Talking Carlton Index Lochie O'Brien Kerryn Harrington Lochie O'Brien Kerryn Harrington CFC Home CFC Membership CFC Shop CFC Fixture Blueseum
It is currently Tue Dec 06, 2022 9:23 pm

All times are UTC + 10 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 57 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 7:53 am 
Online
Wayne Johnston
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 1:06 pm
Posts: 8395
Didn't sleep very well last night. Really wired after the Lions vs Dogs match.

Was trying to imagine one of those two teams wearing the navy blue, and the adrenaline and pride we'd feel as supporters to see our guys go out and dig in a high pressure final like that.

I'm just not seeing it with our list.

Game plan will obviously be changed significantly, but scanning our list I'm coming up with less than a handful of players that have what it takes to win those games of footy.

The footy smarts.
The two way running.
The accountability.
The discipline.
The trust in each other to execute the plan.

I hope, in the absence of a senior coach (and almost entire coaching group), someone is taking the reigns and keeping our guys together and focused. Watching these finals should be required "homework" IMHO.

flower' love this footy club but just really flat right now at how far away we may yet be from the promised land. 40 years in the desert? :sad:

The AFL won't help us like they do the darling clubs. The media will kick us while we're down. It's on us and us alone to scrap our way out of this. Shambolic off field and shambolic on field. Pray for rain lads and laddettes. Pray for rain.

_________________
Orandum est ut sit mens sana in corpore sano. Fortem posce animum mortis terrore carentem, qui spatium vitae extremum inter munera ponat naturae, qui ferre queat quoscumque labores.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 8:15 am 
Offline
Bruce Doull
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:06 pm
Posts: 30581
Location: Half back flank
I'm hearing ya Rob. And to make matters worse, if the Dees break the drought this year we will be second in line after St Kilda as longest droughts.

Let that sink in :sad: :sad:

I suppose for me, the 2016 Dogs are the one team that gives me hope. They looked all at sea for a few years before that, didn't look close to winning a flag. Then somehow they were able to go from 0 to 100 real quick & play the kind of footy they did in the 2016 campaign. And going by last night, it's been a sustainable model they've built. Fkn great game of footy!

_________________
#DonTheStash


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 8:31 am 
Offline
formerly Fevola

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:57 pm
Posts: 4176
We do have the players - talent wise.

But for some reason, they dont gel and dont have the desire and hunger to compete all the time.

A lot has to do with the lack of leadership and pushing standards on field and off.

Players feel entitled to a spot on the team regardless and are not willing to put in the hard word.

I hope with the right coach, and hopefully new leaders they will push the standards we need.

We have far more talent than the bulldogs and Brisbane. And outside of possibly Melbourne who are cherry ripe at the moment, I think we can beat any of them. I really believe that.

We need to make Weitering captain and Walsh Vice straight away. Let Doc and Cripps just play - I dont think they are leaders. Scrap this leadership group as well. Traditional Captain and Vice.

Selection integrity needs to be emphasised in the new coach selection too. We need players to be hungry for their spot.

Also we need buy in from the players and play them in their preferred positions.

Doing all of the above, is not easy but if we select the right coaches now it can all click…


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 8:33 am 
Offline
Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:28 pm
Posts: 4273
CK95 wrote:

I suppose for me, the 2016 Dogs are the one team that gives me hope. They looked all at sea for a few years before that, didn't look close to winning a flag. Then somehow they were able to go from 0 to 100 real quick & play the kind of footy they did in the 2016 campaign.

Also Collingwood making the grand final in both 2002 & 2018, and I hate to say it but Essendon* in 1993.

_________________
In the Truth there is no news, and in the News there is no truth.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 8:38 am 
Offline
Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:28 pm
Posts: 4273
Drewgirl wrote:
W
We have far more talent than the bulldogs and Brisbane.

Not sure about that.
For example look at the Dogs midfield: Bont, Macrae, Smith, Libba, Treloar, Dunkley and Hunter are all top liners. We have Walsh and a banged up Cripps.

_________________
In the Truth there is no news, and in the News there is no truth.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 8:43 am 
Offline
Rod Ashman
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2011 4:05 pm
Posts: 2152
It won't take much at all. Just a coach that instills a bit of belief.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 8:43 am 
Offline
Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 2:15 pm
Posts: 18876
Location: North of the border
I disagree we have probably the most talented list of players of any club.
We need them fit and playing together
Weiters Jones Williams Saad Walsh Cripps Cunningham Curnow Harry McGovern
If they are fit and playing together no one can beat us

Sent from my SM-G991B using Tapatalk

_________________
If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 8:45 am 
Offline
Stephen Kernahan
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:53 am
Posts: 15875
Location: Left Cuckistan
I'm actually optimistic on the list. Just get the feeling the time is now for some of the younger crew who haven't had the shit habits ingrained yet to 'own' the team and drive standards, even if they don't have an official title.

_________________
The only way for some people to understand is for them to be on the receiving end

Left wing moralists
In self serving denial
They shit me no end


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 9:34 am 
Offline
Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
Posts: 3229
I'm optimistic because the Board finally appear on board (pardon the pun) that enough is enough with mediocrity
This may well be the first time the Board are in synch with the frustrations of the rank and file

Sayers appears a very much "football ops" president, who, with the right CEO and footy manager, will make things happen onfield

The Review into our football dept, and the fact that Liddle may have contributed to its dysfunctionality, tells me he's not sweeping issues under the carpet

This is just my take

_________________
If I want your opinion, I'll give it to you!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 9:43 am 
Offline
Banned

Joined: Sat Jun 08, 2019 5:55 pm
Posts: 2333
We have the list only when they are playing and we definitely do not have the midfield which is a pre requisite to play in finals.

There is no way Cripps, Walsh, Kennedy, Dow, LOB, SPS, Newnes bat as deep as Bont, Macrae, Libba, Dunkley, Treloar, Hunter, Smith, Daniel in terms of class.

Even GWS who got knocked out... Taranto, Hopper, Ward, Kelly, Whitfield, De Boer, Coniglio

If we dont have two players minimum laying eight tackles and eight clearances consistently we are not going to win many games because the opposition will do exactly that.

We just dont have the necessary midfield talent and its been the case for a decade.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 9:47 am 
Offline
Banned

Joined: Sat Jun 08, 2019 5:55 pm
Posts: 2333
Sack everyone but when the club overrated the list over and over..and over again.

May as well hand in the keys as thats how clueless these fools are.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 10:01 am 
Offline
Horrie Clover
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:14 pm
Posts: 362
Jumping at shadows.

These guys have more guys in their prime than we do.

The crucial age bracket is age 24-28. We are only just getting some of our players into that group now.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 10:08 am 
Offline
Banned

Joined: Sat Jun 08, 2019 5:55 pm
Posts: 2333
thryleon wrote:
Jumping at shadows.

These guys have more guys in their prime than we do.

The crucial age bracket is age 24-28. We are only just getting some of our players into that group now.


I dont see it that way. You can tell a player with quality and class after 50 games.

If you dont show it by 23 years old as good as gone.

Its no shame drafting Xavier Ellis, Dom Tyson, Will Brodie and Jordan Gallucci...it's part of the gambling process that is the draft and quite frankly Dow, LOB and SPS are not up to standard we need three bonafide mids if people want to start winning games.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 11:51 am 
Offline
Trevor Keogh

Joined: Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:31 pm
Posts: 715
99prelim wrote:
I'm optimistic because the Board finally appear on board (pardon the pun) that enough is enough with mediocrity
This may well be the first time the Board are in synch with the frustrations of the rank and file

Sayers appears a very much "football ops" president, who, with the right CEO and footy manager, will make things happen onfield

The Review into our football dept, and the fact that Liddle may have contributed to its dysfunctionality, tells me he's not sweeping issues under the carpet

This is just my take

:thumbsup:
This is my line of thinking too. If standards are set at the top, they will eventually flow all the way down to the players. That’s where we may be able to move from talented group of individuals to a high functioning team with collective buy in. Remember Melbourne were the former for a long time and seemingly have clicked to the latter over the off season so it can turn.
Need strong figures across as lines - board, ceo, head of footy, coach and senior players. We appear to be moving in the right direction but plenty of work to do.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 12:05 pm 
Offline
Mike Fitzpatrick
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 30, 2007 9:12 pm
Posts: 4425
99prelim wrote:
I'm optimistic because the Board finally appear on board (pardon the pun) that enough is enough with mediocrity
This may well be the first time the Board are in synch with the frustrations of the rank and file

Sayers appears a very much "football ops" president, who, with the right CEO and footy manager, will make things happen onfield

The Review into our football dept, and the fact that Liddle may have contributed to its dysfunctionality, tells me he's not sweeping issues under the carpet

This is just my take

This seems to be the initial sense … let’s hope he gets things done right with the right people in place … there are still a couple of holes on the list but not many … coaching and player development are the keys …

_________________
"Truth, for the tyrants, is the most terrible and cruel of all bindings; it is like an incandescent iron falling across their chests. And it is even more agonizing than hot iron, for that only burns the flesh, while truth burns its way into the soul"     — Lauro Aguirre


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 1:47 pm 
Offline
Bert Deacon

Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:51 pm
Posts: 546
when you watch the finals series makes me think how overrated our list is . This is why i am calling it now players like ,sps,setters, plowman must be moved on they would all fail in big final. just think how would they go in last night game lions v dogs.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 3:08 pm 
Offline
Horrie Clover
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:14 pm
Posts: 362
Walsh wrote:
thryleon wrote:
Jumping at shadows.

These guys have more guys in their prime than we do.

The crucial age bracket is age 24-28. We are only just getting some of our players into that group now.


I dont see it that way. You can tell a player with quality and class after 50 games.

If you dont show it by 23 years old as good as gone.

Its no shame drafting Xavier Ellis, Dom Tyson, Will Brodie and Jordan Gallucci...it's part of the gambling process that is the draft and quite frankly Dow, LOB and SPS are not up to standard we need three bonafide mids if people want to start winning games.



Its not just about talent its about consistency and years in the system with playing experience.

Everyone knows an athlete irrespective of ability is in their prime in there mid to late 20's. Some get there a bit earlier, others get there later but it's a universal truth.

Talent is a different discussion. Almost completely irrelevant. Proof. Plenty of hacks win flags. Not every talented player gets one.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 3:10 pm 
Offline
Geoff Southby

Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2009 7:24 pm
Posts: 5318
Location: Bridge, Starship Enterprise
I would not be making any wholesale changes under a new coach. It all depends how the individual player reacts under him. All players mentiioned have talent to varying degrees particularly, SPS, Dow, maybe O'Brien.

Give it a year and then make a decision with the blessing of the coach.

_________________
"Get ready, Teddy - you're on": Ron Barassi half time 1970 Grand Final


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 3:37 pm 
Offline
John Nicholls
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:32 am
Posts: 9510
Drewgirl wrote:
We do have the players - talent wise.

But for some reason, they dont gel and dont have the desire and hunger to compete all the time.

A lot has to do with the lack of leadership and pushing standards on field and off.

Players feel entitled to a spot on the team regardless and are not willing to put in the hard word.

I hope with the right coach, and hopefully new leaders they will push the standards we need.

We have far more talent than the bulldogs and Brisbane. And outside of possibly Melbourne who are cherry ripe at the moment, I think we can beat any of them. I really believe that.

We need to make Weitering captain and Walsh Vice straight away. Let Doc and Cripps just play - I dont think they are leaders. Scrap this leadership group as well. Traditional Captain and Vice.

Selection integrity needs to be emphasised in the new coach selection too. We need players to be hungry for their spot.

Also we need buy in from the players and play them in their preferred positions.

Doing all of the above, is not easy but if we select the right coaches now it can all click…


:thumbsup:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2021 3:37 pm 
Offline
John Nicholls
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:32 am
Posts: 9510
Teddy Hopkins wrote:
I would not be making any wholesale changes under a new coach. It all depends how the individual player reacts under him. All players mentiioned have talent to varying degrees particularly, SPS, Dow, maybe O'Brien.

Give it a year and then make a decision with the blessing of the coach.


:thumbsup:


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 57 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC + 10 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group