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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 6:52 pm 
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Harry Vallence

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frank dardew wrote:
Well said Donstuie
I have never been more embarrassed being a Carlton supporter than yesterday

It was so disappointing being at the ground thinking before the start that we had a chance and for the first half were still on the bye no effort no apptitude no grit no application
You can take the fact that our skills and decision making are crap that goes with being 18 th but the lack of effort /intensity etc was just simply an affront to the supporter base around the country but particularly those who turned up at the ground

Almost more galling is Bolton saying that second half was better etc nothing redeeming about yesterday and McKay running around today like a headless chook saying that we are going after free agents Gaff and McGovern as if they will come to a team that can't even at home against an interstate club be bothered trying or turning up


Couldn’t agree more Francis.

I can’t help feeling that the issues we have are many and varied and the Vet is front and centre.

You can rely on the Vet team front the media after demoralising defeats but he was embarrassing today.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 7:17 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Just saw the Kerridge interview.


Suspicions confirmed...

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:45 am 
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Geoff Southby

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Navy Blue Horse wrote:
If Graham plays another game.....


Equal worst performance I've seen in 30 years along with 124pt loss to North


Only other game I left at half time was Richmond 2005 when we were 12 goals down at the g.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:28 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Centenaryblue wrote:
I've been following since around '66 and I can't remember a Carlton side being booed off at half time.




Happened at Princes Park in the early 2000s. Against Sydney I think.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 10:36 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Ed’s quotes about this game almost sounded eerily similar to Murph’s comments after the GC game.

Why the @#$%&! aren’t these guys properly prepared (physically and mentally) before running onto the field??

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 11:28 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:48 pm
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Donstuie wrote:
Ed’s quotes about this game almost sounded eerily similar to Murph’s comments after the GC game.

Why the @#$%&! aren’t these guys properly prepared (physically and mentally) before running onto the field??


What has this group achieved to even contemplate being so complacent?!

Unforgiveable. Again.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 11:33 am 
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Craig Bradley

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Agree Donstuie GC and Freo game almost carbon copy of non performance
Don't get it at all
Completely unacceptable


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 12:46 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

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A lot to contemplate for the coaches. Kreuzer is a high quality ruckman around the ground but his form against the taller ruck men is terrible.
Gawn and Sandilands tore us apart in the centre square and Witts gave him a lesson around the ground. Our kids have shown they can compete in the middle if Kreuz can compete. When he cant, we're toasted.
Saturdays centre bounce stuff was embarrassing and our game consistently started from our defensive half.
Phillips is a better option in the middle but he doesn't have Kreuzers smarts at the general stoppages.

This weekend shouldn't be so bad as Grundy isn't a big body. But short term, we have to find a solution.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 2:48 pm 
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Harry Vallence

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I went to the game with my son in law and the two grandsons. I looked at the younger grandson (6yo) in the second quarter and the look on his face just about broke my heart, the older one (9yo) shortly afterwards said to me "can we go now, I don't want to see them beaten by more than one hundred points". Damn near had me in tears.

I dunno, is it just complete lack of confidence, lack of fitness, or are most of the players just giving (or given) up? Even if you haven't got the skills you can at least put in. At one stage in the second quarter the lack of effort from one player in particular had the son in law about ready to jump the fence he was so angry. Jeeze, I'm just so upset at the terrible skills, a player thirty metres away and you miss him by ten metres, how many goals did Freo kick due to turn overs?

Late in the second quarter Wright marked in the forward pocket, then turned his back and walked back to take his kick (missed everything) as O'Brien, on his own twenty metres out dead in front screamed for the ball. O'Brien shook his head in disgust and waved his arms in exasperation when he realised the ball wasn't coming his way. I suppose this is what happens when your team is going as badly as Carlton is, players tend to play for themselves, it was a terrible, terrible look though.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:21 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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cortez wrote:
I went to the game with my son in law and the two grandsons. I looked at the younger grandson (6yo) in the second quarter and the look on his face just about broke my heart, the older one (9yo) shortly afterwards said to me "can we go now, I don't want to see them beaten by more than one hundred points". Damn near had me in tears.

I dunno, is it just complete lack of confidence, lack of fitness, or are most of the players just giving (or given) up? Even if you haven't got the skills you can at least put in. At one stage in the second quarter the lack of effort from one player in particular had the son in law about ready to jump the fence he was so angry. Jeeze, I'm just so upset at the terrible skills, a player thirty metres away and you miss him by ten metres, how many goals did Freo kick due to turn overs?

Late in the second quarter Wright marked in the forward pocket, then turned his back and walked back to take his kick (missed everything) as O'Brien, on his own twenty metres out dead in front screamed for the ball. O'Brien shook his head in disgust and waved his arms in exasperation when he realised the ball wasn't coming his way. I suppose this is what happens when your team is going as badly as Carlton is, players tend to play for themselves, it was a terrible, terrible look though.

There is no excuse for lack of effort ... not injuries ... not inexperience ... no excuse whatsoever ...

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:23 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Blue Vain wrote:
A lot to contemplate for the coaches. Kreuzer is a high quality ruckman around the ground but his form against the taller ruck men is terrible.
Gawn and Sandilands tore us apart in the centre square and Witts gave him a lesson around the ground. Our kids have shown they can compete in the middle if Kreuz can compete. When he cant, we're toasted.
Saturdays centre bounce stuff was embarrassing and our game consistently started from our defensive half.
Phillips is a better option in the middle but he doesn't have Kreuzers smarts at the general stoppages.

This weekend shouldn't be so bad as Grundy isn't a big body. But short term, we have to find a solution.

Roll the dice ... play fewer talls to allow for the inclusion of Phillips ...

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 4:33 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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I feel your pain cortez. As I said in another thread, took my soon to be 6 y.o.

Wanted to have him back to his mum’s by 4 so the agreement was we’d just go to the first half. I’m facing a bit of a battle getting him behind the Blues but one thing I’ve found piques his interest is the get a chocolate every time Carlton gets a goal game. That totally gets him barracking for us.

Anyway, that first half was about as much chocolate as we got, & just before half time he asked if we could go home anyway. Like you cortez, that broke navy blue my heart that bit.

Like a lot of others here I’ve stopped caring as much over the last year or so, but that game really f-king hurt on the weekend. I didn’t boo them but I wasn’t disappointed others did, at all.

It’d be good if the club could get a guy like Perc or Rhys or Jimmy Buckley in this week, to let them know who we’re playing on the weekend & what that should mean to them.

HTFU Blues.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 12:01 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Blue Vain wrote:
A lot to contemplate for the coaches. Kreuzer is a high quality ruckman around the ground but his form against the taller ruck men is terrible.
Gawn and Sandilands tore us apart in the centre square and Witts gave him a lesson around the ground. Our kids have shown they can compete in the middle if Kreuz can compete. When he cant, we're toasted.
Saturdays centre bounce stuff was embarrassing and our game consistently started from our defensive half.
Phillips is a better option in the middle but he doesn't have Kreuzers smarts at the general stoppages.

This weekend shouldn't be so bad as Grundy isn't a big body. But short term, we have to find a solution.

He was also towelled up against Sydney and North.
Grundy is in the running for AA.
We will just see more of the same this week against Collingwood at the bounces.
The issue is more that Kreuzer is so competitive away from the bounce.
Jim doesn't think hitouts are important and that hitouts to advantage are a made up stat but he has the blinkers on when it comes to Kreuzer and can't explain qhy the teams with the best ruckmen (Sydney aside) are all going well.
If hitouts to advantage don't count, how does anybody explain the emergence of WCE since Natanui got back? He's single handedly given them a free hit at the stopages.
Gawn, dito. Grundy, Goldstein....

Kreuzer's best work is in the follow up to the ruck contest and around the ground. I would let him follow up someone else's and not his own. Put him rotating through the midfield with Cripps, Dow and the rest and have Phillips do the hitouts. Jim says he is too slow to be a midfielder but he's already playing that role to his own work. he won't be any slower if he's playing off the back of the ruck contest than he is recovering from losing it.

Cue Jim's weekly rant about how playing two ruckmen doesn't work, even though I am yet again not proposing two ruckmen.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 10:42 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
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Blue Sombrero wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
A lot to contemplate for the coaches. Kreuzer is a high quality ruckman around the ground but his form against the taller ruck men is terrible.
Gawn and Sandilands tore us apart in the centre square and Witts gave him a lesson around the ground. Our kids have shown they can compete in the middle if Kreuz can compete. When he cant, we're toasted.
Saturdays centre bounce stuff was embarrassing and our game consistently started from our defensive half.
Phillips is a better option in the middle but he doesn't have Kreuzers smarts at the general stoppages.

This weekend shouldn't be so bad as Grundy isn't a big body. But short term, we have to find a solution.

He was also towelled up against Sydney and North.
Grundy is in the running for AA.
We will just see more of the same this week against Collingwood at the bounces.
The issue is more that Kreuzer is so competitive away from the bounce.
Jim doesn't think hitouts are important and that hitouts to advantage are a made up stat but he has the blinkers on when it comes to Kreuzer and can't explain qhy the teams with the best ruckmen (Sydney aside) are all going well.
If hitouts to advantage don't count, how does anybody explain the emergence of WCE since Natanui got back? He's single handedly given them a free hit at the stopages.
Gawn, dito. Grundy, Goldstein....

Kreuzer's best work is in the follow up to the ruck contest and around the ground. I would let him follow up someone else's and not his own. Put him rotating through the midfield with Cripps, Dow and the rest and have Phillips do the hitouts. Jim says he is too slow to be a midfielder but he's already playing that role to his own work. he won't be any slower if he's playing off the back of the ruck contest than he is recovering from losing it.

Cue Jim's weekly rant about how playing two ruckmen doesn't work, even though I am yet again not proposing two ruckmen.


Exactly.

Kreuzer's form since he got injured in the 2nd quarter of round 1 has been ordinary other than the one Bombers game. ie he's not the bullocking ruck rover after he loses the tap some are suggesting. That was just one game this year and last year's story. He fumbles too much f my liking, and doesnt mark enough. I liked his 2 goals to open up our account on he weekend, but he was planted in the goal square at the time, and he didnt have a defender locked onto him.

Someone has to jump into Grundy in the ruck to nullify his tapwork. I think Levi is the only one who could do that.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:51 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

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I'll be surprised if Kreuzer doesn't perform well against Grundy. It's the taller ruckmen he struggles against.
Grundy is a follower, similar to Kreuzer. It will be more about who contributes more with the clearances and ground balls IMO. From memory, he touched up Grundy last year.
Hopefully that continues.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 9:39 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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...6 Days after the game and...

Thursday night PRIME TIMESLOT for a top of the ladder team

Only 7 shots at goal in a half of footy
Only 1 lucky goal

... for top of the ladder Wet Toast Eagles.

Based on that, Carlton should be a top 8 team.

...6 Days back....

You'd think pre season wooden spoon favourite Carlton shot Bambi

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2018 11:34 am 
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Harry Vallence
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Cripps effort in the first quarter against Fyfe was terrible (not much better the other 3 quarters)with a total lack of accountability or care for what his opponent is doing. Yep we know Cripps is a lone hand at times and is a warier but if you are getting flogged by your opponent how standing defensive side not just kick chasing or walking through the middle of the ground even though your opponent is running away with the ball the whole game.


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