I think we underestimate the important role inside grunt players like Hadley & mcclean is to us. Friday night saw Hadley and ellard win the contested balls in close and releasing to Judd & co to spread and create.

I think most commentators have overlooked just how important these players are to the team structure and balance.

Please persist with these 2.

Hadley really good in the clearances and with the handball.

Ellard seems to have pretty good skills to me

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Carlton Premiers '10

Joseph should be given a go at that role

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Koperek.

Keep playing them. Hadley seems to be the fall guy whenever we lose.

I think Hadley, Ellard and Robbo should and will play all remaining games this year.

Main question around Hadley is his body. Can it meet the demands of week in week out AFL footy?

Problem with Hadley is that he is slow. When the ball is in a contest great but in the open he can be a liability. That is the problem. But he should be recognised for what he is, in and under and let him concentrate on that. It doesn't require much planning to have the receivers watch his man if he tries to run off Hadley.

Ratts showed against the bummers that he can plan a game. Let's see it on a weekly basis.

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"Get ready, Teddy - you're on": Ron Barassi half time 1970 Grand Final

Agree gents. This is the one area that has confused me all year.
We have gone into games without one many a times this year.
Now we have both plus Grigg who isn't quite there but ... MCLEAN where oh where MCLEAN !!!!

Hopefully ready for "F".

Hadley can be exposed for pace, as can Mclean.

Ellard looks quick enough. Really been a surpise packet ... he doesn't do the pretty stuff but he brings what Carlton needs, hardness and an ability to win the contest.

The players brought in recently: Ellard, Grigg and Hadley are all one thing: real footballers ... they may not be the best athletes but they make better decisions under pressure, they put their bodies in and run to the right spaces. They read the play and anticipate how things are going to unfold ... when you do that, you don't have to be able to run a sub 11 sec 100m, you're mentally agile, quicker to the contest because you've read where the ball will go, where the next contest will be.

Robinson is all of that without the better decision making!

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"It was like calling your ex girlfriend after a night on the booze, just a really bad decision".

Grigg is actually a very good athlete.

I like Hadley in the side. But (given his lack of athleticism) he needs to do what he does very well, or he won't remain in the side.

Yep, both very important in the win against our foes; the Bumbers.

In and under players who play like men possessed are still a necessary ingrient in the modern game.
Who will ever forget how Fraser "mad dog" Brown attacked the contest and ball. Simply ferocious.
That's what we need.

I think Grigg and Ellard's pace and ferocity will become cornerstones of our team they way it's unfolding atm.
I would never have precisted it. I thought it was curtains for both ot hem.
Footy is a funny game. Things can turnaround over night.

Go the hard nuts...we just can't play too many of them at the expense of pace, but 2 of them is good to allow rotations of like for like.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Agreed. It is nice seeing some guys with a good footy brain in the team as well as the desire to contest every ball. Couldn't believe one of these two wasn't playing earlier considering McLean has been out. Hope they get the rest of the season to show their worth. Be interesting to see how Grigg, Ellard, Hadley and Robbo are going after a good consistent run in the Blue.

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I would like to thank Collingwood for helping me keep faith in my old man. He always told me that 'People are thick'.

blue sombrero and i also noticed how warnock also palmed the ball away from the centre pack directly to these two (rather than to his feet in the middle of the pack) , especially in the last quarter when confidence rose

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one you knock back is one you never have

These guys transformed the way we played......hard at it and ferocious tackling took the heat off Judd and Murphy.

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No ones listening till you make a mistake.

Ling is he quick-what about Kirk - or Sewell or Hayes -Power or Cross

He is not there for speed and make no mistake the reason why we were so much better on friday was because we had three inside mids playing none of who are what you call quick .

Essendon* played one and he rest were speed demons

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

Kudos to Ellard, he's shown a ton of mental toughness to break into the side.

I couldn't understand why he was still on the list this year.

Yep the humble pie tasted great.

Pies - Luke ball
Cats - selwood
Doggies - boyd
St Kilda - Hayes
Hawks - Sewell / Mitchell

All tough inside players and not quick. There is no doubt we missed that grunt inside and that's why the recruitment of mcclean / Hadley makes sense. I have no issues making them earn their spot (aka Hadley / ellard) even if in the short term the team structure suffers. But they must earn it.

How about warnock - for the first time I can see why we potentially gave up so much for him. Still a long way to go. But might just work out if he keeps playing the way he has over the last few games.

Both Hadley and Ellard are average players who are very limited in ability and influence to win football games, however their roles are very important to our structure and for as much limited they are in talent, their Roles means the likes of Judd and Murphy can be released to become Run receiving players. When this happens, they become very damaging and we play our best Football.

..with the way midfields have grown and the way they're rotated you need almost as many, if not more grunt players than outside finishers.. ..getting the ball out of a stoppage and into space is the biggest weapon of a team.. ..we've got plenty of finishers, but not enough in and under grunts.. ..McLean and hadley have their body ??'s.. ..thankfully Ellard's showing he can play AFL, and Grigga's finding that good early form he had a while back.. ..if McLean can stay fit, he'll be a huge bonus for us.. ..especially if they cap rotations.. ..then an elite endurance type mid would come in really handy since you could use a rotation for mclean, for say judd instead.. ..cos mclean wouldnt need to be rotated as often..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

Obviously stats dont tell the whole story but does anyone know how many clearances Ellard and Hadley got against Essendon*? They were so important in the middle. Also got the first 3 clearances of the last quarter to ice the game Hadley was impressive there clean wins.

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Carlton Premiers '10

not sure about hadley but ellard had a game high 7 clearances and 9 tackles

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*(grow - fun - gah)

Yeah but whatabout your whataboutism.

I recon you're underselling these guys...

Hadley definetely needs to improve his kicking skills but other 'abilities' he has is to win the hard ball in congestion and release the ball to 'outside players', thus meaning he has excellent handball skills and i think awareness, vision and quick thinking - this also means they definetely influence football games.

From what iv seen Ellard has pretty decent skills...handball and kicking looks pretty good (sometimes tries to bullet passes too much but seems skillful enough and still young) and he kicked a nice goal from outside 50 straight through the middle.

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Carlton Premiers '10