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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 12:37 pm 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Thu May 11, 2006 6:11 pm
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Navy Blue Horse wrote:
its not development per se...it's who they're surrounded by. Freos youngsters yesterday had quality around them....fyfe, hill, sandi, mundy, neale etc. ours had simpson as the exception in that age group, not much else (of quality)

I posted something on another thread about this.
Players such as Gibbs and Touhy are what our young players need.
The heat will be on us this week so it will be interesting to see how the playing group respond.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 12:39 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Donstuie wrote:
Yesterday’s presser was the first time Ive been disappointed in Bolts’ words.

Yesterday was inexcusable and Bolts had the perfect opportunity to really put the blowtorch on the players that delivered that performance.

It wasn’t the time to talk green shoots, injuries, “breaking even in the 2nd half”, list turnover or age profile. It wasn’t the day for sugarcoating.

It was the time to make it clear that no matter the context, lack of effort and application is unacceptable. That’s what we saw, it was clear as day. What irked me most was when he said (paraphrased) that these are professionals who don’t go out and “not try”, when we know from our own captain’s words that this does happen.

I’m still on board, but yesterday was not Bolts’ finest hour.



What would he really be saying behind closed doors?

And what really is the purpose of these press conferences?

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Until each team plays each other the same number of times, the AFL, as a fair dinkum competition, cannot be taken seriously.

He (Mr Swann) said the honour and pride associated with the club's traditional navy blue jumper was priceless.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 12:39 pm 
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Craig Bradley

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After watching Ed Curnow on the Footy Show I want to know why we went with an offensive, zoning game plan again when we are purely hopeless at it. We have been horribly humiliated each time we have used it. We are totally lost. We play so much better when we use our defensive, congested game plan, and anyway, that's the way footy is played these days. We are very competitive when we play that way and look a side even in defeat. That was a winnable game yesterday and the coach F up. Pissed off with that.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 12:41 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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bluedog wrote:
Donstuie wrote:
Yesterday’s presser was the first time Ive been disappointed in Bolts’ words.

Yesterday was inexcusable and Bolts had the perfect opportunity to really put the blowtorch on the players that delivered that performance.

It wasn’t the time to talk green shoots, injuries, “breaking even in the 2nd half”, list turnover or age profile. It wasn’t the day for sugarcoating.

It was the time to make it clear that no matter the context, lack of effort and application is unacceptable. That’s what we saw, it was clear as day. What irked me most was when he said (paraphrased) that these are professionals who don’t go out and “not try”, when we know from our own captain’s words that this does happen.

I’m still on board, but yesterday was not Bolts’ finest hour.



What would he really be saying behind closed doors?

And what really is the purpose of these press conferences?

To give the supporters insight into what is going on.

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#GUILTY


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 1:36 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Sydney Blue wrote:
Juddy&theKruezers wrote:
Who should we get as coach ? ...
We need to eat Humble pie and get Ratten back

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk


IMO, the biggest mistake we made was to get rid of him. We should have supported him and given him assistance to help him. Very much Buckley at Collingwood. I would love to see him back in any capacity.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 1:53 pm 
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Geoff Southby
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jim wrote:
After watching Ed Curnow on the Footy Show I want to know why we went with an offensive, zoning game plan again when we are purely hopeless at it. We have been horribly humiliated each time we have used it. We are totally lost. We play so much better when we use our defensive, congested game plan, and anyway, that's the way footy is played these days. We are very competitive when we play that way and look a side even in defeat. That was a winnable game yesterday and the coach F up. Pissed off with that.


Yep ! its what we do and do pretty well.Asking for anything more is beyond our capabilities and is destined to fail.Bolton should know that know like the back of his hand.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 2:25 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Donstuie wrote:
bluedog wrote:
What would he really be saying behind closed doors?

And what really is the purpose of these press conferences?

To give the supporters insight into what is going on.


Also, players are likely to be stung more by a public bagging than one done in private. Can backfire of course, but if done right to the right players, it can be a psychological winner. Having said that, the only Carlton players who could cope with a public dressing-down are probably those who least need it!


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 2:34 pm 
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Craig Bradley

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A Bolton supporter but why he can't seem to get intensity attitude right when we play interstate clubs in Melbourne is a worry

GC and Freo games both winnable in my view but blown out of water in first quarter when the whole team don't come to play until half time

If we had won those 2 games and not been pathetic and uncompetitive in those 2 games because of largely our own ineptitude the natives would not be nearly so restless

Different circumstances but what is the bet the 3rd year in a row when we go to Brisbane we will be 6 or 7 goals behind at quarter time


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 2:59 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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frank dardew wrote:
A Bolton supporter but why he can't seem to get intensity attitude right when we play interstate clubs in Melbourne is a worry

GC and Freo games both winnable in my view but blown out of water in first quarter when the whole team don't come to play until half time

If we had won those 2 games and not been pathetic and uncompetitive in those 2 games because of largely our own ineptitude the natives would not be nearly so restless

Different circumstances but what is the bet the 3rd year in a row when we go to Brisbane we will be 6 or 7 goals behind at quarter time

The Dominator recently spoke about the non negotiables ... do we play with any of these ? ...

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 3:18 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 12:01 pm
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Donstuie wrote:
bluedog wrote:
Donstuie wrote:
Yesterday’s presser was the first time Ive been disappointed in Bolts’ words.

Yesterday was inexcusable and Bolts had the perfect opportunity to really put the blowtorch on the players that delivered that performance.

It wasn’t the time to talk green shoots, injuries, “breaking even in the 2nd half”, list turnover or age profile. It wasn’t the day for sugarcoating.

It was the time to make it clear that no matter the context, lack of effort and application is unacceptable. That’s what we saw, it was clear as day. What irked me most was when he said (paraphrased) that these are professionals who don’t go out and “not try”, when we know from our own captain’s words that this does happen.

I’m still on board, but yesterday was not Bolts’ finest hour.



What would he really be saying behind closed doors?

And what really is the purpose of these press conferences?

To give the supporters insight into what is going on.


Supporters aren't stupid - well, most aren't. You can fool some of the people some of the time etc etc. Green shoots, exciting times, lights at the end of tunnels - doesn't cut it any more.

In the context of a 150-year-old footy club, we're at crisis point. If this continues, the road back will take another 2 decades and will only be complete with multiple flags.

The competition has left us behind. We're the new Fitzroy.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 4:41 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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The Duke wrote:
Supporters aren't stupid - well, most aren't. You can fool some of the people some of the time etc etc. Green shoots, exciting times, lights at the end of tunnels - doesn't cut it any more.

In the context of a 150-year-old footy club, we're at crisis point. If this continues, the road back will take another 2 decades and will only be complete with multiple flags.

The competition has left us behind. We're the new Fitzroy.


:clap: The very reason some of us have been raising concerns earlier.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:30 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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I really want to know how Andy McKay keeps his job? How can this guy still be there? And who is responsible for our medical team? FFS *facepalm*


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:40 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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SurreyBlue wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Juddy&theKruezers wrote:
Who should we get as coach ? ...
We need to eat Humble pie and get Ratten back

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk


IMO, the biggest mistake we made was to get rid of him. We should have supported him and given him assistance to help him. Very much Buckley at Collingwood. I would love to see him back in any capacity.

Many of us..well actually a smallish group of us felt that way... but we needed a massive overhaul and let's face it...probs couldn't have happened had he remained. There were issues with him too because issues at the club unresolved!
Honestly?
I would rather have Clarkson . An inventive thinker with so much experience.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 11:23 am 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:21 pm
Posts: 7776
bluegirl72 wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Juddy&theKruezers wrote:
Who should we get as coach ? ...
We need to eat Humble pie and get Ratten back

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk


IMO, the biggest mistake we made was to get rid of him. We should have supported him and given him assistance to help him. Very much Buckley at Collingwood. I would love to see him back in any capacity.

Many of us..well actually a smallish group of us felt that way... but we needed a massive overhaul and let's face it...probs couldn't have happened had he remained. There were issues with him too because issues at the club unresolved!
Honestly?
I would rather have Clarkson . An inventive thinker with so much experience.


Probably work alot better the second time around given Ratts got us to finals 2 years after being a basket case. Better than 50% record, 3 finals series, including a near PF, with a side that was pretty average. A bit of cream at the top crap at the bottom. I'd like to see him now with SOS as his List manager rather than having the handicap of Wayne Hughes. I'd like to see him now without the issues we had then. Even the injury-hit year he was sacked he got 11 wins. We'd kill for that right now.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 11:57 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Ratts is not the solution, IMO.

I loved him as a player, but he couldn't coach. He was all about stats rather than growing the players and the club. It was Judd that took us to finals - no doubt, along with Eddie, Murph, Gibbs, Fev, Simmo. Our side was actually pretty good back then. Ratts and his crew gave up picks for hacks and quality players walked.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 12:00 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Ratts had a very simple gameplan: "Get it to the Champ."

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 12:31 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 17563
The Duke wrote:
Donstuie wrote:
bluedog wrote:
Donstuie wrote:
Yesterday’s presser was the first time Ive been disappointed in Bolts’ words.

Yesterday was inexcusable and Bolts had the perfect opportunity to really put the blowtorch on the players that delivered that performance.

It wasn’t the time to talk green shoots, injuries, “breaking even in the 2nd half”, list turnover or age profile. It wasn’t the day for sugarcoating.

It was the time to make it clear that no matter the context, lack of effort and application is unacceptable. That’s what we saw, it was clear as day. What irked me most was when he said (paraphrased) that these are professionals who don’t go out and “not try”, when we know from our own captain’s words that this does happen.

I’m still on board, but yesterday was not Bolts’ finest hour.



What would he really be saying behind closed doors?

And what really is the purpose of these press conferences?

To give the supporters insight into what is going on.


Supporters aren't stupid - well, most aren't. You can fool some of the people some of the time etc etc. Green shoots, exciting times, lights at the end of tunnels - doesn't cut it any more.

In the context of a 150-year-old footy club, we're at crisis point. If this continues, the road back will take another 2 decades and will only be complete with multiple flags.

The competition has left us behind. We're the new Fitzroy.


The new Fitzroy. :lol:

Before the season started, our midfield would have been Cripps, Murphy, Curnow, Docherty, Kennedy, with cameo appearances from the kids. Instead we have Cripps, Ed and kids. Dow, SPS, Fisher. They're our midfielders. First and second year players.
Murphy, Docherty, Kennedy, all shot with injuries.

Forget forward lines and backlines, the game starts at the contest and we're relying on kids to be our engine room. What makes it worse, our VFL midfield currently consists of non AFL listed players so we cant even bring any strength up. Compounding the issue is Kreuzers inability to compete in the centre square against tall ruck men. On Saturday we had kids playing against Fyfe, Neale, Mundy, Blakely and Sandilands giving them absolute silver service.

We rebuilt our spine. We rebuilt our midfield. The trouble is our kids are currently our midfield. The experienced bigger bodies are not there to carry the load.
If we get to the end of the year and haven't improved significantly with 4+ wins, go your hardest. Until then, look at the reality.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 2:39 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Joined: Sun Dec 30, 2007 9:12 pm
Posts: 4426
Blue Vain wrote:
The Duke wrote:
Donstuie wrote:
bluedog wrote:
Donstuie wrote:
Yesterday’s presser was the first time Ive been disappointed in Bolts’ words.

Yesterday was inexcusable and Bolts had the perfect opportunity to really put the blowtorch on the players that delivered that performance.

It wasn’t the time to talk green shoots, injuries, “breaking even in the 2nd half”, list turnover or age profile. It wasn’t the day for sugarcoating.

It was the time to make it clear that no matter the context, lack of effort and application is unacceptable. That’s what we saw, it was clear as day. What irked me most was when he said (paraphrased) that these are professionals who don’t go out and “not try”, when we know from our own captain’s words that this does happen.

I’m still on board, but yesterday was not Bolts’ finest hour.


What would he really be saying behind closed doors?

And what really is the purpose of these press conferences?

To give the supporters insight into what is going on.


Supporters aren't stupid - well, most aren't. You can fool some of the people some of the time etc etc. Green shoots, exciting times, lights at the end of tunnels - doesn't cut it any more.

In the context of a 150-year-old footy club, we're at crisis point. If this continues, the road back will take another 2 decades and will only be complete with multiple flags.

The competition has left us behind. We're the new Fitzroy.


The new Fitzroy. :lol:

Before the season started, our midfield would have been Cripps, Murphy, Curnow, Docherty, Kennedy, with cameo appearances from the kids. Instead we have Cripps, Ed and kids. Dow, SPS, Fisher. They're our midfielders. First and second year players.
Murphy, Docherty, Kennedy, all shot with injuries.

Forget forward lines and backlines, the game starts at the contest and we're relying on kids to be our engine room. What makes it worse, our VFL midfield currently consists of non AFL listed players so we cant even bring any strength up. Compounding the issue is Kreuzers inability to compete in the centre square against tall ruck men. On Saturday we had kids playing against Fyfe, Neale, Mundy, Blakely and Sandilands giving them absolute silver service.

We rebuilt our spine. We rebuilt our midfield. The trouble is our kids are currently our midfield. The experienced bigger bodies are not there to carry the load.
If we get to the end of the year and haven't improved significantly with 4+ wins, go your hardest. Until then, look at the reality.

In reality BV ... our midfield is basically Crippa at the moment ... so at the beginning of every game it’s Crippa v 8-10 mids for the opposition

_________________
"Truth, for the tyrants, is the most terrible and cruel of all bindings; it is like an incandescent iron falling across their chests. And it is even more agonizing than hot iron, for that only burns the flesh, while truth burns its way into the soul"     — Lauro Aguirre


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 2:46 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:00 pm
Posts: 24301
Location: Kaloyasena
Blue Vain wrote:
The Duke wrote:
Donstuie wrote:
bluedog wrote:
Donstuie wrote:
Yesterday’s presser was the first time Ive been disappointed in Bolts’ words.

Yesterday was inexcusable and Bolts had the perfect opportunity to really put the blowtorch on the players that delivered that performance.

It wasn’t the time to talk green shoots, injuries, “breaking even in the 2nd half”, list turnover or age profile. It wasn’t the day for sugarcoating.

It was the time to make it clear that no matter the context, lack of effort and application is unacceptable. That’s what we saw, it was clear as day. What irked me most was when he said (paraphrased) that these are professionals who don’t go out and “not try”, when we know from our own captain’s words that this does happen.

I’m still on board, but yesterday was not Bolts’ finest hour.



What would he really be saying behind closed doors?

And what really is the purpose of these press conferences?

To give the supporters insight into what is going on.


Supporters aren't stupid - well, most aren't. You can fool some of the people some of the time etc etc. Green shoots, exciting times, lights at the end of tunnels - doesn't cut it any more.

In the context of a 150-year-old footy club, we're at crisis point. If this continues, the road back will take another 2 decades and will only be complete with multiple flags.

The competition has left us behind. We're the new Fitzroy.


The new Fitzroy. :lol:

Before the season started, our midfield would have been Cripps, Murphy, Curnow, Docherty, Kennedy, with cameo appearances from the kids. Instead we have Cripps, Ed and kids. Dow, SPS, Fisher. They're our midfielders. First and second year players.
Murphy, Docherty, Kennedy, all shot with injuries.

Forget forward lines and backlines, the game starts at the contest and we're relying on kids to be our engine room. What makes it worse, our VFL midfield currently consists of non AFL listed players so we cant even bring any strength up. Compounding the issue is Kreuzers inability to compete in the centre square against tall ruck men. On Saturday we had kids playing against Fyfe, Neale, Mundy, Blakely and Sandilands giving them absolute silver service.

We rebuilt our spine. We rebuilt our midfield. The trouble is our kids are currently our midfield. The experienced bigger bodies are not there to carry the load.
If we get to the end of the year and haven't improved significantly with 4+ wins, go your hardest. Until then, look at the reality.



If our spine was rebuilt and we were short on mids why the hell did we then pick De Koning and then Schumacher?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:49 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 17563
The problem isn't necessarily the drafting of midfielders IMO. Our issue is our drafted midfielders are still too young and slight to make a significant difference.
Dow, SPS, Fisher, O'Brien, I expect them all to be 150+ game players. The problem is Murphy, Docherty and Kennedy haven't been the more seasoned bodies to make the kids part players instead of the core group.
As I said elsewhere, I suspect Cripps, Murphy, Ed, Docherty, Kennedy and Lang were to be our midfield group with the kids playing a small role. Instead the kids are our main midfielders due to injury and limited pre-seasons.
Taking mids instead of De Koning or Schumacher wouldn't have solved our problem.
FWIW, I think DeKoning will be an inspired pick. He'll go past Harry at a great rate.

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