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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:35 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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bluedog wrote:
Question: Why, for God's sake, is SPS undroppable?


Answer: The same reason Murphy is.


They have compromising photos of coaches?

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:41 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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frank dardew wrote:
Need to change team after that performance
Moore no for a start give TDK a go
Hopefully Fish Dow and O’Brien start putting the pressure on because we can’t keep dishing that up


I would rather have the hard running OBrien matched up with hard runners like Isaac Smith than Murphy. Murphy couldn't keep up with him.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:43 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Brently8 wrote:
bluehammer wrote:
I can't believe that David Teague was out coached by Alistair Clarkson.

Shocked to be sitting here.



Out coached by 10 goals in about 3 shortened quarters of footy. We got got to pieces.
Totally agree, it was unacceptable.

But I don't think a 10 game ish coach getting out done by arguably the greatest coach of the last 30 years is headline news.

Teague appears, from the cheap seats, to back his players in almost to a fault. Don't change things, let them work their way through it. Hasn't served us well when teams have got on top of us.

Need to find different styles for different times. I would like to think Bolton's endless negativity would have helped us have that style when needed... but we were shit at it.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:47 pm 
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Bert Deacon

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a couple of lucky wins hid the truth we are a poor team with a pathetic / easy to read game plan .I have said this many many times ,once a team start running quick ball movement and we cant match this game over .How many games over the years have we watched opposition stroll in for easy goals .So up to our coaches to change this for 2021.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:47 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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kingkerna wrote:
How do people feel about Ed Curnow?

He gets a heap of credit for the role that he plays, but I feel there is a fine balance between this and needing a midfielder that contributes more with the ball in hand.



I am 100% with you on this.

Was trying to position this by comparing tagged with pro active ball player.

Who would you prefer?

Ed Curnow or the player he tags:

Selwood?
Martin?
Simpkin?
Merret?

You get it.

I think the answer is obvious. We need to add class to desire

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:53 pm 
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Craig Bradley

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Good post Jim
However it is very frustrating that you get an opportunity to beat a side that has beat you 17 times out of 18 and are 5 goals up and can’t complete the job
Surely they are sick of losing to Hawthorn
Surely they are sick of being bullied by Hawthorn
Surely they are sick of not playing finals
Don’t get it and to fail so
Miserably a 60 point turnaround is a real indictment on the whole club

Laughable that they don’t turn up for 3 quarters afte a good first -mental not physical and just so bloody annoying :banghead:


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:55 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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keogh wrote:
For a start it doesn’t help playing one ruckman against two
We were slaughtered in the hit outs
Recruiting Moore let alone playing him is a mistake but we shouldn’t be surprised given the history of the clubs last 20 years in recruiting spuds from other AFL clubs

Now the game from what I observed today is overall more congested than its ever been the best whole 36 are often in a quarter of the ground
The game starts at the stoppages . Win that and you will probably win the game unless your skills are really shit.
That’s what happened tonight
Their midfield smashed ours and De Konings inclusion would have made some difference but not enough to win the game
When Ed Curnow is your second best mid by a long way your in trouble
Cripps is struggling but he was our best player after Weitering
Kennedy and Setterfield were pathetic after those first 5 goals
SPS and Cunningham ( who I think must have been injured) should be playing mid field but arnt because they haven’t developed enough
Same goes for the guys who aren’t in the team

At the start of the last quarter Murphy and Curnow were in the middle
That in the long term isn’t going to work

Whatever your grievances were against Bolton he was trying to fast track youngsters
Teague went back to the mature bodies when he took over
He shouldn’t do that anymore
After Cripps and Curnow are midfield is very ordinary
We don’t need a Papley. We need another mid
Setterfield and Kennedy will have their moments but ultimately there ain’t the answer
SPS needs to play there
Honey Fisher And OBrien need extended time in the seniors. We really lack run when the ball is in motion
I would drop Murphy, Betts and Simpson
Bring them back for one last hurrah to say goodbye


Teague needs to retire Betts Murphy and Simpson at seasons end
Betts provides some cameos but not much else
Newnes is another average player from another club that inhibits the development of a youngster
How often have we said that
McKay is a big unit but has little presence
He also needs to get fitter
Weitering was good
Cripps and Curnow tried
The rest na

We can play better than that but we are average some of you posters have got ahead of yourself
Teague needs to start making some tough calls at the selection table and positions on the ground

The party is over


Like another post, agree with everything except the Eddie bit.
I've watched the game 3 times and Eddie was a shining light when it comes to pressure. He shows the young ones the intensity they need to bring. Until we have a specialist forward pocket, he stays for mine.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:59 pm 
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formerly BlueRob
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Watch other sides thrash Hawthorn in the coming weeks.

Our MAIN problem is a 2 fold issue.

1. We don't know how to win because we have got use to losing.
2. Other teams always believe they are a chance because thats the way its been for so long.

Westcoast is a scarey thought in our next game.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 1:13 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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grrofunger wrote:
bluedog wrote:
Question: Why, for God's sake, is SPS undroppable?


Answer: The same reason Murphy is.


They have compromising photos of coaches?




Complete answer is:

Wouldn't have a frickin' clue.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 1:15 pm 
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Craig Bradley

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jamespul65 wrote:
a couple of lucky wins hid the truth we are a poor team with a pathetic / easy to read game plan .I have said this many many times ,once a team start running quick ball movement and we cant match this game over .How many games over the years have we watched opposition stroll in for easy goals .So up to our coaches to change this for 2021.


Why were they lucky wins? If we lose we're no good if we win we're lucky. Under Teague we are 10-10 and generally improving alot. Before then it was 1-11, 2-20. Must've been 10 lucky wins. Shit, wish I had that luck at lotto.

We are up and coming hence bad losses like last night are going to happen as are the brilliant wins against Geelong, at Geelong and the Dogs. Actually, 2 days ago, we were a 1pts loss against Melbourne and a kick after the siren from equal top. Wouldn't have been a true reflection of course but shows we have come on. Last night shows we have alot we have to work on with our consistency and other aspects but it's alot better than it was. Welcome to the world of supporting an up and coming side. As much as everyone wants it to happen overnight, funnily enough it won't.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 1:33 pm 
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Geoff Southby

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jim wrote:
jamespul65 wrote:
a couple of lucky wins hid the truth we are a poor team with a pathetic / easy to read game plan .I have said this many many times ,once a team start running quick ball movement and we cant match this game over .How many games over the years have we watched opposition stroll in for easy goals .So up to our coaches to change this for 2021.


Why were they lucky wins? If we lose we're no good if we win we're lucky. Under Teague we are 10-10 and generally improving alot. Before then it was 1-11, 2-20. Must've been 10 lucky wins. Shit, wish I had that luck at lotto.

We are up and coming hence bad losses like last night are going to happen as are the brilliant wins against Geelong, at Geelong and the Dogs. Actually, 2 days ago, we were a 1pts loss against Melbourne and a kick after the siren from equal top. Wouldn't have been a true reflection of course but shows we have come on. Last night shows we have alot we have to work on with our consistency and other aspects but it's alot better than it was. Welcome to the world of supporting an up and coming side. As much as everyone wants it to happen overnight, funnily enough it won't.


Agree we have improved
Agree young teams are inconsistent
The question is how high is the ceiling of improvement
There is a % of the answer to that question with the Ol’ crystal ball
However the footy world doesn’t wait for anyone and if you overrate your list your in trouble
The future isn’t Simpson Murphy or Betts so replace them
If SPS and Cunningham are any good then play them up the ground for a month
Teague needs to stop playing the safe selection and positional card and start finding some answers

Forget about finals in a Micky Mouse season so take some selection changes


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 1:50 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

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I was so upset that as soon as the final siren went I turned the TV and did not read any social media until now.

I think those calling for Eddie to be dropped are watching different game to me, he is always constantly applying pressure to the opposition all over the ground as always in a dangerous position. He’s a long way from our worst player and shows real leadership.

Simmo earns his place, but I concede this could be his last year. Murphy is a depth player in coming years and should be one of the last we offer a contract to after settling the rest of the list.

Cripps has become a selfish player when in possession on the outside, he has to learn to be a team player and not try and win the game all by himself. If he had passed to Eddie who could have walked into goal instead of having a shot from 55 out, or kicked long to the square where we had Casboult who was marking everything as well as Harry we could have had two goals in a row. Trying that baulk and run around the mark was a complete momentum killer, he’s done it too many times and the hawks were ready for it, if it’s a set play then other Carlton players should be ready to clear the way just like the hawks do for every free kick.

Levi was good all a day, marked well and didn’t miss a goal. Cripps was the great deflator today.

Why the hell was Casboult in the ruck when Pittonet went off injured? Moore is in the team for this and we needed Levi in the fwd line.

Moore was good early (everyone was), but TDK could have done everything he did.

Cunningham was unsighted, on,y when someone mentioned him here did I recall that he was playing.

SPS was really exposed, I suspect he’s been a weak link all year but was only exposed so badly when the heat came on, at least Docherty and Simmo can adjust to lockdown, SPS has zero defensive skills or awareness, please get him out of defence and into the midfield or wing.

As has been said above, we had no plan b, especially for the midfield, but let’s not kid ourselves, Teague didn’t loose the game, it was lost in the minds of the players, they are true snowflakes.

Most of the changes being called for are like shuffling the deck chairs on the titanic, they won’t make much difference. TDK for Moore makes the most sense.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 2:12 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Stranger wrote:

There is moments that can have a influence on games but my point is the lack of influence
of player’s in a game player’s like Moore/Newnes/Betts/Murphy/gibbons/Cunningham /plowman and
more is a bigger problem than 1 mistake that Kennedy made


I can see no reason why Kennedy should not be in that list of problematic players.
Eddie never stopped presenting, applying pressure, tackling....don't look at is age.

I blatantly recall the fumbling of Kennedy dablues refers to. Really was a momentum killer.
I also recall Kennedy fumbling throughout the game: a lot.
He's not a midfielder yet. He's played his best on slow tracks. His best footy is in the wet. Conditional depth player.
Not saying he hasn't deserved his selection a few weeks back. From what Ive seen, he isn't the future for mine.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 2:13 pm 
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Geoff Southby
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Timid and meak............no ferocity..............we continually make excuses for these blokes.Excuse time is running out.Give 'em one last chance against the Eagles...............inject a bit of run and carry and we are capable of an upset.............reckon the defining moment is on us this week.Gonna tell us a lot this game.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 2:20 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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bondiblue wrote:
BigGartos wrote:
kezza wrote:
Bloody disgraceful.
From late in the first quarter when the Hawks started to apply pressure we crumbled.
Our midfield was absolutely smashed, Cripps the only one who can hold his head up.
Honestly some players were barely sighted.
Getting pretty sick of this.

Unfortunately Cripps response to the mediocrity around him was to try to do too much himself, rather than trusting others, and he made things much worse when we were still in touch.


You have a nice way accounting for Crippa howlers. He makes his own bed and should own the multitude of mistakes he makes by hand and foot. He makes decisions on his own and misses better options.

He should stick to what he is known for: contested disposals. We got smashed on the inside after quarter time.

I remember the one criticism Judd copped later in his career: kicking for goal. Crippa doesn't come near Judd imo.

Whilst Cripps can accumulate disposals he needs a lot of work to improve on the skill of kicking and handball.
in.

Crippa's year has been average thus far imo. A great effort quarter here and there is not enough for a captain.

His job is to bring in players not trying to be Messi. Everyone has a role.


Yet we won the stoppage clearances easily!
I think there are a lot of factors - including many listed on this site as to why we lost. Its never just one thing. I think we were out coached but I do not think that is because Teague is not the right coach and he has no plan B. Sometimes limitations in players both physical and mental reduce options. I am sure Levi is playing hindered at the moment - best guess is his knee which is restricting his ability to roam around the ground hence why he is playing deep forward. This means Harry has to play up the ground more and reduces our ability to be unpredictable. I think some selections are clearly not working as well as expected which then puts added pressure on the rest of the players. One link not performing their role (and by that I mean winning their role) breaks down the whole game plan and clearly the on field leaders could not get everyone to adjust as we would expect. Then players try to do more than they should (ie Cripps) which only adds to the disorganisation within the team. You can't blame Cunningham for no impact if his role is a quick leading target from the pocket but the ball never gets up there or when it does it is delivered poorly. The big question is will changes impact the sides confidence more than running with the same team that may be scarred by that poor performance; or will a want to redeem themselves prevail.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 3:12 pm 
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Craig Bradley

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Pros:

Brilliant start.
Thought our tackling was very good. Perhaps the best of the year.
Contested ball was strong.
Casboult and Harry.
Liked Kennedy again, although like many others, didn't find enough ball.

Cons:

With WC and Freo to come on their home patch, that was a wasted opportunity.
2 years in a row we've conceded a 5 goal lead against this opposition. Clearly belief on both sides is a big factor.
Leaked goals way too easily. Opposition players seemed to keep getting out the back.
Got beaten badly in space. Our edge players were outran. We need more midfield pace. Pity we had to play Hawks with Breust and Impi in the team.
Lots of scrubby kicks, and bounces and ricochets seemed to keep going straight towards the opposition.
Gibbons kept turning the ball over.
Cripps kept trying to do much with the ball.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 3:23 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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[quote="Stefchook"Our edge players were outran. We need more midfield pace. Pity we had to play Hawks with Breust and Impi in the team.
.[/quote]

Sounds a bit like the old days at primary school when the grade Threes tried to get some time on the oval.

“Ooh it’s not fair we always have to play on the oval against the grade Sixers and they always beat up on us, boo frickety hoo”.



:roll:



PS. Out of curiosity when was the last time Impy played an AFL game.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 3:24 pm 
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Craig Bradley

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Brently8 wrote:
13 of 20 games under Teague now where we have conceded at least a 30 point run or turnaround against us. The inability to slow the game down or hold possession or close it up when the opposition have momentum is of real concern. Teague was given a lesson last night I thought it was a dreadful coaching performance.


Good post. I like that Teague wants us to score. But we also need to lockdown on the opposition and make it much harder for them to score.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 3:40 pm 
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Craig Bradley

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AGRO wrote:
[quote="Stefchook"Our edge players were outran. We need more midfield pace. Pity we had to play Hawks with Breust and Impi in the team.
.


Sounds a bit like the old days at primary school when the grade Threes tried to get some time on the oval.

“Ooh it’s not fair we always have to play on the oval against the grade Sixers and they always beat up on us, boo frickety hoo”.

:roll:

PS. Out of curiosity when was the last time Impy played an AFL game.[/quote]

Feel better yet, Agro? Feel free to irrationally vent against your own posts. Or perhaps go find a dog to kick. :garthp:

We need more run and pace, so we can consistently compete. There have been periods against Richmond, Port and Hawks where we simply couldn't get close enough to apply pressure or win the ball back. Would we have been a far better chance of winning without Breust playing (funnily enough the Hawks have been horrible the last 4 weeks with him missing), or another zippy half forward type? Without a doubt. But you can call that a whinge if you like. Actually I would have thought it was fairly obvious, and you're the one having a whinge.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 3:41 pm 
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John Nicholls
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jim wrote:

We're 10-10 from the last 20. Bet we'd have accepted that after being 1-11, 2-20 the year before, and embarrassing. Too many want it to happen overnight and it just won't.


Fair points. :thumbsup:

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