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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2018 7:31 pm 
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John Nicholls
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forget the rumour, it doesn't matter cos its true???? Trump should sponsor this site.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2018 9:43 pm 
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Harry Vallence

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bondiblue wrote:
Taff wrote:
I think a critical factor here is skill level. You can have all the plans and having players run to position. However, if the ball is delivered at their feet or more often out of their reach all plans will look ineffective. Improving skill level especially when under pressure and when fatigue sets in is vital. So many times this past season, players just did not hit targets by foot and hand consistently.


When Roos took on the job as Head Coach of Melbourne, he stated the best plan in the world can't work if your players dont have the tools to carry them out.

Start with the fundamentals kicking and hand balling and work from there.

If players can't get to the level of fitness required to execute the game plan, replace them with the types that can.

I'm sure a lot of the 23 players under 23 will be cut in the next 3-4 years because of this.

As mentioned above Carlton had Murphy Docherty Thomas Rowe Lamb and one other who could execute the game plan. Interesting that all these players are seasoned with a few preseasons and a lot of footy under their belts.

I'm sure there were problems with the Game plan for this group of players at the stage they're at, along with parts of the game plan that are just too difficult to execute, ie don't work in practicality.

I'm expecting change, development and improvement on every level next year or they are on notice. All of them.


Rowe execute the game plan huh :eek: , was the game plan to give up as many goals as possible by playing 20 to 30 meters away his opponent ?


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 6:16 am 
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Ken Hunter

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95% of there time, Rowe played tightly on his opponents. He had limitations and he understood them. The only times he played off his man was to press up on an unmanned players. Every other team plays exactly the same way, they just executed it better.

smithy wrote:
The fact our game plan was too complicated and negative was blatantly obvious to anyone who understands football.


So it's only people like you who find our game plan complicated that really understand football? No arrogance there. :grin:
Yes we played a defensive style but our game plan wasn't complicated at all. Most teams play similar versions and in fact, most lower level teams do. We just struggled to execute against superior opposition.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 8:42 am 
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Robert Walls
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So Bolton is going to Harvard...
Does that mean our game plan will get more complicated?


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 9:28 am 
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formerly King Kenny
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Bluey44 wrote:
So Bolton is going to Harvard...
Does that mean our game plan will get more complicated?


Will become more agile ;-)


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 9:41 am 
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Harry Vallence

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Blue Vain wrote:
95% of there time, Rowe played tightly on his opponents. He had limitations and he understood them. The only times he played off his man was to press up on an unmanned players. Every other team plays exactly the same way, they just executed it better.

smithy wrote:
The fact our game plan was too complicated and negative was blatantly obvious to anyone who understands football.


So it's only people like you who find our game plan complicated that really understand football? No arrogance there. :grin:
Yes we played a defensive style but our game plan wasn't complicated at all. Most teams play similar versions and in fact, most lower level teams do. We just struggled to execute against superior opposition.


That's simply not true on Rowe.

Then you've thrown out blanket statements like "Most teams play similar versions and in fact, most lower level teams do." And no they don't. There are two main game styles and they are not the same.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 10:24 am 
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Ken Hunter

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smithy wrote:
That's simply not true on Rowe.

Then you've thrown out blanket statements like "Most teams play similar versions and in fact, most lower level teams do." And no they don't.


You say it's "simply not true" but you provide no evidence to back it up. I gave reasons why Rowe is occasionally caught out playing off his opponent. Saying it's "not true" isn't actually a viable counter argument.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:29 am 
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Geoff Southby

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Agree with BV Rowe gave his all and didn’t deviate in my view from game plan was certainly a team player but what I think supporters were hard on Rowe was that still after 99 games would make some shocking decisions when he had the ball or made such egregious errors punching when he should have marked or attempting to mark when he should have punched or coughing up multiple goals in back 50 with basic mistakes or rookie errors


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:12 am 
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Harry Vallence

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SurreyBlue wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
verbs wrote:
From listening to that podcast I get the feeling it will take Russell up to a year to make a significant impact. It really sounds like he likes to know the players inside out, which takes time.


Take note BB....here is your next excuse....


I don't understand the constant attack and belittling of our coach?

I bet he doesn't use that as an excuse, and its just an excuse for you to hae a dig at him.

Have some faith surrey.

This club and its supporters have been to hell and back.
Surely you can see positive changes on every level of the footy club over the last 3 years.
Give BB a chance to coach a team capable of delivering. There 23 kids under 23 on our list...that's not an excuse, its reality.


Bondi, wrong or not, Bolton has used the excuse of youth and injuries plenty of times during the year.
Please review his after match conferences, if you need too.

My issue is not either of injuries or youth but the players looked like headless chooks in 2018 and they had no idea what the game plan was or what was required. After 3 years in charge of the group alarm bells are ringing. I’ve lost faith - you bet, but I’m not alone!

The fact the review confirmed the game plan was too complicated confirms what I was watching unfold.


I agree with this.
I am less concerned about the players’ development. I have seen enough in most of the young recruits to see these are the right guys.
What threw me last season was the way our game plan fell apart. As it turned out, we were too hasty to push for a more offensive game plan (I think sucked in by the media...). But then, when we recognised this, we were unable to bring back the strong and cohesive defensive plan that had served us well in previous couple of years.
I do believe the loss of Docherty plus inclusion of Jones was a big factor - Docherty to keep our defensive structure in place; Jones taking a few too many liberties, breaking the structure.
So, next year, I’m looking primarily for a cohesive and effective game plan: the game plan needs to be good and the players need to be equipped to execute it. Failure in either of those reflects poorly on Bolton.
Having said that, I am optimistic that we will improve significantly on both those fronts with the return of Docherty and the injection of some additional talent and personnel capable of executing the plan.
Plus Bolton strikes me as a coach keen to keep learning and improving.

I expect 6-10 wins, driven mostly by:
1) More consistent execution of the game plan across the board
2) McGovern straightening us up a lot and giving McKay a bit more scope to develop
3) More consistent back 6, featuring a core of Weitering, Marchbank, Plowman and Docherty
4) Greater midfield depth and development: Dow a year older, Kennedy injury free, Fisher maintaining his output, SPS lifting his consistency and output*

*Any meaningful contributions from Setterfield or (hopefully) Walsh would be a bonus but not expected.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 12:39 pm 
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Ken Hunter

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17th Premiership wrote:
What threw me last season was the way our game plan fell apart. As it turned out, we were too hasty to push for a more offensive game plan (I think sucked in by the media...). But then, when we recognised this, we were unable to bring back the strong and cohesive defensive plan that had served us well in previous couple of years.


Our best possible backline unit this year

Docherty-zero games
Williamson- zero games
Alex Silvagni- zero games
Plowman - 13 games
Marchbank - 12 games
Simpson - 21 games.
Jones - 17 games

Is it a surprise we weren't capable of returning to the "strong and cohesive defensive plan that has served us well in the previous couple of years"?
How do you have cohesion when many of you defenders have played zero games together as a defensive unit, if as defenders previously at all?
How many games do you think Jack Silvagni, Jed Lamb, Matthew Wright, David Cuningham etc have played in defence in their careers?
To be thrown by our inability to replicate that is staggering IMO.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 03, 2018 9:05 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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Whoah...love your new avatar N.B!

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 03, 2018 9:09 am 
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Harry Vallence

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The coach needs to show a lot more faith in his defenders. He kills them atm by giving them no credit by playing so defensively. Tactically we are awful.
At some point you have to look your enemy dead in the eye and say "I'm coming right at you to win and I'm prepared to lose in doing so".
Furthermore we are not Hawthorn, what worked there will not necessarily work here. He needs to realize this fast.
This slow possession mark/kick style should never be option A, B or even C... teams that abandoned this are the one's that rose up the ladder fast, Richmond Collingwood.
When you average 8 goals a game and the competition averages 12 you have a big big problem, and laments about youth/injuries are not going to solve the problem.

The absolute first thing we need to sort out is ability to force turnovers- pressure on the opposition and tackling, then we can work on seamless flow from defense to attack- urgency in possession- creating openings when in possession in a slow play situation.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 1:28 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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viewtopic.php?f=36&t=35144&start=1020

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 3:53 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:06 am
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Blue Vain wrote:
17th Premiership wrote:
What threw me last season was the way our game plan fell apart. As it turned out, we were too hasty to push for a more offensive game plan (I think sucked in by the media...). But then, when we recognised this, we were unable to bring back the strong and cohesive defensive plan that had served us well in previous couple of years.


Our best possible backline unit this year

Docherty-zero games
Williamson- zero games
Alex Silvagni- zero games
Plowman - 13 games
Marchbank - 12 games
Simpson - 21 games.
Jones - 17 games

Is it a surprise we weren't capable of returning to the "strong and cohesive defensive plan that has served us well in the previous couple of years"?
How do you have cohesion when many of you defenders have played zero games together as a defensive unit, if as defenders previously at all?
How many games do you think Jack Silvagni, Jed Lamb, Matthew Wright, David Cuningham etc have played in defence in their careers?
To be thrown by our inability to replicate that is staggering IMO.

Stop talking sense!


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2018 3:18 pm 
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Rod Ashman

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Looking forward to the coach being able to use Doc, Simpson, O'Brien and Williamson to hit up McGovern or Curnow from half back to half forward. Then swing around quickly to McKay one out.

What we are missing is the small forwards to lock it in.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2018 7:42 pm 
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Ken Hunter

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toddkurnski wrote:
Looking forward to the coach being able to use Doc, Simpson, O'Brien and Williamson to hit up McGovern or Curnow from half back to half forward. Then swing around quickly to McKay one out.

What we are missing is the small forwards to lock it in.


First scenario is about right imo.
All 4 are really good kicks: short, medium and long deadly passes by foot.
Who wouldn't want to be on the end of those.

That's the part I'm loving about Carlton.
Good disposal by foot.
We also have Newman from HB
The whole midfield go allright with disposal by foot too.
Just say the word Fish, and you can see him hitting up 45 metre passes to McKay Mitch or Charlie leads.
Kreuzer and Cripps will have stints forward too.

I'm sure I'm not getting ahead of myself, but the above mentioned have proven they are good by foot or good forward targets.

its coming together

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2018 7:57 pm 
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Ken Hunter

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As far as small forwards are concerned, I don't think we will get any from the draft: maybe Ben Cavarra from the VFL.

I have no doubt our current mids will play the role of small forward this year:
Murphy, Fisher, SPS and Dow.

Polson and LeBois are contending for the small forward's spot too, Pickett should be, as should Lang, Garlett maybe Cuningham.

Fasolo is only 181. He plays tall but he's a strong small.

We have plenty of cover in the small forward position imo for 2019.

For that reason I would take the best inside outside mid with Walsh as opposed to 'showtime' Rankine.

I think our current mid sized mobile mids on our list will cover for Rankine's forward role:
Setterfield, Kennedy or maybe Silvagni takes the next step, and surely McGovern will.

Class players always find a way to score goals. Its harder to do that playing pure midfield.
Put them forward and they are still class players.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 1:01 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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You left our Cripps as a resting mid playing 'small forward'.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 8:44 pm 
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Ken Hunter

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Blue Sombrero wrote:
You left our Cripps as a resting mid playing 'small forward'.


Cripps will continue where he started last season...drifts into the forward line and mismatches the opposition.
Mark Kick Goal.

I'm hoping he kicks 25+ in 2019.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:04 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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bondiblue wrote:
Blue Sombrero wrote:
You left our Cripps as a resting mid playing 'small forward'.


Cripps will continue where he started last season...drifts into the forward line and mismatches the opposition.
Mark Kick Goal.

I'm hoping he kicks 25+ in 2019.



Will kick 40+ if he improves his accuracy.

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