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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2022 7:34 am 
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Stephen Kernahan

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Teddy Hopkins wrote:
All these different teams being thrown around look good on paper.

But they all have a problem. PACE.

If a kick does not hit its target and we are not the greatest kicking side ..,. oh, oh.


The quickest teams suffer from bad kicking. The trick is to minimise the turnovers.

We have improved our field kicking, but agree we can improve that even more.

I think we have a bit of pace teddy. Pittonet is our only statue imo, and Weitering is too heavy to sprint. Otherwise I think our talls are quick for their size.

There's only a few with express speed in the whole competition.

Its quick ball movement that's key, and the thing that made us look great in the midfield last year was our ability to take the tackle, free the arms and give it off. Running to the right spots was key.

Saad Williams and Docherty are quick. Docherty in the middle in the last 2 rounds was a revelation with his take off speed. Boyd is quick. Durdin is quick.

Ball movement and spread improved till injury hit us and we started bombing it instead of linking. That's where the improvement can come from in 2023.

We are not slow, and that's why we were so entertaining to watch in the first half, and in the last 2 rounds our one quarters bursts. Just have to do it for longer.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2022 12:38 pm 
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formerly BlueRob
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If it came down to a choice between Martin and JSOS I would pick JSOS every day. He gives you bang for your buck. When Martin is firing its great ... just that he does not fire too often.
JSOS is an automatic selection in my opinion.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2022 12:52 pm 
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Geoff Southby

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BigBlueWave wrote:
If it came down to a choice between Martin and JSOS I would pick JSOS every day. He gives you bang for your buck. When Martin is firing its great ... just that he does not fire too often.
JSOS is an automatic selection in my opinion.

Same

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2022 5:10 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 9:36 am
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I wouldn't. Martin improves our team a lot more than SOJ can, as much as I admire the way SOJ plays.


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 Post subject: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:34 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 12:18 pm
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Stefchook wrote:
I wouldn't. Martin improves our team a lot more than SOJ can, as much as I admire the way SOJ plays.


Martin very occasionally improves our team a lot more than SOJ can pretty much all the time.


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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2022 11:25 pm 
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Geoff Southby

Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2009 7:24 pm
Posts: 5318
Location: Bridge, Starship Enterprise
bondiblue wrote:
Teddy Hopkins wrote:
All these different teams being thrown around look good on paper.

But they all have a problem. PACE.

If a kick does not hit its target and we are not the greatest kicking side ..,. oh, oh.


The quickest teams suffer from bad kicking. The trick is to minimise the turnovers.

We have improved our field kicking, but agree we can improve that even more.

I think we have a bit of pace teddy. Pittonet is our only statue imo, and Weitering is too heavy to sprint. Otherwise I think our talls are quick for their size.

There's only a few with express speed in the whole competition.

Its quick ball movement that's key, and the thing that made us look great in the midfield last year was our ability to take the tackle, free the arms and give it off. Running to the right spots was key.

Saad Williams and Docherty are quick. Docherty in the middle in the last 2 rounds was a revelation with his take off speed. Boyd is quick. Durdin is quick.

Ball movement and spread improved till injury hit us and we started bombing it instead of linking. That's where the improvement can come from in 2023.

We are not slow, and that's why we were so entertaining to watch in the first half, and in the last 2 rounds our one quarters bursts. Just have to do it for longer.

Usually agree with you bondi but not this post.

If our kicking was elite which it isn't it may be another matter. If it goes up a notch next season, another matter.

Of the players you mention, Williams, Saad and Boyd have express speed. Williams and Boyd were injured most of the year leaving Saad.

Durdin is quick but at this stage of his development cannot get the ball enough.

Docherty can run but real speed? Don't think so.

Another mid in the draft and apart from the ability to go when its his turn, the non negotiable is speed. I may as well throw in the ability to kick.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2022 8:55 am 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
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How many players in the premiership team have express speed? Or the runners up?

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2022 10:14 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Blue Vain wrote:
How many players in the premiership team have express speed? Or the runners up?


Yeah , most overrated commodity in football . Kick a footy and it travels faster than any player can run .

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2022 10:37 am 
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Geoff Southby

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Mickstar wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
How many players in the premiership team have express speed? Or the runners up?


Yeah , most overrated commodity in football . Kick a footy and it travels faster than any player can run .

I am pushing for express speed as we do not have the higher priority, elite kicking. The great hawk teams were slow but wonderful kicks.

If we could get both, bliss.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2022 10:56 am 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
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Location: Bondi Beach
Teddy Hopkins wrote:
Mickstar wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
How many players in the premiership team have express speed? Or the runners up?


Yeah , most overrated commodity in football . Kick a footy and it travels faster than any player can run .

I am pushing for express speed as we do not have the higher priority, elite kicking. The great hawk teams were slow but wonderful kicks.

If we could get both, bliss.


It wouldn't hurt.

On the Docherty impression, those 2 last games of the season when Doch was thrown into the middle, his take off speed was impressive, as he left his opponents in his wake. Maybe his quickness of mind to make the right decision, where to run helps, but he's got speed nevertheless.

We are relying on injuries to be more favourable in 2023 to allow the likes of Williams, Boyd to use their god given speed.

Other than the bombing forward, I thought our kicking was better than the previous years. I dont have the numbers, but it felt from round 1 that ball use was better when we tried to keep possession and control of the ball.

Durdin's preseason and early games showcased his speed. When we saw Owies and Durdin in defence, we knew their roles changed. Lets hope the next layers on Vossy's plan brings out their weapons.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2022 11:00 am 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
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Location: Bondi Beach
Mickstar wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
How many players in the premiership team have express speed? Or the runners up?


Yeah , most overrated commodity in football . Kick a footy and it travels faster than any player can run .


True.

Lucas and Boekhurst, both round 1 picks were selected for the breakaway speed. Didnt help them much.

Armfield's speed was handy.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2022 11:52 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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bondiblue wrote:
Mickstar wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
How many players in the premiership team have express speed? Or the runners up?


Yeah , most overrated commodity in football . Kick a footy and it travels faster than any player can run .


True.

Lucas and Boekhurst, both round 1 picks were selected for the breakaway speed. Didnt help them much.

Armfield's speed was handy.


I reckon your previous post said it all Bondi . Speed of mind . Get on your bike while the others are thinking about it .

PS..........played for Rye hey . Great side back then .

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2022 12:34 pm 
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Geoff Southby

Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2005 4:04 pm
Posts: 5139
Location: Bendigo
Mickstar wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
How many players in the premiership team have express speed? Or the runners up?


Yeah , most overrated commodity in football . Kick a footy and it travels faster than any player can run .

Slight pressure on the kick and the odds shorten.

Throw in a defender that’s had a good long look at the action and you’ve gone from chocolates to boiled lollies.

Speed is pressure.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2022 3:01 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
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Some of the quickest players in the AFL wouldn't know what pressure looks like.
Pressure comes from intent, structure and mindset.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2022 10:26 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 9:36 am
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I'm with Crusader on this. Speed doesn't guarantee pressure, but it makes it a lot easier. Once the ball gets out in space, we struggle to apply enough pressure to win the ball back. If we're really committed to AFL all-ground pressure, I think we need more leg speed.


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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2022 8:47 am 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
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Location: Bondi Beach
Stefchook wrote:
I'm with Crusader on this. Speed doesn't guarantee pressure, but it makes it a lot easier. Once the ball gets out in space, we struggle to apply enough pressure to win the ball back. If we're really committed to AFL all-ground pressure, I think we need more leg speed.


Cottrell's and Saad's speed supports your position. Their speed is an obvious weapon when closing down space and applying pressure on an opponent.

Who is too slow?

I think Pittonet, Weitering and Silvagni are slow, with the former 2 required to be strong and heavy enough to hold position and compete against the gorillas.

Cripps isnt quick but he's an inside bull, and when he has the ball he knows what to do to draw an opponent, free his arms and give it off or, confident and smart enough to create space and run with the ball.

Who is too slow from the rest of the best 25?

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2022 11:41 am 
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Geoff Southby

Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2005 4:04 pm
Posts: 5139
Location: Bendigo
bondiblue wrote:
Stefchook wrote:
I'm with Crusader on this. Speed doesn't guarantee pressure, but it makes it a lot easier. Once the ball gets out in space, we struggle to apply enough pressure to win the ball back. If we're really committed to AFL all-ground pressure, I think we need more leg speed.


Cottrell's and Saad's speed supports your position. Their speed is an obvious weapon when closing down space and applying pressure on an opponent.

Who is too slow?

I think Pittonet, Weitering and Silvagni are slow, with the former 2 required to be strong and heavy enough to hold position and compete against the gorillas.

Cripps isnt quick but he's an inside bull, and when he has the ball he knows what to do to draw an opponent, free his arms and give it off or, confident and smart enough to create space and run with the ball.

Who is too slow from the rest of the best 25?

Cripps, Kennedy, George, Doc, Williams, Marchbank, Motlop, Fisher & O’Brien - although I haven’t got him in my best 25.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2022 3:13 pm 
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John Nicholls
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Doc & Williams are slow?


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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2022 3:49 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

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GreatEx wrote:
Doc & Williams are slow?


I agree, these 2 are very quick off the mark.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2022 3:55 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
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Location: Bondi Beach
Crusader wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
Stefchook wrote:
I'm with Crusader on this. Speed doesn't guarantee pressure, but it makes it a lot easier. Once the ball gets out in space, we struggle to apply enough pressure to win the ball back. If we're really committed to AFL all-ground pressure, I think we need more leg speed.


Cottrell's and Saad's speed supports your position. Their speed is an obvious weapon when closing down space and applying pressure on an opponent.

Who is too slow?

I think Pittonet, Weitering and Silvagni are slow, with the former 2 required to be strong and heavy enough to hold position and compete against the gorillas.

Cripps isnt quick but he's an inside bull, and when he has the ball he knows what to do to draw an opponent, free his arms and give it off or, confident and smart enough to create space and run with the ball.

Who is too slow from the rest of the best 25?

Cripps, Kennedy, George, Doc, Williams, Marchbank, Motlop, Fisher & O’Brien - although I haven’t got him in my best 25.


Marchbank will surprise. he's quicker than Cripps, Hewett and Kennedy over 20m.
I wouldnt be surprised if he was quicker than Motlop Fisher and OBrien over 20m ... also just out of my best 25

But get your point.

If say Hind from Effendopes was available would you replace any of the abovementioned with him? He has express speed.

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