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Why do we recruit players who cannot kick?
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Author:  Virgin Blue [ Sun Apr 11, 2010 9:13 am ]
Post subject:  Why do we recruit players who cannot kick?
Let's go through it...

Anderson - can't handball either
Walker - who incidentally was a Pick 2
McLean - who incidentally was traded for our first rounder
Johnson - who they said was a great kic. Pft. By all accounts can't even kick in the VFL
Browne
Grigg - everytime he tries to kick over 35m he kicks helicopter floaters
Hampson
Henderson - kicking for goal last night was embarrasing
Armfield
Wiggins - I know he kicked 5 yesterday, but we all know too well he struggles with elementary shots at goal at senior level
Carrazzo
Joseph - at least he is a good tagger
Author:  SurreyBlue [ Sun Apr 11, 2010 9:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Why do we recruit players who cannot kick?
I'm starting a campaign ..... TANK!!!!!!!!!!
Author:  Sydney Blue [ Sun Apr 11, 2010 9:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Why do we recruit players who cannot kick?
Our recruiting on a whole sine the end of the penalities has been woeful

2004 - only Russel and Betts left 8 others gone
2005 - Marc Murphy Paul Bower 5 others gone
2006- Gibbs and Jamo get regular games - Grigg Hampson Austin-Anderson Jacos still struggling to break through 4 others gone
2007 Kruezer and Jospeh get regular games - brown armfield ellard struggle - 3 others gone


this bank of players should make up the bulk of the 22

Very very poor recruiting if you ask me - it seems that unless you are a No1 pick or a rookie you will struggle at Carlton - Bower is the only pick in the middle that has produced
Author:  jimmae [ Sun Apr 11, 2010 11:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Why do we recruit players who cannot kick?
Virgin Blue wrote:
Let's go through it...

Anderson - can't handball either

Agree with that one.

Quote:
Walker - who incidentally was a Pick 2
McLean - who incidentally was traded for our first rounder
Johnson - who they said was a great kic. Pft. By all accounts can't even kick in the VFL

Walker is technically sound enough, he just seems to have no idea where to kick to. McLean is a non-issue, he is a good kick, no idea where you're getting that from, save that he copped a bad knock to the hip last night.

Quote:
Browne

He's AFL standard when his head's in the game.

Quote:
Grigg - everytime he tries to kick over 35m he kicks helicopter floaters
Hampson

Yes and yes, and Grigg's woes are purely from Grigg's own little mental issues. He needs a rocket. Hammer just needs patience in that regard because he's not far away.

Quote:
Henderson - kicking for goal last night was embarrasing

Yes it was, but he is a good, clean kick. Just got nervous last night like so many others.

Quote:
Armfield

Ball drop is the issue with him, and he can sometimes concentrate too hard on it. When he gets it right, he can spear it nicely.

Quote:
Wiggins - I know he kicked 5 yesterday, but we all know too well he struggles with elementary shots at goal at senior level

Yep that's a fair one.

Quote:
Carrazzo

He's gone off the boil a bit, but everyone was stuffing up kicks last night except Gibbs & Murphy. Concentration is an issue across the board.

Quote:
Joseph - at least he is a good tagger

AFL standard but if you pay attention he flogs himself anaerobically, so you'll see a lot of tired kicks for another 2 seasons or so.


Settle down VB, you're off the mark at the moment.
Author:  Virgin Blue [ Sun Apr 11, 2010 1:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Why do we recruit players who cannot kick?
jimmae wrote:
Virgin Blue wrote:
Let's go through it...

Anderson - can't handball either

Agree with that one.

Quote:
Walker - who incidentally was a Pick 2
McLean - who incidentally was traded for our first rounder
Johnson - who they said was a great kic. Pft. By all accounts can't even kick in the VFL

Walker is technically sound enough, he just seems to have no idea where to kick to. McLean is a non-issue, he is a good kick, no idea where you're getting that from, save that he copped a bad knock to the hip last night.

Quote:
Browne

He's AFL standard when his head's in the game.

Quote:
Grigg - everytime he tries to kick over 35m he kicks helicopter floaters
Hampson

Yes and yes, and Grigg's woes are purely from Grigg's own little mental issues. He needs a rocket. Hammer just needs patience in that regard because he's not far away.

Quote:
Henderson - kicking for goal last night was embarrasing

Yes it was, but he is a good, clean kick. Just got nervous last night like so many others.

Quote:
Armfield

Ball drop is the issue with him, and he can sometimes concentrate too hard on it. When he gets it right, he can spear it nicely.

Quote:
Wiggins - I know he kicked 5 yesterday, but we all know too well he struggles with elementary shots at goal at senior level

Yep that's a fair one.

Quote:
Carrazzo

He's gone off the boil a bit, but everyone was stuffing up kicks last night except Gibbs & Murphy. Concentration is an issue across the board.

Quote:
Joseph - at least he is a good tagger

AFL standard but if you pay attention he flogs himself anaerobically, so you'll see a lot of tired kicks for another 2 seasons or so.


Settle down VB, you're off the mark at the moment.


Don't take this the wrong way but you seem to be making a lot of excuses for various players.

Are you happy with our kicking skills, as a club?

BTW ball drop or mental issues or bad judgement, whatever, it doesn't matter, truth is a lot of our players cannot kick consistently, for whatever reason
Author:  Bluey44 [ Sun Apr 11, 2010 1:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Why do we recruit players who cannot kick?
I think o'keefe can have a positive influence on our halfback line if he can get fit
Author:  jimmae [ Sun Apr 11, 2010 2:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Why do we recruit players who cannot kick?
Virgin Blue wrote:
Don't take this the wrong way but you seem to be making a lot of excuses for various players.

Are you happy with our kicking skills, as a club?

BTW ball drop or mental issues or bad judgement, whatever, it doesn't matter, truth is a lot of our players cannot kick consistently, for whatever reason

They're excuses for the time being because they are easily corrected with a little bit of one-on-one coaching and discussion with the player, and then said player putting the work in.

You've seen the results first hand with blokes like Russell & Carrazzo (last season). Sometimes it's a simple matter of running too hard, then finally getting your turn to kick and having jelly legs from lactic acid build up. It's a grind out there and it's not always going to be perfect footy, but the biggest thing that needs to change is how the boys concentrate on all the tasks they have to perform: how they position themselves at stoppages/packs/once the ball is entering ourf50/d50/midfield, how we tackle, how we zone, how we man, how we kick, where we kick, when we handball, etc.

Give them a piece of paper and test them, and I think you'd discover they will find the right answer. The problem is that when the question is asked on the field, for whatever reason, they're not finding the answer. That is the concern. If they can identify it off the field and on the training track, the blame starts to move away from the coaches, and back onto some players panicking on the field, or completely ignoring instruction. Don't get me wrong, that still leaves some responsibility with the coaches but as a player, when you're given homework, you do it. It's what you're paid for.

Away from that, these issues were further highlighted last night because we seemed to have individuals who lost their composure with fumbles when there was seemingly no reason for it, and scrubbed kicks because they felt they were under pressure. Complete mental fragility, and no one raising their voice amongst the panic to reassure, or if they were no one was prepared to listen.

This then stems into another discussion about player empowerment and authoritarian approaches. Personally I think we have a structure on field that empowers the players to go with their instincts, but we lack authorities to steady the ship out there when it gets rough, save for Judd, Simpson, Scotland Murphy, Russell, Kreuzer and occasionally Gibbs. The problem there is that the latter two shouldn't have such responsibilities, as evidenced by Gibbs not being able to dominate consistently (which at just on 21 is entirely understandable) and Kreuzer still getting his skills up to scratch. We need more names, particularly up forward, who are prepared to stamp their authority on things instead of pretending to, or finger pointing without real insight into what his team mates can do better.

Away from that, perhaps our off field approach is too authoritarian in the sense that the coaches may be focussing too much on correcting issues and directing our players on these, rather than highlighting and reinforcing the decisions players have to make on the field. Ratts seems to have made an impression in the media of being more of a compassionate father-figure as coach than an individual who will react aggressively in the face of insubordination, of any form. I don't expect to see a representation of that one way or the other in the media, but I have yet to see him really fire up in quarter-time addresses or at training when the chips are down.
Author:  DocSherrin III [ Sun Apr 11, 2010 2:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Why do we recruit players who cannot kick?
jimmae wrote:
I don't expect to see a representation of that one way or the other in the media, but I have yet to see him really fire up in quarter-time addresses or at training when the chips are down.


I have, but he picks and chooses who his targets are with those outbursts. Ask Richard Hadley for confirmation on that one. Biggest serve I have ever seen (and I have seen plenty of serves).
Author:  jimmae [ Sun Apr 11, 2010 2:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Why do we recruit players who cannot kick?
Dr.SHERRIN wrote:
jimmae wrote:
I don't expect to see a representation of that one way or the other in the media, but I have yet to see him really fire up in quarter-time addresses or at training when the chips are down.


I have, but he picks and chooses who his targets are with those outbursts. Ask Richard Hadley for confirmation on that one. Biggest serve I have ever seen (and I have seen plenty of serves).

Hmm. Protecting the kids too much/giving them too much leeway?
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