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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2023 5:34 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
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carntheblues wrote:
Sam Durdin a better fit than Young because...?


I don't mind it. He's a much better ball user.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2023 6:37 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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aboynamedsue wrote:
A few speculative inclusions there Doc! eg. TDK ahead of Pittonet; and the inclusion of Boyd, Philp, Hollands, S.Durdin & Kemp ahead of 2022 regulars (when fit) C.Durdin, Owies, Newman, Young & LOB.
And I take it you’re not expecting to see Walsh in 2023?


Agree. Pittonet, Young and C Durdin are b22.


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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2023 7:30 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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aboynamedsue wrote:
A few speculative inclusions there Doc! eg. TDK ahead of Pittonet; and the inclusion of Boyd, Philp, Hollands, S.Durdin & Kemp ahead of 2022 regulars (when fit) C.Durdin, Owies, Newman, Young & LOB.
And I take it you’re not expecting to see Walsh in 2023?


All correct ABNS. Last point first. I'm not expecting to see Sam this year, but hope I'm wrong. TDK is my first choice ruck. I think a bit more strength and knowledge garnered will see him excel. Of course, when necessary - Pittonet will be there as well and JSOS won't get a game. I don't necessarily see the controversy with Boyd and Sam Durdin. Durdin with a full pre-season, better understanding of game plan and fit for AFL level is a safer bet then Young in the one-on-one defender stakes. While Young improved, I do see a lot of weaknesses in his game. Newman is the only one I felt bad about. He'll see plenty of action this season, but I just couldn't get him in ahead of the others he's competing against.

Corey Durdin should see game time as well, but small forward is a stacked position these days. Motlop gets a game in front of him and Fisher can play elsewhere giving more flexibility. If Corey goes back to the magoos, I'd like to see him tried (in stints) on the ball, because he needs to add another string to the bow. Owies has good pressure craft, but there's not enough output for mine. Philp (touch wood) is having a good summer. The kid can run all day and could even go and collect the easy disposal in the backline that Walsh (rightly or wrongly) would get. Still 21, I think there's an AFL footballer in there and one with decent footy IQ.

Hollands is young, slim and untried at this level. Great! Chuck him in the deep end. There's not many natural wingmen on the list. I have high expectations but I'd like to see him early. There's only one way to learn and that's on the job. And that doesn't mean out on suburban fields playing with blokes who run around like 5 year olds chasing a soccer ball. I don't want him in the VFL. Ever.

Ok...who have I not spoken about? Oh...LOB. Ok. I can't find a spot for him. If he was a better decision maker He might have been on the bench.

Even without Walsh - that's a strong side. And it's a very strong side if the likes of McGovern, Williams and Martin have really good seasons and the stars star and the role players role play.


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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2023 5:35 pm 
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Geoff Southby
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Thanks Doc, fair points.

If they both stay fit, it’ll be good signs if TDK goes past Pittonet. Personally, I’m not sure he’s quite there yet. And I reckon we can only play them both together if one can become a forward threat when not rucking. I don’t see that happening because both look to me like genuine rucks, rather than hybrid forward/rucks.

Based on 2022, I can’t prefer S.Durdin to Young at this stage. Young is not the finished product but it was a solid first up season IMO. I take the point that S.Durdin could be an improver in 2023, but I need him to convince me.

Sadly, I think you might be right about Walsh.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2023 10:53 pm 
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Craig Bradley

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I had Boyd in my starting 22 as well. Pity about his injury. Newman, I guess, will replace him, and probably deserves to. I had Boyd ahead of Newman, because he's an even better kick than Newman. And also he adds much needed speed to the team.


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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2023 7:08 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Stefchook wrote:
I had Boyd in my starting 22 as well. Pity about his injury. Newman, I guess, will replace him, and probably deserves to. I had Boyd ahead of Newman, because he's an even better kick than Newman. And also he adds much needed speed to the team.


Same

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2023 12:19 pm 
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Robert Walls

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Assuming everyone is 100% fit and in form -

Our oldest team:

B: Newman - S. Durdin - Marchbank
HB: Williams - Weitering - Saad
C: Docherty - Cripps - Acres
HF: Martin - C. Curnow - Fisher
F: Owies - McKay - Silvagni
R: Pittonet - Kennedy - Hewett

INT: E. Curnow - McGovern - Plowman - Cuningham


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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2023 12:28 pm 
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Robert Walls

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Assuming everyone is fit and in-form:

Our Youngest Team:

B: Akuei - Young - Boyd
HB: Cowan - Kemp - Cottrell
C: O'Brien - Cerra - Carroll
HF: Fisher - Lemmey - Philp
F: Motlop - Honey - C. Durdin
R: De Koning - Dow - Walsh

Fogarty - Mirkov - Binns - Hollands


Last edited by bluechampion on Wed Jan 18, 2023 12:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2023 12:36 pm 
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Robert Walls

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Assuming everyone is fit and in-form:

Our most experienced (by games played) team:

B: Marchbank - Weitering - Newman
HB: Saad - McGovern - Williams
C: Acres - Cripps - Docherty
HF: Martin - C. Curnow - Fisher
F: Kennedy - McKay - E. Curnow
R: Silvagni - Cerra - Walsh

INT: Hewett - Plowman - Dow - O'Brien


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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2023 9:16 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Quote:
Adam Cooney has gone through the squad and named his Carlton best 22 ahead of the 2023 season.

The Blues approach the season full of hope, having not played finals for 10 years, but Cooney believes they boast one of the strongest lists on paper in the competition.

The side does not include star midfielder Sam Walsh, who is recovering from back surgery, though a spot on the wing is open for him once he returns.


https://www.sen.com.au/news/2023/01/23/brownlow-medallists-carlton-best-22-for-2023/

Quote:
FB: Lewis Young, Jacob Weitering, Sam Docherty
HB: Adam Saad, Mitch McGovern, Zac Williams
C: Lochie O’Brien*, Patrick Cripps, Blake Acres
HF: Zac Fisher, Charlie Curnow, Matthew Kennedy
FF: Jack Martin, Harry McKay, Jesse Motlop
Fol: Tom De Koning, George Hewett, Adam Cerra
INT: Marc Pittonet, Nic Newman, Corey Durdin, Jack Silvagni

*Until Sam Walsh returns


Last week Cooney said Boyd was an elite kick, one of the best he has seen and expected Boyd to have a break out year in 2023. He isn't named in Cooney's Best 23.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2023 9:18 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Thankd for those teams Bluechampion.

Very interesting and convinces me that our list has got good balance in all positions and age groups.

Its time to explode in 2023.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 1:51 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:10 am
Posts: 1495
I have been to 3 training sessions since New Year. Based on that and a few conversations I reckon Rd 1 will look a lot like this

B: Williams Young McGovern
HB: Cowan Weitering Saad
C: Acres Cripps O'Brien
HF: Martin McKay Fisher
F: Curnow TDK Motlop
Foll: Pittonet Hewett Docherty
Int: Cerra C.Durdin Newman Kennedy Silvagni

Hollands will be close but I think they will be patient
Interesting how they use Silvagni if they play two rucks
Boyd Walsh Cuningham Fogarty Honey Cottrell not considered
Marchbank & Carroll very unlucky


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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 3:00 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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I do love this thread.

Cheers everyone


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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 6:13 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 23030
Location: Bondi Beach
FarmerBlue wrote:
I have been to 3 training sessions since New Year. Based on that and a few conversations I reckon Rd 1 will look a lot like this

B: Williams Young McGovern
HB: Cowan Weitering Saad
C: Acres Cripps O'Brien
HF: Martin McKay Fisher
F: Curnow TDK Motlop
Foll: Pittonet Hewett Docherty
Int: Cerra C.Durdin Newman Kennedy Silvagni

Hollands will be close but I think they will be patient
Interesting how they use Silvagni if they play two rucks
Boyd Walsh Cuningham Fogarty Honey Cottrell not considered
Marchbank & Carroll very unlucky


I'd be happy to go watch and back the Blues vs Tigers with that team. :thumbsup:

Re Carroll: I'm not convinced his foot skills are better than Dow's.

I'd pick Marchbank ahead of Cowan, but isn't it fantastic Cowan is in the conversation.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:54 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2005 4:04 pm
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Location: Bendigo
FarmerBlue wrote:
I have been to 3 training sessions since New Year. Based on that and a few conversations I reckon Rd 1 will look a lot like this

B: Williams Young McGovern
HB: Cowan Weitering Saad
C: Acres Cripps O'Brien
HF: Martin McKay Fisher
F: Curnow TDK Motlop
Foll: Pittonet Hewett Docherty
Int: Cerra C.Durdin Newman Kennedy Silvagni

Hollands will be close but I think they will be patient
Interesting how they use Silvagni if they play two rucks
Boyd Walsh Cuningham Fogarty Honey Cottrell not considered
Marchbank & Carroll very unlucky

Sure, why not?

I mean, the two and a half rucks will be a short-lived experiment - and an unwashable stain on Vossy’s season if we get dummied between the arcs like last time… but yeah, in it to win it.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 9:56 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 23030
Location: Bondi Beach
Crusader wrote:
FarmerBlue wrote:
I have been to 3 training sessions since New Year. Based on that and a few conversations I reckon Rd 1 will look a lot like this

B: Williams Young McGovern
HB: Cowan Weitering Saad
C: Acres Cripps O'Brien
HF: Martin McKay Fisher
F: Curnow TDK Motlop
Foll: Pittonet Hewett Docherty
Int: Cerra C.Durdin Newman Kennedy Silvagni

Hollands will be close but I think they will be patient
Interesting how they use Silvagni if they play two rucks
Boyd Walsh Cuningham Fogarty Honey Cottrell not considered
Marchbank & Carroll very unlucky

Sure, why not?

I mean, the two and a half rucks will be a short-lived experiment - and an unwashable stain on Vossy’s season if we get dummied between the arcs like last time… but yeah, in it to win it.


I'm guessing the 2.5 rucks are the selection of Pitto, TDK and SOS as the half.

I've been fortunate to have watched the 22 rounds over a 2 and 3 day period between visitors this January.

We looked surprisingly very good in the first 5 rounds before Pitto got injured in round 6: 4 wins, 1 loss.

Towards the end of the season I agreed with Voss decision to drop SOS and play with 2 bonafide rucks because I thought he was a tad slow defensively (in the F50 arc).

Having watched the 2022 season closely I have to change my viewpoint and say SOS was a valuable player most weeks, and apart from the Freo loss and the Brizzy loss I thought the rucks were not the reason we failed to win enough after round 17 (vs Crows). Our injuries from round 17 included: Kennedy, Walsh, Hewett, Cerra, Williams, Boyd and Newman. Injuries to our mids and small defenders cost us, and getting games into TDK were priceless.

I thought playing 1.5 rucks against McInerney was where we failed, but throwing Young in the ruck, to make up our 2.5 rucks was a revelation, but we were robbing our KPD to pay for our ruck.

I think you're being a bit tough suggesting the 2.5 rucks was the "unwashable stain on Vossy's season".

Pitto is the strongest ruck, TDK is developing and SOS is a lead up target. I have a feeling that may continue in 2023 given SOS form in the preseason playing the lead up role. I like 3 talls and 3 smalls in the forwardline. I guess that implies the rotation of the 2.5 should be the bench. Pity Pitto isnt a dangerous forward, and TDK is not a reliable kick for goal (Ditto SOS).

Maybe the Voss strategy is a good one, but the players haven't been performing at the level we expect for 4 quarters and 22 games. The question is will they all improve in 2023, and I'm curious what Voss and the MC do with the rucks, let alone what happens to TDK's contract.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:27 am 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:10 am
Posts: 1495
bondiblue wrote:
Crusader wrote:
FarmerBlue wrote:
I have been to 3 training sessions since New Year. Based on that and a few conversations I reckon Rd 1 will look a lot like this

B: Williams Young McGovern
HB: Cowan Weitering Saad
C: Acres Cripps O'Brien
HF: Martin McKay Fisher
F: Curnow TDK Motlop
Foll: Pittonet Hewett Docherty
Int: Cerra C.Durdin Newman Kennedy Silvagni

Hollands will be close but I think they will be patient
Interesting how they use Silvagni if they play two rucks
Boyd Walsh Cuningham Fogarty Honey Cottrell not considered
Marchbank & Carroll very unlucky

Sure, why not?

I mean, the two and a half rucks will be a short-lived experiment - and an unwashable stain on Vossy’s season if we get dummied between the arcs like last time… but yeah, in it to win it.


I'm guessing the 2.5 rucks are the selection of Pitto, TDK and SOS as the half.

I've been fortunate to have watched the 22 rounds over a 2 and 3 day period between visitors this January.

We looked surprisingly very good in the first 5 rounds before Pitto got injured in round 6: 4 wins, 1 loss.

Towards the end of the season I agreed with Voss decision to drop SOS and play with 2 bonafide rucks because I thought he was a tad slow defensively (in the F50 arc).

Having watched the 2022 season closely I have to change my viewpoint and say SOS was a valuable player most weeks, and apart from the Freo loss and the Brizzy loss I thought the rucks were not the reason we failed to win enough after round 17 (vs Crows). Our injuries from round 17 included: Kennedy, Walsh, Hewett, Cerra, Williams, Boyd and Newman. Injuries to our mids and small defenders cost us, and getting games into TDK were priceless.

I thought playing 1.5 rucks against McInerney was where we failed, but throwing Young in the ruck, to make up our 2.5 rucks was a revelation, but we were robbing our KPD to pay for our ruck.

I think you're being a bit tough suggesting the 2.5 rucks was the "unwashable stain on Vossy's season".

Pitto is the strongest ruck, TDK is developing and SOS is a lead up target. I have a feeling that may continue in 2023 given SOS form in the preseason playing the lead up role. I like 3 talls and 3 smalls in the forwardline. I guess that implies the rotation of the 2.5 should be the bench. Pity Pitto isnt a dangerous forward, and TDK is not a reliable kick for goal (Ditto SOS).

Maybe the Voss strategy is a good one, but the players haven't been performing at the level we expect for 4 quarters and 22 games. The question is will they all improve in 2023, and I'm curious what Voss and the MC do with the rucks, let alone what happens to TDK's contract.


I reckon two rucks work if you have two very good rucks. It's why Melbourne went for Grundy to support Gawn

TDK can also go forward and it stretches a defence. He will get a lot better with more games. Still so young

Our best football last year was with Pittonet in the side. He is underrated.


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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:39 am 
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Geoff Southby
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 7:40 pm
Posts: 5990
FarmerBlue wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
Crusader wrote:
FarmerBlue wrote:
I have been to 3 training sessions since New Year. Based on that and a few conversations I reckon Rd 1 will look a lot like this

B: Williams Young McGovern
HB: Cowan Weitering Saad
C: Acres Cripps O'Brien
HF: Martin McKay Fisher
F: Curnow TDK Motlop
Foll: Pittonet Hewett Docherty
Int: Cerra C.Durdin Newman Kennedy Silvagni

Hollands will be close but I think they will be patient
Interesting how they use Silvagni if they play two rucks
Boyd Walsh Cuningham Fogarty Honey Cottrell not considered
Marchbank & Carroll very unlucky

Sure, why not?

I mean, the two and a half rucks will be a short-lived experiment - and an unwashable stain on Vossy’s season if we get dummied between the arcs like last time… but yeah, in it to win it.


I'm guessing the 2.5 rucks are the selection of Pitto, TDK and SOS as the half.

I've been fortunate to have watched the 22 rounds over a 2 and 3 day period between visitors this January.

We looked surprisingly very good in the first 5 rounds before Pitto got injured in round 6: 4 wins, 1 loss.

Towards the end of the season I agreed with Voss decision to drop SOS and play with 2 bonafide rucks because I thought he was a tad slow defensively (in the F50 arc).

Having watched the 2022 season closely I have to change my viewpoint and say SOS was a valuable player most weeks, and apart from the Freo loss and the Brizzy loss I thought the rucks were not the reason we failed to win enough after round 17 (vs Crows). Our injuries from round 17 included: Kennedy, Walsh, Hewett, Cerra, Williams, Boyd and Newman. Injuries to our mids and small defenders cost us, and getting games into TDK were priceless.

I thought playing 1.5 rucks against McInerney was where we failed, but throwing Young in the ruck, to make up our 2.5 rucks was a revelation, but we were robbing our KPD to pay for our ruck.

I think you're being a bit tough suggesting the 2.5 rucks was the "unwashable stain on Vossy's season".

Pitto is the strongest ruck, TDK is developing and SOS is a lead up target. I have a feeling that may continue in 2023 given SOS form in the preseason playing the lead up role. I like 3 talls and 3 smalls in the forwardline. I guess that implies the rotation of the 2.5 should be the bench. Pity Pitto isnt a dangerous forward, and TDK is not a reliable kick for goal (Ditto SOS).

Maybe the Voss strategy is a good one, but the players haven't been performing at the level we expect for 4 quarters and 22 games. The question is will they all improve in 2023, and I'm curious what Voss and the MC do with the rucks, let alone what happens to TDK's contract.


I reckon two rucks work if you have two very good rucks. It's why Melbourne went for Grundy to support Gawn

TDK can also go forward and it stretches a defence. He will get a lot better with more games. Still so young

Our best football last year was with Pittonet in the side. He is underrated.


So true Farm's . We play better football when Pitto is in the side . He starts slow and works his way into the game with the emphasis on WORK . He is a workhouse . Real tradie blue collar type of player who compliments the more athletic and flamboyant Tommy DK . Reckon Pitto and Tommy DK with there differing style's are a great combination who will create lots of headaches for the opposition . Good bigmen hurt you in the air .

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 12:09 pm 
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Geoff Southby
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Posts: 5834
FarmerBlue wrote:
TDK can also go forward.

This gets said a lot, but TDK has never shown anything as a forward IMO. He is a good ruck prospect and looks like the sort of player who needs to be running around on the ball. He is the second best ruckman on our list, and may be our first choice ruck within the next year or two, but I wouldn’t have confidence in him as a KPP at either end of the ground at the moment. If he can stay healthy, his development should be fascinating this year.

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 Post subject: Re: Best 23 Team in 2023
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 1:40 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:10 am
Posts: 1495
aboynamedsue wrote:
FarmerBlue wrote:
TDK can also go forward.

This gets said a lot, but TDK has never shown anything as a forward IMO. He is a good ruck prospect and looks like the sort of player who needs to be running around on the ball. He is the second best ruckman on our list, and may be our first choice ruck within the next year or two, but I wouldn’t have confidence in him as a KPP at either end of the ground at the moment. If he can stay healthy, his development should be fascinating this year.


You cut off half my sentence. Makes a difference

"TDK can also go forward and it stretches a defence. He will get a lot better with more games. Still so young"


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