TalkingCarlton :: View topic - R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2019/05/05/embarrassed-blues-thought-it-was-just-going-to-happen-curnow/

Wow.

We must stop this trend to play our worst against the weaker opposition teams in the competition? What is it that year after year this is a feature of our performance? It is soul destroying year after year. We should not be having these beltings against such teams year after year. How the hell do we keep losing to the Aints, Gold Coast, North and Fremantle every year, and not be prepared when they come out steaming and nasty? We simply wilt and either don't come to play or give in.

frank dardew wrote:

Completely agree. It needs to be drilled into them all summer. Behind the scenes. That they're going to be judged ESPECIALLY by how they perform in these games. (Stuff the Richmond, and Collingwood and Essendon** games.) In this age of free agency, you can't attract good players, until you start to win games. And realistically, half of the teams are simply too good for us at the moment to beat. So we need to target the winnable games ESPECIALLY.

I don't think it's realistic to expect us to be competitive every week. That's just too hard. 6 out of 7 is pretty good. But I want someone at the club to realise we need to come prepared to the ABSOLUTE MAX, in games against the other cellar dwellers. I don't want the club and the players and the coaching panel to spend 3 months preparing to beat Richmond. I want them to spend the summer preparing for how to beat Gold Coast. And North. And Saints. And Freo. And Bulldogs. And Swans.

frank dardew wrote:

It's how they respond as a playing group this week that counts now.

If we get a few good wins near the end of the season to show they have grown as a group, that will be enough encouragement for me that next year should be a break out year and hopefully we can land an A-grader or two.

What I don't get is surely like all of us they are sick of losing so why aren't they doubly fired up against the bottom team North or the saints or the Gold Coast or Brisbane or Freo
Why do they meekly surrender to teams that come out fired up and they come out fired up because they know we either shit ourselves or don't come to play
Everyone in the stadium or watching it who barracked for Carlton knew when we missed the first kick for goal and North kicked 3 goals knew we were in trouble

Everyone could smell the fear
Pathetic and weasel words about being fired up against Collingwood are just that weasel words trying to take the heat off them for an egregious performance that wasn't AFL standard
Shut up show some spine and grit and represent us properly

Too many pics platitudes from the playing group we are sick of them

I’m still speechless that comments such as Ed’s continue to come up.

Some serious reality checks are needed for this group, starting with sending certain veterans who should know better to the VFL. It won’t make a lick of difference to their own performance, but will make a clear statement to the next generation who have time to not be tainted by such shit habits.

maybe Bolts could show them the doco I saw today

Author:	aboynamedsue [ Mon May 06, 2019 10:23 am ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
CK95 wrote: https://www.sen.com.au/news/2019/05/05/embarrassed-blues-thought-it-was-just-going-to-happen-curnow/ Wow. Indeed. I think a number of posters thought it was just going to happen too.

Author:	Sidefx [ Mon May 06, 2019 10:29 am ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
CK95 wrote: https://www.sen.com.au/news/2019/05/05/embarrassed-blues-thought-it-was-just-going-to-happen-curnow/ Wow. It's good to hear after the game, the players realising it was "their" issue on the day and not hiding behind the coaches (after the 1st 1/4 would've been better). But that means jack unless they can back it up with actions. I would love to see a win against the enemy, but at the least, an effort worthy of holding their heads ups after the game. And I hope this is not player code for the coaches to not swing the axe and let's see what we can do to rectify this. A message from the selection committee needs to be sent loud and clear.

Author:	frank dardew [ Mon May 06, 2019 10:51 am ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
Too late now why not just turn up on the day and give it a red hot go Talk is cheap and we have to many of this mea culpa after the fact press conferences All this howdy dowdy stuff is cheap and doesn’t at all mask a gross underperformance like yesterday Get on the field show some grit and spine and represent your supporters appropriately

Author:	tommi [ Mon May 06, 2019 11:11 am ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
I'm there NOW...! kindest regards tommi

Author:	bluegirl72 [ Mon May 06, 2019 12:00 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
shall I bring you a thermos and blankie T?

TalkingCarlton http://www.talkingcarlton.com/phpBB3/

R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion) http://www.talkingcarlton.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=36553	Page 8 of 10

Author:	tommi [ Mon May 06, 2019 12:14 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
Ooooh.... are there sausages in ya thermos...? kindest regards tommi (so to speak...)

Author:	bluegirl72 [ Mon May 06, 2019 12:28 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
well no...not generally.

Author:	CK95 [ Mon May 06, 2019 12:39 pm ]
Post subject:	R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)

Author:	Stefchook [ Mon May 06, 2019 1:12 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
frank dardew wrote: We must stop this trend to play our worst against the weaker opposition teams in the competition? What is it that year after year this is a feature of our performance? It is soul destroying year after year. We should not be having these beltings against such teams year after year. How the hell do we keep losing to the Aints, Gold Coast, North and Fremantle every year, and not be prepared when they come out steaming and nasty? We simply wilt and either don't come to play or give in. Completely agree. It needs to be drilled into them all summer. Behind the scenes. That they're going to be judged ESPECIALLY by how they perform in these games. (Stuff the Richmond, and Collingwood and Essendon* games.) In this age of free agency, you can't attract good players, until you start to win games. And realistically, half of the teams are simply too good for us at the moment to beat. So we need to target the winnable games ESPECIALLY. I don't think it's realistic to expect us to be competitive every week. That's just too hard. 6 out of 7 is pretty good. But I want someone at the club to realise we need to come prepared to the ABSOLUTE MAX, in games against the other cellar dwellers. I don't want the club and the players and the coaching panel to spend 3 months preparing to beat Richmond. I want them to spend the summer preparing for how to beat Gold Coast. And North. And Saints. And Freo. And Bulldogs. And Swans.

Author:	Donstuie [ Mon May 06, 2019 1:37 pm ]
Post subject:	R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
I’m still speechless that comments such as Ed’s continue to come up. Some serious reality checks are needed for this group, starting with sending certain veterans who should know better to the VFL. It won’t make a lick of difference to their own performance, but will make a clear statement to the next generation who have time to not be tainted by such shit habits.

Author:	Sidefx [ Mon May 06, 2019 1:45 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
Stefchook wrote: frank dardew wrote: We must stop this trend to play our worst against the weaker opposition teams in the competition? What is it that year after year this is a feature of our performance? It is soul destroying year after year. We should not be having these beltings against such teams year after year. How the hell do we keep losing to the Aints, Gold Coast, North and Fremantle every year, and not be prepared when they come out steaming and nasty? We simply wilt and either don't come to play or give in. Completely agree. It needs to be drilled into them all summer. Behind the scenes. That they're going to be judged ESPECIALLY by how they perform in these games. (Stuff the Richmond, and Collingwood and Essendon** games.) In this age of free agency, you can't attract good players, until you start to win games. And realistically, half of the teams are simply too good for us at the moment to beat. So we need to target the winnable games ESPECIALLY. I don't think it's realistic to expect us to be competitive every week. That's just too hard. 6 out of 7 is pretty good. But I want someone at the club to realise we need to come prepared to the ABSOLUTE MAX, in games against the other cellar dwellers. I don't want the club and the players and the coaching panel to spend 3 months preparing to beat Richmond. I want them to spend the summer preparing for how to beat Gold Coast. And North. And Saints. And Freo. And Bulldogs. And Swans. Not sure what you mean here.......did you predict the Bulldogs and Swans to be "cellar dwellers"? And North has added some pretty good mature age talent in the off season. Hall (who did not play), Polec, Tyson (who did not play) and Pittard. We added McGovern, Setterfield, Newman and Fasolo (which none of them played). I understand what you are eluding too but some of these so called "cellar dwellers" have more mature lists than we do, with less injury to key players. FWIW we know and the club knows we dropped the ball against GCS, but I think it will take a pretty fit team to beat the Saints and Freo. And we were just lucky the Dogs couldn't kick straight otherwise that would've been a lot closer too. So in summary I think they are prepared for all games not just the top teams, but as Ed said in his post match interview the coaches plan all week for the opposition teams, then it's up to the players on game day, but this week the players went out thinking it was in the bag (a little too much self belief as it turns out). It's how they respond as a playing group this week that counts now. This team is still young and have little experience in playing with each other and unfortunately they don't know or believe they can change the momentum in a game to stop a flogging or win a close one yet. I'm hoping it will happen soon, as this game was a crash landing back to earth of our expectations of a young team. If we get a few good wins near the end of the season to show they have grown as a group, that will be enough encouragement for me that next year should be a break out year and hopefully we can land an A-grader or two.

Author:	Humpers [ Mon May 06, 2019 1:47 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
Stefchook wrote: frank dardew wrote: We must stop this trend to play our worst against the weaker opposition teams in the competition? What is it that year after year this is a feature of our performance? It is soul destroying year after year. We should not be having these beltings against such teams year after year. How the hell do we keep losing to the Aints, Gold Coast, North and Fremantle every year, and not be prepared when they come out steaming and nasty? We simply wilt and either don't come to play or give in. Completely agree. It needs to be drilled into them all summer. Behind the scenes. That they're going to be judged ESPECIALLY by how they perform in these games. (Stuff the Richmond, and Collingwood and Essendon** games.) In this age of free agency, you can't attract good players, until you start to win games. And realistically, half of the teams are simply too good for us at the moment to beat. So we need to target the winnable games ESPECIALLY. I don't think it's realistic to expect us to be competitive every week. That's just too hard. 6 out of 7 is pretty good. But I want someone at the club to realise we need to come prepared to the ABSOLUTE MAX, in games against the other cellar dwellers. I don't want the club and the players and the coaching panel to spend 3 months preparing to beat Richmond. I want them to spend the summer preparing for how to beat Gold Coast. And North. And Saints. And Freo. And Bulldogs. And Swans. Yep - I bet we come out firing and have 'honourable losses' against Collingwood and then GWS and then play poorly against the Saints. Happens all the time.

Author:	Stefchook [ Mon May 06, 2019 2:58 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
Sidefx wrote: It's how they respond as a playing group this week that counts now. Unfortunately, it doesn't really matter all that much how they 'come out' this week. Because they're still basically no chance of winning. My point is they need to make sure they 'come out', when they play the Saints. Because 'valiant' competitive efforts against the top tier sides won't produce wins. The club desperately need some wins. The coach desperately needs some wins. The players desperately need some wins. Or else they're going to have to struggle to improve slowly and gradually all by themselves. Because they're not going to get good senior players wanting to join them as wooden spooners. Sidefx wrote: If we get a few good wins near the end of the season to show they have grown as a group, that will be enough encouragement for me that next year should be a break out year and hopefully we can land an A-grader or two. But we won't attract mature A-graders if we finish bottom 4. If we had a better year last year, we probably would have gotten Shiel. If we'd had a better year the previous year, we might have gotten Kelly. If Coniglio leaves. He'll go to Hawthorn. Or perhaps the Saints. But he won't be coming to Carlton, unless he sees short-term hope and success. Why would he want to go through a GWS rebuild all over again?

Author:	frank dardew [ Mon May 06, 2019 3:00 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
What I don't get is surely like all of us they are sick of losing so why aren't they doubly fired up against the bottom team North or the saints or the Gold Coast or Brisbane or Freo Why do they meekly surrender to teams that come out fired up and they come out fired up because they know we either shit ourselves or don't come to play Everyone in the stadium or watching it who barracked for Carlton knew when we missed the first kick for goal and North kicked 3 goals knew we were in trouble Everyone could smell the fear Pathetic and weasel words about being fired up against Collingwood are just that weasel words trying to take the heat off them for an egregious performance that wasn't AFL standard Shut up show some spine and grit and represent us properly Too many pics platitudes from the playing group we are sick of them

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Author:	Jiahao Blue [ Mon May 06, 2019 3:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
frank dardew wrote: What I don't get is surely like all of us they are sick of losing so why aren't they doubly fired up against the bottom team North or the saints or the Gold Coast or Brisbane or Freo Why do they meekly surrender to teams that come out fired up and they come out fired up because they know we either shit ourselves or don't come to play Everyone in the stadium or watching it who barracked for Carlton knew when we missed the first kick for goal and North kicked 3 goals knew we were in trouble Everyone could smell the fear Pathetic and weasel words about being fired up against Collingwood are just that weasel words trying to take the heat off them for an egregious performance that wasn't AFL standard Shut up show some spine and grit and represent us properly Too many pics platitudes from the playing group we are sick of them

Author:	keogh [ Mon May 06, 2019 3:23 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
Donstuie wrote: I’m still speechless that comments such as Ed’s continue to come up. Some serious reality checks are needed for this group, starting with sending certain veterans who should know better to the VFL. It won’t make a lick of difference to their own performance, but will make a clear statement to the next generation who have time to not be tainted by such shit habits. I have no idea where the over confidence comes from but maybe Bolts could show them the doco I saw today called 42-1 about James “Buster” Douglas if the players are sick of his voice There is never a certainty in sport Ah forget it The young people wouldn’t understand anyway Excellent doco On ESPN at the moment

Author:	Donstuie [ Mon May 06, 2019 3:34 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
I want the next Bolts player address the club releases on video to be the one following this game. I want to see what they mean when they say "Difficult conversations".

Author:	CK95 [ Mon May 06, 2019 3:48 pm ]
Post subject:	R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
Well said Frank D

Author:	tommi [ Mon May 06, 2019 3:52 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
keogh wrote: maybe Bolts could show them the doco I saw today Who the hell.... watches a doco on a MONDAY...? kindest regards tommi

Author:	buzzaaaah [ Mon May 06, 2019 4:06 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: R7: Carlton v North Melbourne (Post Match Discussion)
Maybe Bolts has to change his "Never too low, never too high" philosophy. The players should burn after garbage like that, and feel good after a win. Winning is addictive for winners. It gives you a high that you want again and again. if you don't allow yourself to feel the high, there is little difference from a win or a narrow loss.