 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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kezza wrote:
CFC8795 wrote:
Who else was at this game at VFL Park in 1977?:banghead:
Collingwood 22.20 (152) Carlton 7.8 (50)

I was at the game. Went with a bunch of Collingwood supporters who repeated the scores all the way home. To this day I remember what the score was.
To make it worse we had to catch the bus and train and it took over 3 hours to get home.



I’m sure you enjoyed telling them the score a few years later in September 1979.


:lol:

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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2023 8:42 pm 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Thu May 11, 2006 6:11 pm
Posts: 14235
AGRO wrote:
kezza wrote:
CFC8795 wrote:
Who else was at this game at VFL Park in 1977?:banghead:
Collingwood 22.20 (152) Carlton 7.8 (50)

I was at the game. Went with a bunch of Collingwood supporters who repeated the scores all the way home. To this day I remember what the score was.
To make it worse we had to catch the bus and train and it took over 3 hours to get home.



I’m sure you enjoyed telling them the score a few years later in September 1979.


:lol:

:thumbsup:


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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2023 9:29 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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david31 wrote:
They should be chomping at the bit to get after this mob after last year but I’m not holding my breath


McCrae coming out and saying (with a sh!t eating smirk) he'll show the players last year's game.... because Carlton will come out firing.....

Crazy thing for a coach to say... BUT it shows to me he doesn't worry about giving us ammunition....

We should come out firing...



But we won't.

My only hope is that we move the ball quicker (because we have to) and win around the contest... Make it a game...



Go Blues

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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2023 9:34 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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@99 if the club was so determined to cut off its nose to spite its face with Dow, why even play him in the VFL? Why not play him out of position to ensure the worst possible performance? Or do they have it in for supporters as well?

And if Dow offers so much zip and speed, why did he rarely exhibit those assets in his 63 AFL games? I mean, that's the one thing he would've had in his locker from the beginning.


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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2023 10:21 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Can we just stop pretending Paddy Dow is our saviour, because by now it's pretty clear he won't be on our list next year.


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PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2023 8:26 am 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2006 8:22 am
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This strikes me as more conspiracy than reality.
Imagine if our current trajectory continues, we miss finals, Dow goes to another club and performs at AFL level having been kept out at Carlton.
That would be the straw that broke the camels back for Voss’s contract.
Voss wants to win. Needs to win. He will surely not keep players out of the team who could help us do that just because we had to get rid of Setterfield (who he also kept out of the team or played in the wrong position until the cupboard was bare).
I think it more likely, and simpler, that Voss believes in his game plan and believes that our existing team is able to rediscover the form from last year that has us in contention against the best teams (where we dropped the ball against lower ranked teams, as well as stuffed up the closing stages against the Pies & Dees). And that he doesn’t think Dow can help.
I disagree and think it is worth giving Dow a shot. But I think the above makes a lot more sense than Voss is keeping Dow out because he refused to go.
And if i am wrong and that is the real reason, then I’d be surprised if Voss remains coach by this time next year…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2023 8:51 am 
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Harry Vallence
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More chance of Oscar McDonald coming back to bite us than Dow.

The absolute fantasy of bedwetters in here thinking Dow will be the reason Voss is or isn't coach is ridiculous. Like speculating over David Parkin's future because we let Jacob Anstey walk to the Saints.


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PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2023 9:27 am 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
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GreatEx wrote:
@99 if the club was so determined to cut off its nose to spite its face with Dow, why even play him in the VFL? Why not play him out of position to ensure the worst possible performance? Or do they have it in for supporters as well?

And if Dow offers so much zip and speed, why did he rarely exhibit those assets in his 63 AFL games? I mean, that's the one thing he would've had in his locker from the beginning.


How many of the 63 games under Voss?...you know, everyone starts with a clean slate...etc etc

What % of those 63 games as an 18-20 y.o...you know, when an AFL player shouldve matured?

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Last edited by 99prelim on Sun May 21, 2023 9:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2023 9:28 am 
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Robert Walls

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missnaut wrote:
Can we just stop pretending Paddy Dow is our saviour, because by now it's pretty clear he won't be on our list next year.


Yes, that's exactly what I said, what I inferred, what I suggested...verbatim..."Praise the Lord, Dow is the Saviour" :roll: :roll:

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PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2023 9:58 am 
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Ken Hunter
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99prelim wrote:
GreatEx wrote:
@99 if the club was so determined to cut off its nose to spite its face with Dow, why even play him in the VFL? Why not play him out of position to ensure the worst possible performance? Or do they have it in for supporters as well?

And if Dow offers so much zip and speed, why did he rarely exhibit those assets in his 63 AFL games? I mean, that's the one thing he would've had in his locker from the beginning.


How many of the 63 games under Voss?...you know, everyone starts with a clean slate...etc etc

What % of those 63 games as an 18-20 y.o...you know, when an AFL player shouldve matured?


Because as I pointed out in my previous post, if you're quick then you're quick from the start, it's not something you suddenly discover with experience (unless you were grossly overweight as a junior)


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PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2023 10:25 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2015 5:55 pm
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At least the 22 looks a bit more nimble.


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PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2023 10:32 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2015 5:55 pm
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GreatEx wrote:
99prelim wrote:
GreatEx wrote:
@99 if the club was so determined to cut off its nose to spite its face with Dow, why even play him in the VFL? Why not play him out of position to ensure the worst possible performance? Or do they have it in for supporters as well?

And if Dow offers so much zip and speed, why did he rarely exhibit those assets in his 63 AFL games? I mean, that's the one thing he would've had in his locker from the beginning.


How many of the 63 games under Voss?...you know, everyone starts with a clean slate...etc etc

What % of those 63 games as an 18-20 y.o...you know, when an AFL player shouldve matured?


Because as I pointed out in my previous post, if you're quick then you're quick from the start, it's not something you suddenly discover with experience (unless you were grossly overweight as a junior)


Nit sure what the point of this chatter in. Dow has good burst speed from stoppages. That's about it.


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PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2023 10:34 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

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I have that day game optimism again. Foolishly so.
We will win this game because Voss will tell the players to take the game on and run and Coll won't be prepared for this new style of play. Blues have been training this for a few weeks.


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