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PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 4:19 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2005 4:04 pm
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Location: Bendigo
bondiblue wrote:
cortez wrote:
I don't know that we should be getting too excited about McGovern's return. He's played 35 of a possible 88 games with us, including 7 last year and 2 so far in 2022, and you could count the decent games amongst them on one hand. Yes, I know his two games this year were good, but with his hamstring issues it's hard to feel confident about him stringing too many games together good or bad.



This year is the only thing that counts.

Gov hasn't done his hammy for 16 weeks. :wink:
Maybe he's been rebuilt.

Always got to go with best available.

I recall Lions 2nd and 3rd Flag they bought in their injury prone ruckman Clark Keating for the Finals.
Without Chapman, the Lions would not have won 3 in a row.

Jamie Charman could barely drag himself through half a game.

The running capacity of players today means that modern footy bares only a faint resemblance to what we had 20 years ago.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 4:46 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Crusader wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
cortez wrote:
I don't know that we should be getting too excited about McGovern's return. He's played 35 of a possible 88 games with us, including 7 last year and 2 so far in 2022, and you could count the decent games amongst them on one hand. Yes, I know his two games this year were good, but with his hamstring issues it's hard to feel confident about him stringing too many games together good or bad.



This year is the only thing that counts.

Gov hasn't done his hammy for 16 weeks. :wink:
Maybe he's been rebuilt.

Always got to go with best available.

I recall Lions 2nd and 3rd Flag they bought in their injury prone ruckman Clark Keating for the Finals.
Without Chapman, the Lions would not have won 3 in a row.

Jamie Charman could barely drag himself through half a game.

The running capacity of players today means that modern footy bares only a faint resemblance to what we had 20 years ago.


True.

Yeah...thanks, Chapman.

He was bed ridden for most of the year but the S&G got him up and he went full pelt mental and set up the win in the GF. Different era for sure.

I hope Gov comes back with all his damaged goods in good working order.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 6:36 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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keogh wrote:
kingkerna wrote:
CK95 wrote:
We looked really short of a dangerous medium forward to me.

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Put honey away until next season. Zero impact.

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Like Jack Martin



Yes you are right. Jack didn't have much impact on the game last night.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 6:39 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Blue Vain wrote:
rhino27 wrote:
JSOS tonight no right foot or left foot.


I love Jack's competitiveness but he got well ahead of himself tonight. Continually flew against Charlie and Harry with zero effect other than bringing his opponent into the contest.
He probably called for handballs 3 or 4 times in the first quarter. 2 or 3 times from a player who was better placed to kick the ball including Durdin who could have kicked the goal from the goalsquare.

We overpossessed the football instead of trusting our forwards and getting the ball in there. When the heat is on, you cant keep looking for the perfect disposal. Finals footy will find you out if you don't recognise the times to take territory.

Surprise, surprise, playing Cerra on the wing was a bust. He couldn't get into the game and we missed his accountability in the middle. Fisher refused to man up Zac Jones and was consistently beaten. Stocker should have come in and that decision combined with the related positional changes (Cerra/Newnes) were surprising moves by the coaches and frankly, they were piss poor ideas.

I hate losing but when you have many more opportunities only to piss them up against the wall, that kills.
Mix that with some abysmal turnovers in the middle of the ground and that was the ball game. We have been playing disciplined, conservative football out of defence but tonight Young and O'Brien decided to kick shitful floaters into the centre square. WTF is that about? as I've said elsewhere, Young is an athletic defender of a good size but his kicking is very poor.
Like last week Kemp fought back but he was towelled up early. He just refused to play in front.
We're desperate to get Pitt back. The Saints rucks continually stepped across the line and took away TDK's strength. His leap.



I agree BV. TDK got pantsed and to me was the biggest issue apart from our poor kicking both for goal and in general around the ground. Need Pittonet back urgently to right the ship otherwise we are always going to be 50:50 in close games.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 6:49 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:10 am
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Quote:
carntheblues wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
rhino27 wrote:
JSOS tonight no right foot or left foot.


I love Jack's competitiveness but he got well ahead of himself tonight. Continually flew against Charlie and Harry with zero effect other than bringing his opponent into the contest.
He probably called for handballs 3 or 4 times in the first quarter. 2 or 3 times from a player who was better placed to kick the ball including Durdin who could have kicked the goal from the goalsquare.

We overpossessed the football instead of trusting our forwards and getting the ball in there. When the heat is on, you cant keep looking for the perfect disposal. Finals footy will find you out if you don't recognise the times to take territory.

Surprise, surprise, playing Cerra on the wing was a bust. He couldn't get into the game and we missed his accountability in the middle. Fisher refused to man up Zac Jones and was consistently beaten. Stocker should have come in and that decision combined with the related positional changes (Cerra/Newnes) were surprising moves by the coaches and frankly, they were piss poor ideas.

I hate losing but when you have many more opportunities only to piss them up against the wall, that kills.
Mix that with some abysmal turnovers in the middle of the ground and that was the ball game. We have been playing disciplined, conservative football out of defence but tonight Young and O'Brien decided to kick shitful floaters into the centre square. WTF is that about? as I've said elsewhere, Young is an athletic defender of a good size but his kicking is very poor.
Like last week Kemp fought back but he was towelled up early. He just refused to play in front.
We're desperate to get Pitt back. The Saints rucks continually stepped across the line and took away TDK's strength. His leap.



I agree BV. TDK got pantsed and to me was the biggest issue apart from our poor kicking both for goal and in general around the ground. Need Pittonet back urgently to right the ship otherwise we are always going to be 50:50 in close games.


100%. TDK & Silvagni have been carrying our ruck for 10 weeks now and doing a heck of a job but neither is a No.1 ruck. TDK not yet anyway. Marshall & Ryder destroyed us last night

It’s also lessening Silvagni’s effectiveness. He plays ruck and then goes forward and is buggered. If he’s purely playing third forward he has more energy, is more effective and as a flow on helps Charlie & McKay much more. Then there is the ability to have TDK up forward and stretch any defence. Not to mention giving our mids first use of the ball.

It’s why Pittonet is so vital


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 9:13 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

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jezzarules wrote:


https://twitter.com/UptheBaggers/status ... 9485063170


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:46 am 
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Bob Chitty

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 8:25 pm
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bondiblue wrote:
My Bottom 6

1. Cerra
2. Honey
3. LOB
4. Kemp
5. Durdin
6. Newnes

I wasn't happy with the following performances either:
- Jack
- Curnow
No room for Plowman on that list?
He has been better this year but this game was back to his old disappointing self.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:58 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:28 pm
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BigGartos wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
My Bottom 6

1. Cerra
2. Honey
3. LOB
4. Kemp
5. Durdin
6. Newnes

I wasn't happy with the following performances either:
- Jack
- Curnow
No room for Plowman on that list?
He has been better this year but this game was back to his old disappointing self.

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I thought Kemp was OK - he's not suited to playing on the gorilla's but I hope they keep him in the side as a 3rd tall in defence.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2022 11:27 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
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Humpers wrote:
BigGartos wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
My Bottom 6

1. Cerra
2. Honey
3. LOB
4. Kemp
5. Durdin
6. Newnes

I wasn't happy with the following performances either:
- Jack
- Curnow
No room for Plowman on that list?
He has been better this year but this game was back to his old disappointing self.

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I thought Kemp was OK - he's not suited to playing on the gorilla's but I hope they keep him in the side as a 3rd tall in defence.


Bottom 6 doesn't imply they didn't play OK. They are the bottom 6 IMO.

Plowman made mistakes, Charlie made mistakes, Jack made mistakes, but they also had more highlights than the abovementioned.

Looking at selections from the outset of the season Weitering, McDonald, McGovern, were all selected before Plowman. These days you can add the name Young ahead of Plowman too, and when Jones was on the list you could add another ahead of Plowman. How many ahead of Plow when fit? 5. I'd add Marchy ahead of Plow if both fit. Doesn't mean I don't appreciate all the good things Plow does when picking my bottom 6.

Kemp is developing. Only selected because we are scraping the bottom of the barrel. In 2022 he'd be 7th in line in a defensive post. IMO

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2022 11:40 am 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:10 am
Posts: 1495
kingkerna wrote:
FarmerBlue wrote:
Mickstar wrote:
FarmerBlue wrote:
Disappointed but injuries to so many key players brings inconsistencies.

Kick straight and we win and I thought last night highlighted how valuable Pittonet & Weitering are and we still could have won.

Even playing poorly and missing players out structure holds up. We’ve come a long way this year but have improvement to come


I"ll go further than that . I reckon Weitering and McGovern are as important to us as Steven May and Jake Lever are to the Dee's .

P S ....................round of applause for Keogh . Thats pretty good " Special K ".


Weitering makes our defence so much better for so many reasons. McGovern as well. We are a 5-6 goal better side with them in.

I haven't been a bagger of Plowman before but he isn't a best 22 player. Kemp, McGovern and/or Marchbank are much much better options as third tall
Oh we should have played McGovern or Marchbank eh. Why didn't we? Stupid us!


Bit hard when they're injured? But when available Plowman isn't then an option IMO


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2022 2:00 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 2:15 pm
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Blue Vain wrote:
And whilst I'm at it, a couple of further comments on players. :grin:
Harry McKay. He has gone from being easily the most self focussed, selfish player in our team to absolutely buying into the coaches team mantra.
He is getting less goals but he has become a star team mate. Chases, tackles and works in tandem with Charlie to drag his opponent away when the time is right.
You cant win premierships without that absolute buy-in and he has far exceeded my expectations. He's a gun.

Patrick Cripps. Busting his guts every week but he had an opportunity last night to assist Jesse Motlop and he didn't follow it through. Motlop won the ball on the wing, ran away from his opponent and Cripps ran along side if Motlop wanted to give it off. Reverse that and put Jack Steele in the same situation. Without doubt Steele would have come across, shepherded the chasing player and put his team mate in space.
Imagine how powerful it would have been for Motlop to see the captain sacrifice his own opportunity so the youngster can make the play. It also would have sent a message to Motlop and the other youngsters that if it's good enough for the captain to sacrifice, it's good enough for everyone else.
Leadership.
That's why JSOS get's away with it and I hope Voss is following though on it. No need to highlight in in front of the group but get the captain into his office and show him the clip.
It's a small part of the process but it's what will drive the ultimate outcome. Full buy in with no exceptions.
BV you know I have been a fan of Harry for a while and I agree with you 100% here.
He is maturing into a great team player.

I have found it quite astonishing that the very week TC astute tactician comes out and says this that the media is all over him for playing for frees.
If I was playing and got scragged as much as Harry I would play for the odd free too.

With regards to Cripps I can see both sides.
There are times I think you selfish prick you cost us there. There are just as many I think that was sensational he is carrying the team on his back

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2022 3:39 pm 
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Harry Vallence

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Am I the only one who gets angrier and angrier the more I think about Friday night? Lol


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2022 5:03 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Yes, not so much for the loss but because of the narratives it's created: that we are on the slide (omg 2 out of 5!), that we will struggle to make finals, that we are overrated, that we are woke, that we are rockstars in our own minds. All because some dopey cauliflower suddenly decided they couldn't hit a cow's arse with a banjo (although in the case of TDK he never could, which is why I keep banging the drum for him to be a ruck-defender).


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2022 5:47 pm 
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Bob Chitty

Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2017 3:40 pm
Posts: 836
think it was a lost opportunity ...

just like against the pies ... and against the tigers (but espeically the pies and the saints)

SOS kicks the goal against the pies, we break even at 4.3 instead of 1.6 aginst the saints and we are equal first ....

we have let a couple slip this year ... and i dont think hawks/port are "could have gone the other way" in both instatnces we built a substaintial lead etc.. and stopped

this year, is very much a learning year. I have to keep reminding myself that. only have to think to this time last year, to see how far we have come ... we still have alot more to go.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2022 8:43 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Traveller86 wrote:
Am I the only one who gets angrier and angrier the more I think about Friday night? Lol



I'm so glad I read this.

We let it slip...because of pathetic shots at goal.

I guess it just adds to the intrigue of the year, but the win would have been ....think utopia without the cup.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2022 8:43 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

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Traveller86 wrote:
Am I the only one who gets angrier and angrier the more I think about Friday night? Lol


No. Still fuming.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2022 8:49 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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For sure….

guts still churning…!

I’ve caught up with some media…and we
haven’t had too much bad stuff at all…so that’s
something we can take from this…!


kindest regards tommi

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2022 11:05 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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No

Go Blues

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2022 6:48 am 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2006 8:22 am
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keogh wrote:
Reading all these posts you can understand supporters frustration and disappointment
Would supporters feel the same 3 days later

Folks that’s the modern game
You can’t play with more intensity than the opposition every week
It’s not possible
StKilda’s season was on the line
They knew it. They switched the ball more than last week
They took risks and it payed off
Good on them
They were the better team on the night

As I said it’s so even that anything could happen between now and September
We do need Weitering back
I reckon Kemp would replace Plowman as the third tall
Durdin Owies Motlop Cottrell
Things are looking up
But Rome wasn’t built in a day
Our mids are big bodied but lack a bit of running power through the middle
This needs to be addressed because you ain’t going to win the clearences every week
When we don’t we become average
As I said a few months back it’s important when you are smashing teams to win big
We had that opportunity against Port and Hawthorn and nearly lost both with Weitering being the difference between winning and losing
Our low percentage as a result means we can’t afford to lose too many more


Great post.
The big challenge going forward is to be able to really put teams away. 4 opportunities stand out for me this year: Port and Hawks as well as Kangas and Adelaide where we could/should have built much bigger wins.

And against the Saints, they did play better. I thought our intensity was not too bad either but our disposal was not as composed - we turned the ball over three times in the middle with hospital kicks and also missed three (at least) very easy goals.

Must beat West Coast and Adelaide, but will also need to beat at least one of Geelong, Bris, Meb or Collingwood. I’d be pretty disappointed if we don’t beat Collingwood.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2022 9:08 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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All good posts above - but the sooner Plowman is not in our back 6 the better.


:thumbsup:

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