TalkingCarlton :: View topic - We were nearly #&@%*!

"They were that close, Carlton, to handing the keys back in ... they had nothing," Pagan said.

BTW, like most hun articles about us, don't read the comments. Apparently the penalties were "too soft"

It's probably 100 per cent correct but his response to having no jam in the time was to recruit hacks. Surely draftees / rookies would've been cheaper. I think Denis probably accounts for the off field suffering and predicament but still takes no position of why we were so shit for so long - and that was because we recruited badly in my opinion.

Still took home his massive pay cheque every week - for producing the worst side in our clubs history

No-one would have done any better at the time.

Pagan was handed the worst of poison chalices.

His pay cheque was probably seen by him as compensation for having his reputation trashed.

Kaptain Kouta wrote:

No-one would have done any better at the time.

Pagan was handed the worst of poison chalices.

His pay cheque was probably seen by him as compensation for having his reputation trashed.

So... he had a lot on his plate?

No-one would have done any better at the time.

Blames no money for his lack of success at the Blues then says money didn't matter at North. We still haven't full recovered from the damage Pagan did to Carlton.

TheGame wrote:

Blames no money for his lack of success at the Blues then says money didn't matter at North. We still haven't full recovered from the damage Pagan did to Carlton.

Without the 'damage' Pagan did, we wouldn't have Murphy, GIBBS, or Kreuzer.

In the long run, that's a bigger positive than the negatives of what went on onfield and off.

Kaptain Kouta wrote:

TheGame wrote:

Blames no money for his lack of success at the Blues then says money didn't matter at North. We still haven't full recovered from the damage Pagan did to Carlton.

Without the 'damage' Pagan did, we wouldn't have Murphy, GIBBS, or Kreuzer.

In the long run, that's a bigger positive than the negatives of what went on onfield and off.

Even you could have coached us to get those players and we would have a couple of million dollars less debt as well.

Kaptain Kouta wrote:

TheGame wrote:

Blames no money for his lack of success at the Blues then says money didn't matter at North. We still haven't full recovered from the damage Pagan did to Carlton.

Without the 'damage' Pagan did, we wouldn't have Murphy, GIBBS, or Kreuzer.

In the long run, that's a bigger positive than the negatives of what went on onfield and off.

Even you could have coached us to get those players and we would have a couple of million dollars less debt as well.

Author:	chubbyruss [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:28 am ]
Post subject:	*We were nearly #&@%!**
Former Carlton coach Denis Pagan says times were tough at club http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/f ... 6038761149 Quote: "They were that close, Carlton, to handing the keys back in ... they had nothing," Pagan said.

Author:	Donstuie [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:34 am ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
It's hard to imagine now just how bad things were. I'll even admit there was a (brief) moment where I would've welcomed a move to the Gold Coast with the AFL's money, because I was certain we would die otherwise. Pagan's time was well and truly over, and the money we (by we I mean Jack) spent on him was obscene, the final act of the "Old Carlton". But the problems we had extended way beyond him, and it's hard to say if anyone could've done better. BTW, like most hun articles about us, don't read the comments. Apparently the penalties were "too soft"

Author:	chubbyruss [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:37 am ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
Donstuie wrote: BTW, like most hun articles about us, don't read the comments. Apparently the penalties were "too soft" Yeh, I read it. They would have loved us to go under

Author:	cimm1979 [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:47 am ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
Say what you like about Pagan, but everything in that article is 100% We were so AWFUL. I still think theres some disunity in the admin and possibly the coaching. Too many roosters in the hen house. On the bright side, maybe the players will get something from it for this weeks game.

Author:	Wild Blue Yonder [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:59 am ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
It's probably 100 per cent correct but his response to having no jam in the time was to recruit hacks. Surely draftees / rookies would've been cheaper. I think Denis probably accounts for the off field suffering and predicament but still takes no position of why we were so shit for so long - and that was because we recruited badly in my opinion.

TalkingCarlton http://www.talkingcarlton.com/phpBB3/

We were nearly #&@%*! http://www.talkingcarlton.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=29807	Page 1 of 5

Author:	cimm1979 [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 10:07 am ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
Wild Blue Yonder wrote: It's probably 100 per cent correct but his response to having no jam in the time was to recruit hacks. Surely draftees / rookies would've been cheaper. I think Denis probably accounts for the off field suffering and predicament but still takes no position of why we were so shit for so long - and that was because we recruited badly in my opinion. If you think people are out to get you, you go for quick fixes to keep them at bay. I's natural behaviour. I'm not an apologist for Pagan, but i'm pretty certain we would have endured similar lean times no matter who coached. Pagan thought he was joining an AFL Bull, but the reality it was more like stinking carcass waiting to be cut down.

Author:	Sydney Blue [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 10:26 am ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
Still took home his massive pay cheque every week - for producing the worst side in our clubs history

Author:	cimm1979 [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 10:38 am ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
Sydney Blue wrote: Still took home his massive pay cheque every week - for producing the worst side in our clubs history That's free enterprise for ya SB! He had a contract and took his money. What did you expect him to do? Give it back to a busted arse club, run by nuff nuffs half of whom hoped you'd be hit by a truck?

Author:	Captain Dan [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 11:15 am ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
I was never one to subscribe to this "Pagan was rubbish" theory. The team at the time were utter crap, the club was in a hole, we had a moron for president, infighting, bugger-all money to work with, shotty facilities...the place was just a mess. I remember thinking at the time of what I would do if the club folded, I considered not following the AFL again. The league themselves need to count their lucky stars that Carlton never went under...they'd be losing so much money these days. I think deep down all opposition supporters felt a bit relieved that Carlton never folded either; there'd be no such thing as the "Big Four" or marquee clashes each season against the Tigers, Bombers, and Collingwood. As much as I hate those three clubs (and it's a damn lot) I'd be disappointed if any of them went under and there'd be no such thing anymore as giving them a hiding and letting their moron fans know all about it. Pagan worked with what he had, and it wasn't a lot. It would be interesting to see what things would be like for him as a coach these days if he were in charge. Very glad I can say I was a member all through those times and I still showed up every week. It makes me enjoy these times and the next few years even more.

Author:	Kaptain Kouta [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 11:31 am ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
No-one would have done any better at the time. Pagan was handed the worst of poison chalices. His pay cheque was probably seen by him as compensation for having his reputation trashed.

Author:	jimmae [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 11:36 am ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
Kaptain Kouta wrote: No-one would have done any better at the time. Pagan was handed the worst of poison chalices. His pay cheque was probably seen by him as compensation for having his reputation trashed. So... he had a lot on his plate?

Author:	TheGame [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:14 pm ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
Blames no money for his lack of success at the Blues then says money didn't matter at North. We still haven't full recovered from the damage Pagan did to Carlton.

Author:	TheGame [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:15 pm ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
Kaptain Kouta wrote: No-one would have done any better at the time. Well no one could do worse.

Author:	Rexy [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:19 pm ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
One f-up led to another which led to another and so on. Selfishness, pig-headedness and incompetence was our MO during the last decade and some would argue still infests certain areas of the club today.

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Author:	cimm1979 [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:21 pm ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
TheGame wrote: Blames no money for his lack of success at the Blues then says money didn't matter at North. We still haven't full recovered from the damage Pagan did to Carlton. Or Collins or Elliot or Smorgan or Sticks or the AFL Or Player managers or Fev or the recruiters or the rest of the hacks .......have I left anyone out?

Author:	Kaptain Kouta [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:24 pm ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
TheGame wrote: Blames no money for his lack of success at the Blues then says money didn't matter at North. We still haven't full recovered from the damage Pagan did to Carlton. Without the 'damage' Pagan did, we wouldn't have Murphy, GIBBS, or Kreuzer. In the long run, that's a bigger positive than the negatives of what went on onfield and off.

Author:	TheGame [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:26 pm ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
Kaptain Kouta wrote: TheGame wrote: Blames no money for his lack of success at the Blues then says money didn't matter at North. We still haven't full recovered from the damage Pagan did to Carlton. Without the 'damage' Pagan did, we wouldn't have Murphy, GIBBS, or Kreuzer. In the long run, that's a bigger positive than the negatives of what went on onfield and off. Even you could have coached us to get those players and we would have a couple of million dollars less debt as well.

Author:	cimm1979 [ Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:28 pm ]
Post subject:	*Re: We were nearly #&@%!**
TheGame wrote: Kaptain Kouta wrote: TheGame wrote: Blames no money for his lack of success at the Blues then says money didn't matter at North. We still haven't full recovered from the damage Pagan did to Carlton. Without the 'damage' Pagan did, we wouldn't have Murphy, GIBBS, or Kreuzer. In the long run, that's a bigger positive than the negatives of what went on onfield and off. Even you could have coached us to get those players and we would have a couple of million dollars less debt as well. .....and you could have been Prez and CEO and not flower it up as badly as some of our "professional" administrators.