As you know I go back a fair way but the Ratten sides of the last 3 years remind me of an earlier era in the mid to late 70s coached by Thorogood where we played finals had a lot of talent but ultimately didnt have character mental strength or grunt to go to the top
Players cruised on talent alone but could never bridge the gap with the better sides because apart from talent didn't have the other various intangibles that a great side needed
Ultimately Thoro was shown the door because the side continually couldn't come up with the goods -made the finals but didn't have the hard edge
In particular during a couple of seasons Thoro sides would always be beaten in the wet because games in the wet required a lot more than just talent
Our present side seems to lose quite often especially this year where games need more than pure talent
They lost the finals in 2009 2010 when they were in front and should have gusted it out we now lose to sides that apply physical pressure -talent alone won't win you enough games
Ratts may get more grace than Thoro but the similarities are apparent
Anyone agree

Frank some guys had a thinggy at a pub last night.. and a few us discussed exactly that.

From the Thoro years to wet football and contested football thats required.

Also what happens with a coaching change.

So we agree those that were there last night

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before my time, interesting

so what happened next?

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'‘He had an enormous capacity to pump himself up and get the best out of himself when it mattered. He had a fire in his belly – a passion for the contest like few other players’' -- D Parkin in reference to the dominator

We dominated....

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"Truth, for the tyrants, is the most terrible and cruel of all bindings; it is like an incandescent iron falling across their chests. And it is even more agonizing than hot iron, for that only burns the flesh, while truth burns its way into the soul"     — Lauro Aguirre

Ian Stewart took over - but we won't go there.......

Jezza took over in 78 was a very basic coach but hardened players
Premiers 1979

so we drifted for a few years, tried a few more coaches and some 5 years later we got our act together and won a string of GFs.

i hope we get that string of GFs but hope history does not repeat and we stagnate for 5 years too

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'‘He had an enormous capacity to pump himself up and get the best out of himself when it mattered. He had a fire in his belly – a passion for the contest like few other players’' -- D Parkin in reference to the dominator

But we flowered up first and appointed the wrong coach first.

But the difference between that era and this era is that from 1976, to 1979, we recruited a plethora of hard and tough young players, such as Buckley, Sheldon, Harmes, Johnston, Marcou, Glasscott and McConnville all of whom formed the nucleus of those triple premiership teams during that era.

I cant see how we have done the same now - our cupboard of young talented players 18, 19 year olds is very very bare.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

Do i agree ? yes and no.I agree they were wasted years,differance is the mid seventies side had far more talent than the current crop.

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All my dangerous friends

Stewart was the wrong choice but one Jezza took over in 78 we started playing tough football and if we hadn't have lost those early games in 78 would have been a big chance to take it out
You also need to remember that Jezza walked out after winning in 79 and we could have done better in 1980 if he was coaching parko took over in 1981 and 1982 back to back

Yep,agree Frank.Those truely were the wasted years.Reckon in those days we had GUN footballers by the dozen.Pretty mediocre lot now compared to then.

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All my dangerous friends

So do we make Juddy captain coach

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

Maybe different types and not as talented but if we can't build a really good side around walker murph Kreuz Gibbs henderson then there is something seriously wrong
Others such as Judd Simpson Jamison all a bit older etc should make a very good unit

Not Juddy as captain coach but get someone who will develop other aspects of game
Malthouse Roos Lyon
The query on Ratts has never been whether he can improve us from the dark hole we were in but whether he could take us to the ultimate prize
This obviously is the key question that board have to decide in September
They made the hard call on Thoro and ultimately won 3 premierships in 4 years with obviously a few hiccups along the way

As I said we recruited about 6 or 7 players (from about 76 to 79) who went on to play 3 premierships for the club in Buckley, Sheldon, Johnston (played 4), Harmes, Glasscot, McConnville and Marcou - these young guns we added to our seasoned chamions like in Southby, McKay, Doull, Jesaulenko, Keogh, Maclure, Fitzpatrick, Jones, Armstrong etc.

At the moment our seasoned champions, are Judd, Murphy and then the list starts to drop off but for the sake of argument I will include, Walker, Gibbs, Simpson, Kreuzer.

But our list of 18, 19 and 20 year old up and comers is almost non-existant.

We are (unfortunately) in no way positioned to be even close to emulating the 79 to 82 golden era - and that is disappointing and the Board and Football Department need to be held accountable for squandering the opportunity.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

I would do it now.

The players need a break.
The club needs to see who is right for next year.
We have wasted enough time on the Rats experiment.

I think chairman Mao it was that said... "I dont care of the cat is black or if the cat is white.. as long as it catches the rats."
We just need to move on .. we are going backwards.

Ratts is bad feng shui right now.

We need to bring someone in to straighten out this mess faster than most people recognise.


Players are confused and falling in a great big pile.

And we have no mids coming through because our recruitent and its strategy was R.S

We need someone who can just clear their heads now and get them playing with some kind of belief system.

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Even if we don't have a golden era Agro and I agree 79 -82 were guns and it would be difficult to compile such a side with the rules now we could I think with the talent we have sneak a flag like Hawthorn did in 2008 given there are 18 sides the talent is more thinly spread and there is no dominant side
BUT there obviously something missing with this side and we are nowhere near it

mates and i were on a similar thing last night so starte listing guys 24 and under when the issue of "do we have the talent or is it the coach" came up

murphy, hampson, gibbs, kreuzer, robinson, garlett, laidler, henderson, yarran & then bootsma and lucas (who have shown snippets of promise)

warnock, betts, walker & jamo 25/26

shut the doors if you cant take advantage and build some success with that group.

Plus the comp is more even... and we dont have the recruiting zone advantage.... plus many more teams...many doing things betetr than us

We just have been squandering this with some kind of deluded belief in 3 number 1 picks , Chris judd , El presidente Sticks and a coach who was not qualified and didnt come to grips with coaching at the highest level...and a recruiting dept that got it wrong year after year....

Recipe for a mighty big kick in the teeth.

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

I am killing a nice bottle of NZ Pinot Noir with some nuts and cheese tonight and read all the posts.Getting the distinct impression that nobody here has any inside sources at the club. So we dont know if there is any chance of change or action. The problem is that the very long list of injuries might be used as an excuse to not do anything.

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TC suffers from the social media illness - the death of respect and constructive discourse by keyboard.