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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sun May 28, 2023 6:41 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:38 pm
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Missed several the other night
Has also missed several In the last few weeks and hit belly of ball the other week when we kicked 0.5 in one quarter and lost the match because of the ball butchers kicking for goal including him


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 Post subject: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sun May 28, 2023 7:48 pm 
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Geoff Southby
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Location: Conservative Brisbane :O(
I have to say I don't rate the mongrel element. I can't remember the name of that knob from Geelong carlton picked up. used to mouth off at every opportunity but couldn't kick a goal from directly in front.

Geelong don't have too many mongrel spocks, either do richmond. They have some needs though

Anyway, the moral of my story is get your shit in order first before being an absolute mofo. We don't have our shit together

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sun May 28, 2023 7:55 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
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Trade Cripps...hopefully/maybe to WC...
Trade TDK (likely to Geel)...and make them pay after all the rubbish they've given us

Apart from that, any combo of the usual list cloggers and crash test dummies

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 9:35 am 
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Bruce Doull
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If we want an extrovert we could do worse than approach Jack Reiwoldt about a 1 year contract

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 10:06 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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billy_bongo wrote:
CK95 wrote:
They were playing 2 decades ago?

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Oh sorry. Didn't introverts exist in the 20th Century?

Mmmm. You post quite frequently as well....


You should see my shiny white teeth...they will blind you. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 10:17 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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billy_bongo wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
To many introverts in this team.
Introverts are not going to step up when it counts.
We have an entire list of introverts

Need extroverts

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:thumbsup:

Its so obvious. Has been for 2 decades. Mummies boys


Yeah. Mummies' boys. Doull, Nicholls, Hunter, Fitzpatrick. Never stepped up. Woozers.

Where do you get this shit from?

Studies have shown that people who continuously post on internet forums, are usually Mormons.


You know what the theme is, just try and play along instead of pissing on posters.
I was focussed on Harmes, and there were other extraverts at the time, and I mentioned them.
Could you not acknowledge that? Could you find the extraverts who are tough and proud of their perform,ance week in week out amongst our current list.
Stick to the theme and no need to take things to the enth degree to degrade someone and miss the point of the post.

I dont agree with half the stuff you post, but that doesn't make me right, nor you.
Get a grip and try and be civil.

I try my hardest to tolerate you because half the things you post make good sense, especially when you stick to football.

You're quite nasty behind a keyboard. But I accept you because you're a loyal Carltonian who has a trait to eat his own.

We are all hurting and looking for clues. Dont deliberately go out to hurt us more than we do.

Lets stick to footy. Your point? Nichols etc were intraverts. Perhaps.

There's all types of extraverts, even quieter ones. Actions displaying brutality, strength and competitiveness is another way of showing ones true inner self. on the outside, and extraversion doesn't have to be exclusively through their voice box in the locker room. But you knew that.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 10:25 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
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GreatEx wrote:
Our players are shithouses, no one's denying that. But you did insinuate that that's a result of being introverted. And if you really believe a balance is best, does that mean a team of all extroverts is also bad? Do you think extroversion and courage go hand in hand?


Outward expression. Yes to the last.

I'm saying there's an argument that the list may have too many intraverts. I'm looking for clues.

I'm looking for those who display traits of an extravert on our list because I do think courage is a form of extraversion, bringing ones actions to do the talking for them. I think they are related. It depends on definition.

i might be wrong. That's Ok. Just tell me where I'm wrong and I'm happy to go along with the facts.

I'm old school and I know times have changed. Ive got young boys, so I see the diff.

We are discussing the list. Is there any truth that maybe our list has too many intarverts? Maybe we should define what an intravert is first.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 10:40 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Location: Bondi Beach
Fenwick Snap wrote:
My two cents, at risk of being a sometimes courageous, somewhat in the introvert camp, fringe player here:

The whole introvert/extrovert thing might be a fun thing for people to hang their hats on but we don't really know which players fit into which camp and whether it matters. I suspect most people, me included, think a mix is good, but the labelling of individual players is problematic and unhelpful.

It's much easier to point out those with a bit of mongrel or mischief or just having a big mouth. Sure, label them as extroverts (at least on the footy field). I see Owies labelled as introverted - not sure about that. I like to think Bradley was an introvert but some reports suggest that he didn't mind having a yap. I know, however, regardless of what some think of his lack of 'toughness', that I would back him to kick a clutch goal under any circumstances. I couldn't say that for serial big mouth Andrew Jarman when he missed a sitter to keep Essenscum at bay in the '93 prelim. Or Freo's serial pest Ballantyne choking it up on the big stage.

Just my opinion, of course. I just think that there are better ways of assessing a player's and team's worth than poorly defined introversion levels. (I'm sure Kenny Hunter would have nailed any clutch shot too - great example of the futility of equating courage with extroversion).

As a poorly defined introvert (sometimes I slip into the extrovert column, depending on the questions and my mood), I get a bit sick of obviously self-defined extroverts having a dig at those of us that they might not understand, some of whom might belong to the extrovert brigade anyway.

If it's a little more mongrel you're after, sure, so am I - just say so. Bosustow was quite good at upsetting others' apple cart when it was needed. We might need a bit of that...or something else. I thing the thing that unites us on here is that we just want our team to look like they give a toss about winning for every minute they're on the park.


That's where I'm coming from. I'm looking for clues. Define the words first. Is there ambiguities with the definitions. What's wrong with the players? Its easy to point the finger at the coach, but I'm seeing problems with the high end, hand picked draft selections. I might be wrong. I need by Blue Brethren to help unravel this...as a hobby, but also as a lifestyle choice. maybe it cant be fixed and I care too much.

On Saturday I pointed the spotlight on SOS the list manager who assembled most of the list. Why? He selected the players and it seems we have too many of the same type: inside mids, and players who fold under pressure...that's what Bryce Gibbs said.

Maybe it is mongrel. The issue is frustrating the fk out of me.

What I do know is I'm rusted on forever, as are my kids, and I really cant allow them to barrack for the Swans which would have hurt them far less than Carlton has and continues to do so.

My 15 year olf went with a bunch of Academy mates, and he said the performance of many of our professional players was embarrassing. Same as I said at the ground to my non Carlton mates.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 10:45 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Location: Bondi Beach
Lowey_47 wrote:
I have to say I don't rate the mongrel element. I can't remember the name of that knob from Geelong carlton picked up. used to mouth off at every opportunity but couldn't kick a goal from directly in front.

Geelong don't have too many mongrel spocks, either do richmond. They have some needs though

Anyway, the moral of my story is get your shit in order first before being an absolute mofo. We don't have our shit together

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Was that player the over the hill Mansfield?

Maybe we haven't got mongrel and can't compete because that is an ingredient we are lacking...you know, hard hurtful grinding unsociable football. We seem to be copping it but not dishing it out.

Swans made it clear in the nightly news in Sydney, they were going to come out firing and turn their luck around.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 10:46 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Location: Bondi Beach
missnaut wrote:
You can quite easily be an introvert off the field and then get white line fever once you're on it. It's similar to the "extroverted introverts" who can turn it on in a social situation.



Thank you

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 10:49 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Location: Half back flank
bondiblue wrote:
Lowey_47 wrote:
I have to say I don't rate the mongrel element. I can't remember the name of that knob from Geelong carlton picked up. used to mouth off at every opportunity but couldn't kick a goal from directly in front.

Geelong don't have too many mongrel spocks, either do richmond. They have some needs though

Anyway, the moral of my story is get your shit in order first before being an absolute mofo. We don't have our shit together

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


Was that player the over the hill Mansfield?

Maybe we haven't got mongrel and can't compete because that is an ingredient we are lacking...you know, hard hurtful grinding unsociable football. We seem to be copping it but not dishing it out.

Swans made it clear in the nightly news in Sydney, they were going to come out firing and turn their luck around.



Maybe our problem is we can't embrace our inner mongrel until we embrace our inner vulnerabilities first.

Worked for Richmond.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 10:57 am 
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Harry Vallence
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Quote:
1. GWS – Aaron Cadman
GWV Rebels – Darley – St Patrick's College Ballarat
2. Brisbane Lions – Will Ashcroft
Sandringham Dragons – Old Brighton Grammarians – Brighton Grammar
3. North Melbourne – Harry Sheezel
Sandringham Dragons – AJAX – Mount Scopus College
4. North Melbourne – George Wardlaw
Oakleigh Chargers – St Peter’s – St Kevin’s College
5. Essendon* – Elijah Tsatas
Oakleigh Chargers – Surrey Park – Wesley College
6. Gold Coast – Bailey Humphrey
Gippsland Power – Moe – Lowanna College
7. Hawthorn – Cameron Mackenzie
Sandringham Dragons – Beaumaris – Brighton Grammar
8. Geelong – Jhye Clark
Geelong Falcons – Queenscliff – St Ignatius Drysdale
9. West Coast – Reuben Ginbey
East Perth – Dunsborough – Wesley College (Perth)
10. St Kilda – Mattaes Phillipou
Woodville-West Torrens – Phantoms – Henley High School
11. Carlton – Oliver Hollands
Murray Bushrangers – Wodonga – Geelong Grammar
12. Brisbane – Jaspa Fletcher
Brisbane Lions Academy – Sherwood – Brisbane State High School
13. Western Bulldogs – Jedd Busslinger
East Perth – Coolbinia – Trinity College (Perth)
14. West Coast – Elijah Hewett
Swan Districts – Caversham – Guildford Grammar School
15. Melbourne – Matthew Jefferson
Oakleigh Chargers – Ashburton – Wesley College
16. GWS Giants – Harry Rowston
GWS Giants Academy – Griffith Swans – Assumption College
17. Adelaide – Max Michalanney
Norwood – Glenunga – Rostrevor College
18. Hawthorn – Joshua Weddle
Oakleigh Chargers – Eltham – Carey Grammar
19. Collingwood – Edward Allan
Claremont – Mosman Park – Scotch College (Perth)
20. Sydney – Jacob Konstanty
Gippsland Power – Drouin – Lowanna College
21. GWS Giants – Darcy Jones
Swan Districts – Kalamunda – N/A
22. GWS Giants – Max Gruzewski
Oakleigh Chargers – Surrey Park JFC – Caulfield Grammar
23. West Coast – Harry Barnett
West Adelaide – Goodwood Saints – Mercedes College
24. Western Bulldogs – Charlie Clarke
Sandringham Dragons – Port Melbourne Colts – N/A
25. Essendon* – Lewis Hayes
Eastern Ranges – Lysterfield – Rowville Secondary College
26. North Melbourne – Brayden George
Murray Bushrangers – Wangaratta – St Augustine’s College Kyabram
27. Sydney – Cooper Vickery
Gippsland Power – Bairnsdale – Neagle College
28. Collingwood – Jakob Ryan
Glenelg – Brighton – Sacred Heart College
29. West Coast – Coby Burgiel
Gippsland Power – Maffra – Wesley College
30. Carlton – Lachlan Cowan
Tasmania Devils – North Launceston – St Brendan-Shaw College
31. St Kilda - James Van Es
GWV Rebels – North Ballarat — St Patrick’s College
32. Carlton – Jaxon Binns
Dandenong Stingrays – Berwick — Caulfield Grammar
33. Fremantle – Hugh Davies
Claremont – Claremont — Christ Church Grammar School
34. GWS – Toby McMullin
Sandringham Dragons – Port Fairy — Melbourne Grammar
35. St Kilda – Olli Hotton
Sandringham Dragons – Hampton Rovers — Haileybury College
36. Port Adelaide – Tom McCallum
Tasmania Devils – Clarence — N/A
37. Hawthorn – Henry Hustwaite
Dandenong Stingrays – Rosebud — Rosebud Secondary College
38. Melbourne – Jed Adams
Peel Thunder – South Mandurah — N/A
39. Western Bulldogs – Harvey Gallagher
Bendigo Pioneers – Sandhurst — N/A
40. Sydney – Caleb Mitchell
Murray Bushrangers – Yarrawonga Secondary College – Yarrawonga
41. Fremantle – Tom Emmett
Sturt – Payneham NU — N/A
42. Fremantle – Max Knobel
Gippsland Power — Maffra — N/A
43. Adelaide – Billy Dowling
North Adelaide – Walkerville — St Peter’s College
44. St Kilda – Isaac Keeler
North Adelaide – South Augusta — N/A
45. Essendon* – Alwyn Davey Jr
Oakleigh Chargers — Palmerston/Ashburton — Xavier College
46. Hawthorn – Jack O’Sullivan
Oakleigh Chargers – Kyneton — Xavier College
47. Carlton – Harry Lemmey
West Adelaide – Flagstaff Hill — Scotch College (SA)
48. Collingwood – Joe Richards
Wangaratta – N/A – Wangaratta Imperials JFC
49. Richmond – Kaleb Smith
East Fremantle – Melville — Wesley College
50. Adelaide – Hugh Bond
GWV Rebels – North Ballarat — N/A


So you've got:

18 out of the top 20 from private/select entry schools. Moe/Drouin really batting out of its league this year.
21 to 50: 11 school dropouts and 3 from public schools. 16 from elite private schools.

I wonder how much time is spent observing the public schools footy competitions in comparison to Scotch vs Melbourne Grammar these days, if you know that they're being offered scholarships from around 13-14 if they show the slightest bit of potential.

If they're just going to join the Liberal Party if they don't get drafted, do we really want them on the list?


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 10:59 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 23030
Location: Bondi Beach
frank dardew wrote:
Missed several the other night
Has also missed several In the last few weeks and hit belly of ball the other week when we kicked 0.5 in one quarter and lost the match because of the ball butchers kicking for goal including him


One swallow doesn't make a summer.

Motlop kicked 2 goals. One should have been Durdin's free shot.

Hasnt done enough over the last 7 weeks. He's a developing player.

Quote:
In comparison, Carlton’s small forwards are Owies (category B rookie), Corey Durdin (pick 37) and Jesse Motlop (pick 27). The Crows pair are miles ahead on performance.


https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/the-tackle-mark-robinsons-likes-and-dislikes-from-round-11/news-story/9832c07bc1748aa13978db2cf8f28b56

We have our fingers crossed that Motlop and Durdin will come good. That is not reasssuring for me.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 11:03 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Posts: 23030
Location: Bondi Beach
Rod Spooky Galt wrote:
Quote:
1. GWS – Aaron Cadman
GWV Rebels – Darley – St Patrick's College Ballarat
2. Brisbane Lions – Will Ashcroft
Sandringham Dragons – Old Brighton Grammarians – Brighton Grammar
3. North Melbourne – Harry Sheezel
Sandringham Dragons – AJAX – Mount Scopus College
4. North Melbourne – George Wardlaw
Oakleigh Chargers – St Peter’s – St Kevin’s College
5. Essendon** – Elijah Tsatas
Oakleigh Chargers – Surrey Park – Wesley College
6. Gold Coast – Bailey Humphrey
Gippsland Power – Moe – Lowanna College
7. Hawthorn – Cameron Mackenzie
Sandringham Dragons – Beaumaris – Brighton Grammar
8. Geelong – Jhye Clark
Geelong Falcons – Queenscliff – St Ignatius Drysdale
9. West Coast – Reuben Ginbey
East Perth – Dunsborough – Wesley College (Perth)
10. St Kilda – Mattaes Phillipou
Woodville-West Torrens – Phantoms – Henley High School
11. Carlton – Oliver Hollands
Murray Bushrangers – Wodonga – Geelong Grammar
12. Brisbane – Jaspa Fletcher
Brisbane Lions Academy – Sherwood – Brisbane State High School
13. Western Bulldogs – Jedd Busslinger
East Perth – Coolbinia – Trinity College (Perth)
14. West Coast – Elijah Hewett
Swan Districts – Caversham – Guildford Grammar School
15. Melbourne – Matthew Jefferson
Oakleigh Chargers – Ashburton – Wesley College
16. GWS Giants – Harry Rowston
GWS Giants Academy – Griffith Swans – Assumption College
17. Adelaide – Max Michalanney
Norwood – Glenunga – Rostrevor College
18. Hawthorn – Joshua Weddle
Oakleigh Chargers – Eltham – Carey Grammar
19. Collingwood – Edward Allan
Claremont – Mosman Park – Scotch College (Perth)
20. Sydney – Jacob Konstanty
Gippsland Power – Drouin – Lowanna College
21. GWS Giants – Darcy Jones
Swan Districts – Kalamunda – N/A
22. GWS Giants – Max Gruzewski
Oakleigh Chargers – Surrey Park JFC – Caulfield Grammar
23. West Coast – Harry Barnett
West Adelaide – Goodwood Saints – Mercedes College
24. Western Bulldogs – Charlie Clarke
Sandringham Dragons – Port Melbourne Colts – N/A
25. Essendon** – Lewis Hayes
Eastern Ranges – Lysterfield – Rowville Secondary College
26. North Melbourne – Brayden George
Murray Bushrangers – Wangaratta – St Augustine’s College Kyabram
27. Sydney – Cooper Vickery
Gippsland Power – Bairnsdale – Neagle College
28. Collingwood – Jakob Ryan
Glenelg – Brighton – Sacred Heart College
29. West Coast – Coby Burgiel
Gippsland Power – Maffra – Wesley College
30. Carlton – Lachlan Cowan
Tasmania Devils – North Launceston – St Brendan-Shaw College
31. St Kilda - James Van Es
GWV Rebels – North Ballarat — St Patrick’s College
32. Carlton – Jaxon Binns
Dandenong Stingrays – Berwick — Caulfield Grammar
33. Fremantle – Hugh Davies
Claremont – Claremont — Christ Church Grammar School
34. GWS – Toby McMullin
Sandringham Dragons – Port Fairy — Melbourne Grammar
35. St Kilda – Olli Hotton
Sandringham Dragons – Hampton Rovers — Haileybury College
36. Port Adelaide – Tom McCallum
Tasmania Devils – Clarence — N/A
37. Hawthorn – Henry Hustwaite
Dandenong Stingrays – Rosebud — Rosebud Secondary College
38. Melbourne – Jed Adams
Peel Thunder – South Mandurah — N/A
39. Western Bulldogs – Harvey Gallagher
Bendigo Pioneers – Sandhurst — N/A
40. Sydney – Caleb Mitchell
Murray Bushrangers – Yarrawonga Secondary College – Yarrawonga
41. Fremantle – Tom Emmett
Sturt – Payneham NU — N/A
42. Fremantle – Max Knobel
Gippsland Power — Maffra — N/A
43. Adelaide – Billy Dowling
North Adelaide – Walkerville — St Peter’s College
44. St Kilda – Isaac Keeler
North Adelaide – South Augusta — N/A
45. Essendon** – Alwyn Davey Jr
Oakleigh Chargers — Palmerston/Ashburton — Xavier College
46. Hawthorn – Jack O’Sullivan
Oakleigh Chargers – Kyneton — Xavier College
47. Carlton – Harry Lemmey
West Adelaide – Flagstaff Hill — Scotch College (SA)
48. Collingwood – Joe Richards
Wangaratta – N/A – Wangaratta Imperials JFC
49. Richmond – Kaleb Smith
East Fremantle – Melville — Wesley College
50. Adelaide – Hugh Bond
GWV Rebels – North Ballarat — N/A


So you've got:

18 out of the top 20 from private/select entry schools. Moe/Drouin really batting out of its league this year.
21 to 50: 11 school dropouts and 3 from public schools. 16 from elite private schools.

I wonder how much time is spent observing the public schools footy competitions in comparison to Scotch vs Melbourne Grammar these days, if you know that they're being offered scholarships from around 13-14 if they show the slightest bit of potential.

If they're just going to join the Liberal Party if they don't get drafted, do we really want them on the list?


I was going to revisit this discussion but thought the intarvert discussion was controversial enough.

I think SOS fell for the Private school kids because they were easier to drive to?

Finbar from Xavier was an inspired choice by SOS. Not.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 11:15 am 
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Harry Vallence
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Posts: 1385
I think you only need to look at the numerous stories on here re: SOS's interactions with the general public over the years to see there's probably no surprise he favoured the private school kids over the great unwashed.

Finbar, best mate of Ben Silvagni too?


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 12:33 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 9:58 pm
Posts: 4299
These days a lot of these private school kids who are any good at footy are there on a scholarship and would likely be in a state school otherwise.
Having said that, I really think this introverts are because they go to a private school thing is drawing a very long bow.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 12:48 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Posts: 2452
:eek: I can't believe the conversation around introverts and extroverts. What garbage. As if it makes any difference. I would expect if you knew who was introverted and extroverted over the entire competition over the 160 years the competition has been going the ratio would be identical to the ratio of introverts to extroverts in the general population. And if you looked specifically at the premiers of each year it would be the same. Introvert/extrovert is not a requirement to be a professional footballer who can perform a role within a successful team. Drive and competitiveness would be more important to me.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 12:51 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Tue Aug 31, 2021 12:58 pm
Posts: 1265
carntheblues wrote:
:eek: I can't believe the conversation around introverts and extroverts. What garbage. As if it makes any difference. I would expect if you knew who was introverted and extroverted over the entire competition over the 160 years the competition has been going the ratio would be identical to the ratio of introverts to extroverts in the general population. And if you looked specifically at the premiers of each year it would be the same. Introvert/extrovert is not a requirement to be a professional footballer who can perform a role within a successful team. Drive and competitiveness would be more important to me.


Reminds me of how we used to blame beards for poor performance a decade ago.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 1:26 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Posts: 10326
Location: Coburg
carntheblues wrote:
:eek: I can't believe the conversation around introverts and extroverts. What garbage. As if it makes any difference. I would expect if you knew who was introverted and extroverted over the entire competition over the 160 years the competition has been going the ratio would be identical to the ratio of introverts to extroverts in the general population. And if you looked specifically at the premiers of each year it would be the same. Introvert/extrovert is not a requirement to be a professional footballer who can perform a role within a successful team. Drive and competitiveness would be more important to me.



I agree

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2023 1:30 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:38 pm
Posts: 7640
Hi everyone just confirming I think Motlop is a real prospect and last year nailed some good goals this year has missed quite a bit kicked a few but has been infected like everyone else in kicking for goal
He and Durdin need to work on their defensive pressure and where to be when the ball is bombed to our talks and they don’t mark it
I’m all for continuing to play him and Durdin to develop on the basis we are 13 th and need to build for the future whilst I don’t think their output is anything to write home about to date this year
Having said that when only 2 players Cerra and Newman have had better years than last year the whole side need a collective boot up the bum and so do the coaching staff


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