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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:29 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:21 pm
Posts: 7749
Rexy wrote:
jim, don't watch ch7



No choice. The footy's on there as is the cricket now...lol.

Don't think the Duck was far off the mark, not that we didn't know that already.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:12 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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jim wrote:
Just watching Talking Footy.

Lions had 309 uncontested possession and 24 marks inside 50. That's off the chart!

They were showing highlights of how we were zoning and showing how, as Carey said, we had absolutely no idea where we should be standing and positioning ourselves. Just totally lost as to what to do. He said the message, whatever he's teaching, is just not getting though using that style of play.


Bingo. My concern of late. It’s nothing to do with age but more confusion of our game plan. Real worry but some of us didn’t need Duck to tell us.

BB needs to address this ASAP!


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:31 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Sat Sep 19, 2009 2:58 pm
Posts: 1636
SurreyBlue wrote:
jim wrote:
Just watching Talking Footy.

Lions had 309 uncontested possession and 24 marks inside 50. That's off the chart!

They were showing highlights of how we were zoning and showing how, as Carey said, we had absolutely no idea where we should be standing and positioning ourselves. Just totally lost as to what to do. He said the message, whatever he's teaching, is just not getting though using that style of play.


Bingo. My concern of late. It’s nothing to do with age but more confusion of our game plan. Real worry but some of us didn’t need Duck to tell us.

BB needs to address this ASAP!


Watching Rowe try to play a zone is akin to seeing those Russian car crash videos, you know it's going to go badly; but you just have to see fu##ery with your own eyes.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:50 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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https://twitter.com/CarltonFC/status/1016285587152650240


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:55 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 17517
SurreyBlue wrote:
jim wrote:
Just watching Talking Footy.

Lions had 309 uncontested possession and 24 marks inside 50. That's off the chart!

They were showing highlights of how we were zoning and showing how, as Carey said, we had absolutely no idea where we should be standing and positioning ourselves. Just totally lost as to what to do. He said the message, whatever he's teaching, is just not getting though using that style of play.


Bingo. My concern of late. It’s nothing to do with age but more confusion of our game plan. Real worry but some of us didn’t need Duck to tell us.

BB needs to address this ASAP!



Really?
Rowe, Jones, Murphy, Lamb, Silvagni, Petrevski Seton, Thomas.
They've probably played a total of about 40 games in defence between them. How observant of Carey.

Put Docherty, Simpson, Alex Silvagni, Plowman, Williamson, Byrne in there and if they're struggling, get back to me. The smalls in there are our midfielders plugging holes. They've probably never played defence in their lives let alone having no experienced heads in there, giving them instruction.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:04 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:54 pm
Posts: 2251
SurreyBlue wrote:
jim wrote:
Just watching Talking Footy.

Lions had 309 uncontested possession and 24 marks inside 50. That's off the chart!

They were showing highlights of how we were zoning and showing how, as Carey said, we had absolutely no idea where we should be standing and positioning ourselves. Just totally lost as to what to do. He said the message, whatever he's teaching, is just not getting though using that style of play.


Bingo. My concern of late. It’s nothing to do with age but more confusion of our game plan. Real worry but some of us didn’t need Duck to tell us.

BB needs to address this ASAP!


Is this the same duck that said we should trade pick 1 for a few Melbourne fringe players?

That duck ?

Pay no attention


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:14 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:21 pm
Posts: 7749
doofdoof wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
jim wrote:
Just watching Talking Footy.

Lions had 309 uncontested possession and 24 marks inside 50. That's off the chart!

They were showing highlights of how we were zoning and showing how, as Carey said, we had absolutely no idea where we should be standing and positioning ourselves. Just totally lost as to what to do. He said the message, whatever he's teaching, is just not getting though using that style of play.


Bingo. My concern of late. It’s nothing to do with age but more confusion of our game plan. Real worry but some of us didn’t need Duck to tell us.

BB needs to address this ASAP!


Is this the same duck that said we should trade pick 1 for a few Melbourne fringe players?

That duck ?

Pay no attention


Wait on, before we shoot the messenger, try hearing the message instead. He was spot on about the way we played and handled our attempts to zone.

The part where he want us to use pick 1 for the 3 Melbourne players though he can stick right up his arse....lol. He maybe very good on the plays and "coaching", he was spot on there, but as a "list manager" he makes a good special comments man....lol.

Our pick 1, I reckon, is heading to Adelaide. They want Lukocious badly so we make them pay big. McGovern sounds good plus their first rounder.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:53 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Posts: 10059
Blue Vain wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
jim wrote:
Just watching Talking Footy.

Lions had 309 uncontested possession and 24 marks inside 50. That's off the chart!

They were showing highlights of how we were zoning and showing how, as Carey said, we had absolutely no idea where we should be standing and positioning ourselves. Just totally lost as to what to do. He said the message, whatever he's teaching, is just not getting though using that style of play.


Bingo. My concern of late. It’s nothing to do with age but more confusion of our game plan. Real worry but some of us didn’t need Duck to tell us.

BB needs to address this ASAP!


Really?
Rowe, Jones, Murphy, Lamb, Silvagni, Petrevski Seton, Thomas.
They've probably played a total of about 40 games in defence between them. How observant of Carey.

Put Docherty, Simpson, Alex Silvagni, Plowman, Williamson, Byrne in there and if they're struggling, get back to me. The smalls in there are our midfielders plugging holes. They've probably never played defence in their lives let alone having no experienced heads in there, giving them instruction.


BV, what about Weitering and Marchbank ( 3 quArters) playing the sweeping role. Thomas, Rowe and Jones have been our main defenders. That’s 5 of our defenders playing in their roles. The others rolled thru there and Lamb played back as needed. The zone defence isn’t working.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 11:17 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 17517
SurreyBlue wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
jim wrote:
Just watching Talking Footy.

Lions had 309 uncontested possession and 24 marks inside 50. That's off the chart!

They were showing highlights of how we were zoning and showing how, as Carey said, we had absolutely no idea where we should be standing and positioning ourselves. Just totally lost as to what to do. He said the message, whatever he's teaching, is just not getting though using that style of play.


Bingo. My concern of late. It’s nothing to do with age but more confusion of our game plan. Real worry but some of us didn’t need Duck to tell us.

BB needs to address this ASAP!


Really?
Rowe, Jones, Murphy, Lamb, Silvagni, Petrevski Seton, Thomas.
They've probably played a total of about 40 games in defence between them. How observant of Carey.

Put Docherty, Simpson, Alex Silvagni, Plowman, Williamson, Byrne in there and if they're struggling, get back to me. The smalls in there are our midfielders plugging holes. They've probably never played defence in their lives let alone having no experienced heads in there, giving them instruction.


BV, what about Weitering and Marchbank ( 3 quArters) playing the sweeping role. Thomas, Rowe and Jones have been our main defenders. That’s 5 of our defenders playing in their roles. The others rolled thru there and Lamb played back as needed. The zone defence isn’t working.



Thomas and Rowe are constant defenders because Alex Silvagni, Docherty, Williamson, Byrne, Plowman, Simpson are not available.
If half of them were available, Thomas would be playing wing or half forward. As would Lamb, Silvagni, Murphy, Lang, Petrevski Seton, Wright and any other forward/mid who has been forced to play there. Not only does it totally @#$%&! up our defence, it removes any midfield depth we had which was probably worst in the AFL. They aren't rolling through there. Several of them have become our first choice defenders.
Our defence has been our strength over the past couple of years. It's been totally decimated this year.

Plowman. A Silvagni. Simpson. Byrne. Macreadie. Williamson. Cuningham. Docherty. Shumacher. All injured and all would be better than some of our defensive options. That also allows Jack to offer midfield support. It allows Daisy and/or Lamb to play wing/high half forward so Ed and Graham etc are trying to get their rest on the wing. It becomes a domino effect.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:34 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Surely we then come up with a better system for the cattle we have?

But clearly not so then have we just not bothered teaching the fill in defenders the plan all year?

@#$%&! it. They are just fill ins. Don’t worry about it?

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:45 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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jim wrote:
Just watching Talking Footy.

Lions had 309 uncontested possession and 24 marks inside 50. That's off the chart!

They were showing highlights of how we were zoning and showing how, as Carey said, we had absolutely no idea where we should be standing and positioning ourselves. Just totally lost as to what to do. He said the message, whatever he's teaching, is just not getting though using that style of play.

He's right.
One of the reasons is that we have a cobbled together back line.
Not the only one.
The mids weren't working as hard as they did the week before.
I suspect the players are already looking forward to the end of the year.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:47 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Rexy wrote:

https://twitter.com/CarltonFC/status/1016285587152650240

Heard it all before. Actions speak louder than words.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:25 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Donstuie wrote:
Rexy wrote:

https://twitter.com/CarltonFC/status/1016285587152650240

Heard it all before. Actions speak louder than words.



actually, we've heard this since the ratten days. the players don't put in on the weekend, then vow to turn it around. rinse and repeat the cycle to where we never knew which carlton team would turn up for any particular weekend.

as bad as we're coached right now by bolton, there's been weeks this season (richmond, Essendon*, pies) where we've turned up to play. all of last season we played with mongrel. so... we're capable of turning up and putting in an honest shift. problem is the players look lost under bolton's game plan and/ or they're not willing to buy into it and put their bodies into the cause.


no matter how much blue vein goes on about our man power being down, these guys have played afl their whole life and all are capable of more than what they're currently giving us. if we were complaining about wins & losses, BV would have a point; our list is threadbare with key injuries. but we're not caring about wins right now. we're complaining about the lack of effort and interest and the lack of wanting to bleed for this jersey by the players.

Collingwood were tipped for bottom 4 with their list at preseason. buckley has them playing out of their skins, has them united and has them believing. never under estimate how a good coach can get teams playing above their pay grade.

it's something we're not familiar with here at cfc. we haven't played consistently united and overachieved since 1999.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:39 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Braithy wrote:
Donstuie wrote:
Rexy wrote:

https://twitter.com/CarltonFC/status/1016285587152650240

Heard it all before. Actions speak louder than words.



actually, we've heard this since the ratten days. the players don't put in on the weekend, then vow to turn it around. rinse and repeat the cycle to where we never knew which carlton team would turn up for any particular weekend.

as bad as we're coached right now by bolton, there's been weeks this season (richmond, Essendon**, pies) where we've turned up to play. all of last season we played with mongrel. so... we're capable of turning up and putting in an honest shift. problem is the players look lost under bolton's game plan and/ or they're not willing to buy into it and put their bodies into the cause.


no matter how much blue vein goes on about our man power being down, these guys have played afl their whole life and all are capable of more than what they're currently giving us. if we were complaining about wins & losses, BV would have a point; our list is threadbare with key injuries. but we're not caring about wins right now. we're complaining about the lack of effort and interest and the lack of wanting to bleed for this jersey by the players.

Collingwood were tipped for bottom 4 with their list at preseason. buckley has them playing out of their skins, has them united and has them believing. never under estimate how a good coach can get teams playing above their pay grade.

it's something we're not familiar with here at cfc. we haven't played consistently united and overachieved since 1999.



True, but still think we are lack the skills and are not physically strong enough.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:44 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Blue Vain wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
jim wrote:
Just watching Talking Footy.

Lions had 309 uncontested possession and 24 marks inside 50. That's off the chart!

They were showing highlights of how we were zoning and showing how, as Carey said, we had absolutely no idea where we should be standing and positioning ourselves. Just totally lost as to what to do. He said the message, whatever he's teaching, is just not getting though using that style of play.


Bingo. My concern of late. It’s nothing to do with age but more confusion of our game plan. Real worry but some of us didn’t need Duck to tell us.

BB needs to address this ASAP!


Really?
Rowe, Jones, Murphy, Lamb, Silvagni, Petrevski Seton, Thomas.
They've probably played a total of about 40 games in defence between them. How observant of Carey.

Put Docherty, Simpson, Alex Silvagni, Plowman, Williamson, Byrne in there and if they're struggling, get back to me. The smalls in there are our midfielders plugging holes. They've probably never played defence in their lives let alone having no experienced heads in there, giving them instruction.


BV, what about Weitering and Marchbank ( 3 quArters) playing the sweeping role. Thomas, Rowe and Jones have been our main defenders. That’s 5 of our defenders playing in their roles. The others rolled thru there and Lamb played back as needed. The zone defence isn’t working.



Thomas and Rowe are constant defenders because Alex Silvagni, Docherty, Williamson, Byrne, Plowman, Simpson are not available.
If half of them were available, Thomas would be playing wing or half forward. As would Lamb, Silvagni, Murphy, Lang, Petrevski Seton, Wright and any other forward/mid who has been forced to play there. Not only does it totally @#$%&! up our defence, it removes any midfield depth we had which was probably worst in the AFL. They aren't rolling through there. Several of them have become our first choice defenders.
Our defence has been our strength over the past couple of years. It's been totally decimated this year.

Plowman. A Silvagni. Simpson. Byrne. Macreadie. Williamson. Cuningham. Docherty. Shumacher. All injured and all would be better than some of our defensive options. That also allows Jack to offer midfield support. It allows Daisy and/or Lamb to play wing/high half forward so Ed and Graham etc are trying to get their rest on the wing. It becomes a domino effect.



That's been our whole problem form the on set.
18 defenders guarding grass and no avenue to goal. When you have 2/3 plus extra men as loose how can your mids attack with any positive manner. What chance does your forward line have to beat a defence that have out numbered us. Our mids cruise around guarding the flanks while we get thumped through the middle.
We are playing the losing game and the players have had enough. It's not about personnel it's how you use them that counts.
That's the reason McKay isn't playing more also, because he can't run up and down like a !@#$5 yo yo, and I don't blame that kid.
Silvagni was sent back to increase his numbers and knowledge in the middle and did so. So for whatever reason we get pumled through the middle but he has him and lamb in defence. Figure that one out.
If anyone thinks we are going to win any amount of significant games this way is truly a Carltonian.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:27 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Donstuie wrote:
Rexy wrote:

https://twitter.com/CarltonFC/status/1016285587152650240

Heard it all before. Actions speak louder than words.


Pretty sure they don't even bother cleaning the whiteboard these days with a big note on it "Please leave, MM, Rd2, 2018"

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:11 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
Posts: 3448
Blue Vain wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
jim wrote:
Just watching Talking Footy.

Lions had 309 uncontested possession and 24 marks inside 50. That's off the chart!

They were showing highlights of how we were zoning and showing how, as Carey said, we had absolutely no idea where we should be standing and positioning ourselves. Just totally lost as to what to do. He said the message, whatever he's teaching, is just not getting though using that style of play.


Bingo. My concern of late. It’s nothing to do with age but more confusion of our game plan. Real worry but some of us didn’t need Duck to tell us.

BB needs to address this ASAP!


Really?
Rowe, Jones, Murphy, Lamb, Silvagni, Petrevski Seton, Thomas.
They've probably played a total of about 40 games in defence between them. How observant of Carey.

Put Docherty, Simpson, Alex Silvagni, Plowman, Williamson, Byrne in there and if they're struggling, get back to me. The smalls in there are our midfielders plugging holes. They've probably never played defence in their lives let alone having no experienced heads in there, giving them instruction.


BV, what about Weitering and Marchbank ( 3 quArters) playing the sweeping role. Thomas, Rowe and Jones have been our main defenders. That’s 5 of our defenders playing in their roles. The others rolled thru there and Lamb played back as needed. The zone defence isn’t working.



Thomas and Rowe are constant defenders because Alex Silvagni, Docherty, Williamson, Byrne, Plowman, Simpson are not available.
If half of them were available, Thomas would be playing wing or half forward. As would Lamb, Silvagni, Murphy, Lang, Petrevski Seton, Wright and any other forward/mid who has been forced to play there. Not only does it totally @#$%&! up our defence, it removes any midfield depth we had which was probably worst in the AFL. They aren't rolling through there. Several of them have become our first choice defenders.
Our defence has been our strength over the past couple of years. It's been totally decimated this year.

Plowman. A Silvagni. Simpson. Byrne. Macreadie. Williamson. Cuningham. Docherty. Shumacher. All injured and all would be better than some of our defensive options. That also allows Jack to offer midfield support. It allows Daisy and/or Lamb to play wing/high half forward so Ed and Graham etc are trying to get their rest on the wing. It becomes a domino effect.



Yep, agree. Have been trying to explain to my mates the same thing.

Take Rance/Grimes/Astbury out of Rich for the year and I'll bet they lose at least 3 extra games and are sitting in 5th spot

If we give Rich a score of 10 with their best side and without Rance/Grimes/Astbury, they drop down to say an 8, they have effectively lost 20% ability

If we give Carl a score of 5 with their best side and they lose Docherty/Marchbank/Williamson, they drop down to a 3, a 40% drop in overall ability

I've made these numbers up so I don't want people to get hung up on them but it's a way of saying that the better sides can buffer against injuries. This was probably the worst year to get the injuries we have had.

Collingwood's injury woes over the last 3 years are now paying them back. They have had injuries this year but have been able to buffer because more players were given opportunities over the last 3 years than would have had they not had an injury crisis

Injuries are the biggest reason we are where we are right now
Effort is another issue which we need to address

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:57 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 2:15 pm
Posts: 20207
Location: North of the border
Blue Vain wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
jim wrote:
Just watching Talking Footy.

Lions had 309 uncontested possession and 24 marks inside 50. That's off the chart!

They were showing highlights of how we were zoning and showing how, as Carey said, we had absolutely no idea where we should be standing and positioning ourselves. Just totally lost as to what to do. He said the message, whatever he's teaching, is just not getting though using that style of play.


Bingo. My concern of late. It’s nothing to do with age but more confusion of our game plan. Real worry but some of us didn’t need Duck to tell us.

BB needs to address this ASAP!



Really?
Rowe, Jones, Murphy, Lamb, Silvagni, Petrevski Seton, Thomas.
They've probably played a total of about 40 games in defence between them. How observant of Carey.

Put Docherty, Simpson, Alex Silvagni, Plowman, Williamson, Byrne in there and if they're struggling, get back to me. The smalls in there are our midfielders plugging holes. They've probably never played defence in their lives let alone having no experienced heads in there, giving them instruction.



Point of order here BV - they smashed us up there last year and in the team was
Docherty Simpson Plowman Williamson Cunningham and MacCreadie Weitering

and we had Mackay Casboult Curnow forward
And just to shut Jim up - Kruezer was the only ruckman


Next excuse please


Tell me the man of steel wasn't available

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:10 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 17517
Sydney Blue wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
jim wrote:
Just watching Talking Footy.

Lions had 309 uncontested possession and 24 marks inside 50. That's off the chart!

They were showing highlights of how we were zoning and showing how, as Carey said, we had absolutely no idea where we should be standing and positioning ourselves. Just totally lost as to what to do. He said the message, whatever he's teaching, is just not getting though using that style of play.


Bingo. My concern of late. It’s nothing to do with age but more confusion of our game plan. Real worry but some of us didn’t need Duck to tell us.

BB needs to address this ASAP!



Really?
Rowe, Jones, Murphy, Lamb, Silvagni, Petrevski Seton, Thomas.
They've probably played a total of about 40 games in defence between them. How observant of Carey.

Put Docherty, Simpson, Alex Silvagni, Plowman, Williamson, Byrne in there and if they're struggling, get back to me. The smalls in there are our midfielders plugging holes. They've probably never played defence in their lives let alone having no experienced heads in there, giving them instruction.



Point of order here BV - they smashed us up there last year and in the team was
Docherty Simpson Plowman Williamson Cunningham and MacCreadie Weitering

and we had Mackay Casboult Curnow forward
And just to shut Jim up - Kruezer was the only ruckman


Next excuse please


Tell me the man of steel wasn't available



So, let me get this straight.
Because the Lions smashed us by a whole 30 points last year,( without Cripps), but with Docherty, Plowman, Williamson etc playing, that means injuries didn't have a bearing on Saturdays loss?

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:33 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 2:15 pm
Posts: 20207
Location: North of the border
Blue Vain wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
jim wrote:
Just watching Talking Footy.

Lions had 309 uncontested possession and 24 marks inside 50. That's off the chart!

They were showing highlights of how we were zoning and showing how, as Carey said, we had absolutely no idea where we should be standing and positioning ourselves. Just totally lost as to what to do. He said the message, whatever he's teaching, is just not getting though using that style of play.


Bingo. My concern of late. It’s nothing to do with age but more confusion of our game plan. Real worry but some of us didn’t need Duck to tell us.

BB needs to address this ASAP!



Really?
Rowe, Jones, Murphy, Lamb, Silvagni, Petrevski Seton, Thomas.
They've probably played a total of about 40 games in defence between them. How observant of Carey.

Put Docherty, Simpson, Alex Silvagni, Plowman, Williamson, Byrne in there and if they're struggling, get back to me. The smalls in there are our midfielders plugging holes. They've probably never played defence in their lives let alone having no experienced heads in there, giving them instruction.



Point of order here BV - they smashed us up there last year and in the team was
Docherty Simpson Plowman Williamson Cunningham and MacCreadie Weitering

and we had Mackay Casboult Curnow forward
And just to shut Jim up - Kruezer was the only ruckman


Next excuse please


Tell me the man of steel wasn't available



So, let me get this straight.
Because the Lions smashed us by a whole 30 points last year,( without Cripps), but with Docherty, Plowman, Williamson etc playing, that means injuries didn't have a bearing on Saturdays loss?
Correct

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