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Our best 22?
http://www.talkingcarlton.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=21390		 Page 153 of 172
Author:  WA Blue [ Fri Nov 23, 2018 10:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
No Silvagni in either team?
Author:  cecil89 [ Fri Nov 23, 2018 11:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
In contrast to the last couple of suggestions, I think Plowman and Thomas will be best 22 for most of the year. Particularly Plowman.

Marchbank Jones Plowman
Simpson Weitering Docherty
Petrevski-Seton Cripps Murphy
Fisher Curnow Dow
McGovern McKay Fasolo
Kreuzer Kennedy Setterfield

Williamson Curnow Walsh Thomas



B Silvagni Goddard Schumacher
Newman Macreadie Cuningham
O’Brien Lang Pickett
J Silvagni Casboult Garlett
Kerr DeKoning Polson
Phillips Bugg Stocker

LeBois Lobbe O’Dwyer Owies
Author:  Blue Sombrero [ Sat Nov 24, 2018 1:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
cecil89 wrote:
In contrast to the last couple of suggestions, I think Plowman and Thomas will be best 22 for most of the year. Particularly Plowman.

Marchbank Jones Plowman
Simpson Weitering Docherty
Petrevski-Seton Cripps Murphy
Fisher Curnow Dow
McGovern McKay Fasolo
Kreuzer Kennedy Setterfield

Williamson Curnow Walsh Thomas



B Silvagni Goddard Schumacher
Newman Macreadie Cuningham
O’Brien Lang Pickett
J Silvagni Casboult Garlett
Kerr DeKoning Polson
Phillips Bugg Stocker

LeBois Lobbe O’Dwyer Owies


Early days but I think that's a pretty good attempt.
Certainly we have so much more depth.
I'd like to fit Garlett in but I can't drop anybody in yours. I think he has the X factor but on exposed form last year, he doesn't play.

Does Murphy get a game on pure form? That is the big question in my mind. I remember the last days of Big Nick and always thought he might have given it away one season earlier but good players and captains should go out on their own terms, I suppose.

I can't mention Big Nick without posting this Wiki link to the man.
Those of us lucky to have seen him play and to watch his titanic tussles with Polly Farmer and then Len Thompson, the first of the new tall breed of ruckmen, are fortunate indeed.
Check this out!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Nicholls_(footballer)
Author:  Blue Vain [ Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
cecil89 wrote:
In contrast to the last couple of suggestions, I think Plowman and Thomas will be best 22 for most of the year. Particularly Plowman.

Marchbank Jones Plowman
Simpson Weitering Docherty
Petrevski-Seton Cripps Murphy
Fisher Curnow Dow
McGovern McKay Fasolo
Kreuzer Kennedy Setterfield

Williamson Curnow Walsh Thomas



B Silvagni Goddard Schumacher
Newman Macreadie Cuningham
O’Brien Lang Pickett
J Silvagni Casboult Garlett
Kerr DeKoning Polson
Phillips Bugg Stocker

LeBois Lobbe O’Dwyer Owies


Mostly agree with the lists although I would change a few positions. I disagree on Daisy though. Generally when we bring in a mature player, they are given every opportunity to prove themselves.
Thats why I believe Newman will play before Thomas.
Author:  Arnhem blues [ Sat Nov 24, 2018 8:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
comparison of possible round 1 2019 with round 23 2018 in italics and round 1 2016 in brackets
I have moved some stated positions around to make comparisons a little easier.

Weitering, Jones, Thomas ------------------ Thomas, Weitering, Byrne----------------(Weitering, Jamison, Tuohy)
Docherty, Marchbank, Simmo ---------------Rowe, Marchbank, Mullett ---------------(Docherty, Rowe, Simpson)
O'Brien Cripps, Williamson ------------------O’Brien, Cripps, Lamb ------------------- (Gibbs, Cripps, Buckley)
SPS, C Curnow, McGovern -------------------SPS, C. Curnow, Wright ------------------(Lamb, Casboult, Graham )
Fasolo, McKay, Murphy -----------------------Lang, McKay, Polson---------------------- (Boekhorst, Walker, Wright,)
Kreuzer, Kennedy, Dow ---------------------- Lobbe, E. Curnow, Murphy --------------(Kreuzer, Kerridge, Murphy)
I/C E Curnow, Fisher,, Setterfield, Walsh -Simpson, Kerridge, Silvagni, De Koning -(Everitt, Phillips, ECurnow, White)
EMG: Plowman, Polson, Lang, Garlett, ---Shaw, Macreadie, Pickett, O’Shea --------(C. Curnow, C. Smith, M. Whiley)
Jack Newman? Macreadie?
Cas? Pickett? Bugg? Stocker?
Kerr? TDK? Cunningham? Shu
(hard to pick!!)

Biggest difference is the depth - listing the emergencies far harder these days!
Author:  aboynamedsue [ Sat Nov 24, 2018 9:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
cecil89 wrote:
In contrast to the last couple of suggestions, I think Plowman and Thomas will be best 22 for most of the year. Particularly Plowman.

Marchbank Jones Plowman
Simpson Weitering Docherty
Petrevski-Seton Cripps Murphy
Fisher Curnow Dow
McGovern McKay Fasolo
Kreuzer Kennedy Setterfield

Williamson Curnow Walsh Thomas



B Silvagni Goddard Schumacher
Newman Macreadie Cuningham
O’Brien Lang Pickett
J Silvagni Casboult Garlett
Kerr DeKoning Polson
Phillips Bugg Stocker

LeBois Lobbe O’Dwyer Owies

I reckon that’s a good effort. Williamson’s spot in the first team is the only one I’d question at this stage. I think in 2019 he will play a mixture of VFL & AFL as he attempts to re-establish himself. I would have Newman - or possibly SOJ or LOB - ahead of him at this point.
Author:  Donstuie [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 9:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
The tougher this exercise gets, the happier I am.
Author:  jezzarules [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 9:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
Donstuie wrote:
The tougher this exercise gets, the happier I am.

Always hard in November.
Usually gets easier after the season starts
Author:  Donstuie [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 9:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
This is true
Author:  bondiblue [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 9:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
verbs wrote:
Obviously injury means there's never a consistent best 22 playing, more like a best 22 of who's available. But it's one area we need to get on top of to improve our chances.

I added up, across the league, every player who's played ten or more games in a row as of the end of the 2018 season. Made for some interesting reading:

Collingwood 474
North 472
Geelong 417
Melbourne 410
Port 374
Essendon** 342
West Coast 331
Hawthorn 331
-------------------
Sydney 300
GWS 286
Brisbane 274
St Kilda 268
Richmond 261
Gold Coast 233
Adelaide 216
Bulldogs 164
Fremantle 121
Carlton 88

Our 88 are made up of just 5 players:
Petrevski-Seton 30
Cripps 22
Curnows both 13
Polson 10

GWS, Sydney and Richmond have overachieved. Port, North and Essendon** have underachieved. You'd think those three are a couple of injuries away from collapsing.


Brilliant work as usual verbs.
There's always exceptions to the hypotheseis, but the stats here don't lie.
Author:  bondiblue [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 10:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
Cazzesman wrote:
Carlton

B. Bugg Jones Simpson
HB. Marchbank Weitering Newman
C. Murphy Cripps Williamson
HF. Fisher Charlie SPS
F. Fasolo McKay McGovern
R. Kreuzer Docherty Dow
Int. Walsh LOB Setterfield Ed

Northern Blues

B. Schumacher Goddard Plowman
HB. Thomas Macreadie Jack
C. Stocker Kennedy Garlett
HF. Pickett Casboult Lang
F. O'Dwyer Kerr TDK
R. Philips Cuningham Polson
Int Owies Ben Lebois Lobbe

Regards Cazzesman


The Plowman debate continues.
Plow was recruited at GWS with pick 3 as a tall quick mid ala Tomlison has become.

With Plowman looking to have shedded a few kg's on his return to preseason training, he becomes the tall looking after 3rd tall in forwardline, mid/ wing or depth?

Interested in your view on Plowman.
Author:  99prelim [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 10:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
Blue Vain wrote:
cecil89 wrote:
In contrast to the last couple of suggestions, I think Plowman and Thomas will be best 22 for most of the year. Particularly Plowman.

Marchbank Jones Plowman
Simpson Weitering Docherty
Petrevski-Seton Cripps Murphy
Fisher Curnow Dow
McGovern McKay Fasolo
Kreuzer Kennedy Setterfield

Williamson Curnow Walsh Thomas



B Silvagni Goddard Schumacher
Newman Macreadie Cuningham
O’Brien Lang Pickett
J Silvagni Casboult Garlett
Kerr DeKoning Polson
Phillips Bugg Stocker

LeBois Lobbe O’Dwyer Owies


Mostly agree with the lists although I would change a few positions. I disagree on Daisy though. Generally when we bring in a mature player, they are given every opportunity to prove themselves.
Thats why I believe Newman will play before Thomas.


I actually think Newman is a lock. Versatile. can play anywhere between the arcs, mature body, leadership, comes from a strong culture etc

Also, depending on Bugg's attitude, he and Fasolo could be fighting for the HF position

Surprised if Setterfield and Williamson play round 1. My money is on O'Brien. Reckon he was the slow burner of the second half of the season. Loved him for one reason only...he wants to get involved!

Also one of Cunningham and Schumacher until Williamson finds his match fitness
Author:  bondiblue [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 10:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
Arnhem blues wrote:
comparison of possible round 1 2019 with round 23 2018 in italics and round 1 2016 in brackets
I have moved some stated positions around to make comparisons a little easier.

Weitering, Jones, Thomas ------------------ Thomas, Weitering, Byrne----------------(Weitering, Jamison, Tuohy)
Docherty, Marchbank, Simmo ---------------Rowe, Marchbank, Mullett ---------------(Docherty, Rowe, Simpson)
O'Brien Cripps, Williamson ------------------O’Brien, Cripps, Lamb ------------------- (Gibbs, Cripps, Buckley)
SPS, C Curnow, McGovern -------------------SPS, C. Curnow, Wright ------------------(Lamb, Casboult, Graham )
Fasolo, McKay, Murphy -----------------------Lang, McKay, Polson---------------------- (Boekhorst, Walker, Wright,)
Kreuzer, Kennedy, Dow ---------------------- Lobbe, E. Curnow, Murphy --------------(Kreuzer, Kerridge, Murphy)
I/C E Curnow, Fisher,, Setterfield, Walsh -Simpson, Kerridge, Silvagni, De Koning -(Everitt, Phillips, ECurnow, White)
EMG: Plowman, Polson, Lang, Garlett, ---Shaw, Macreadie, Pickett, O’Shea --------(C. Curnow, C. Smith, M. Whiley)
Jack Newman? Macreadie?
Cas? Pickett? Bugg? Stocker?
Kerr? TDK? Cunningham? Shu
(hard to pick!!)

Biggest difference is the depth - listing the emergencies far harder these days!


Great stuff Arnhem Blue.

No matter which way you go with your first 18, we now have players (in brackets) in waiting to provide cover for injury.
I doubt we will experience the diabolical injury list we had last year which decimated us, and that can only mean pressure for spots.

SOS 66 game plan has given us this. He's a genius.
Some of those in brackets make up interchange or I know for some posters some in brackets should be in the first 18.


Docherty (Cuningham) Macreadie (Jones) Marchbank (Plowman)
Williamson (Garlett) Weitering (Goddard) Newman (Schumaker)


Kruezer (Phillips) Kennedy (Curnow) Dow (Walsh)
Pickett (SPS) Cripps (Setterfield) O'Brien (Simpson)


Murphy (Stocker) Charlie (Kerr) Fisher (Lang)
McGovern (J.Silvagni) McKay (TDK) Fasolo (Bugg)


(Polson) (Le Bois) (Thomas)
(Lobbe) (Casboult) (B.Silvagni)
(ODwyer) (Owens)

(We have a spare pick for PSD or Mid season Draft: NB players Fisher or Blakey?)

Yeah I know Polson has shown signs of improvement and Stocker is a newby, but I expect Stocker and Walsh to play senior footy in 2019, and imo are already ahead of Polson. both of them. Point of exercise is to show genuine depth for cover.

Go Bluebaggers
Author:  toddkurnski [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 11:03 am ]
Post subject:  Our best 22?
verbs wrote:
Obviously injury means there's never a consistent best 22 playing, more like a best 22 of who's available. But it's one area we need to get on top of to improve our chances.

I added up, across the league, every player who's played ten or more games in a row as of the end of the 2018 season. Made for some interesting reading:

Collingwood 474
North 472
Geelong 417
Melbourne 410
Port 374
Essendon** 342
West Coast 331
Hawthorn 331
-------------------
Sydney 300
GWS 286
Brisbane 274
St Kilda 268
Richmond 261
Gold Coast 233
Adelaide 216
Bulldogs 164
Fremantle 121
Carlton 88

Our 88 are made up of just 5 players:
Petrevski-Seton 30
Cripps 22
Curnows both 13
Polson 10

GWS, Sydney and Richmond have overachieved. Port, North and Essendon** have underachieved. You'd think those three are a couple of injuries away from collapsing.


Just wondering how you calculated this? How did you calculate the 474 for Collingwood? Maybe my brain isn’t switched on for a Sunday morning. SPS has 30?
Author:  Cazzesman [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 11:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
bondiblue wrote:
Cazzesman wrote:
Carlton

B. Bugg Jones Simpson
HB. Marchbank Weitering Newman
C. Murphy Cripps Williamson
HF. Fisher Charlie SPS
F. Fasolo McKay McGovern
R. Kreuzer Docherty Dow
Int. Walsh LOB Setterfield Ed

Northern Blues

B. Schumacher Goddard Plowman
HB. Thomas Macreadie Jack
C. Stocker Kennedy Garlett
HF. Pickett Casboult Lang
F. O'Dwyer Kerr TDK
R. Philips Cuningham Polson
Int Owies Ben Lebois Lobbe

Regards Cazzesman


The Plowman debate continues.
Plow was recruited at GWS with pick 3 as a tall quick mid ala Tomlison has become.

With Plowman looking to have shedded a few kg's on his return to preseason training, he becomes the tall looking after 3rd tall in forwardline, mid/ wing or depth?

Interested in your view on Plowman.


I think you almost have me at 'Check' bondi. I have been a huge Plowman fan since his TAC days and I have always thought of him as a 200 game player, and yet I can't fit him in team. :eek:

With no real FB I see Jones as out best option because of his athletic abilities, spoiling and closing speed to cover the lead. If you then have Weiters and Marchy as the 2 other tall's, there is no spot for Plow. If you take Bugg or Simmo out for Plow then I worry about our defensive leg speed.

If you have Newman, Willo and Doc all vying for the HBF role then Plow gets pushed out again. Certainly an option might be Marchbank playing more on a wing and slotting Plow into the HB role. That might make us to top heavy and slow.

Newman and Willo and hopefully Schu will put plenty of pressure on the selectors and I can't see that Plow will be a walkup start. The coach loves Thomas as well so there's another HBF/Winger.

Regards Cazzesman
Author:  ScottSaunders2 [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 1:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
good problems to have, as opposed to he is only getting a game cause of injury.

it should be we have players covering every position, and they should be playing those positions in the reserves as well ... consistency is the key. the 1st and 2nd should be playing the exact same game plan so come an injury or suspension a player slots in, without a kink or hickup .. its business as usual .. it finally feels like this is the case with our team. Now its all about putting in the effort, time and natural progression ... those that arent up to it will slowly be worked out of the side and replaced with those that are ... again, the first time for a long time we are in the right position to build something of significance.
Author:  verbs [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 1:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
toddkurnski wrote:
verbs wrote:
Obviously injury means there's never a consistent best 22 playing, more like a best 22 of who's available. But it's one area we need to get on top of to improve our chances.

I added up, across the league, every player who's played ten or more games in a row as of the end of the 2018 season. Made for some interesting reading:

Collingwood 474
North 472
Geelong 417
Melbourne 410
Port 374
Essendon*** 342
West Coast 331
Hawthorn 331
-------------------
Sydney 300
GWS 286
Brisbane 274
St Kilda 268
Richmond 261
Gold Coast 233
Adelaide 216
Bulldogs 164
Fremantle 121
Carlton 88

Our 88 are made up of just 5 players:
Petrevski-Seton 30
Cripps 22
Curnows both 13
Polson 10

GWS, Sydney and Richmond have overachieved. Port, North and Essendon*** have underachieved. You'd think those three are a couple of injuries away from collapsing.


Just wondering how you calculated this? How did you calculate the 474 for Collingwood? Maybe my brain isn’t switched on for a Sunday morning. SPS has 30?


Petrevski-Seton has played 30 games in a row without missing.

Collingwood's 474 is made up by adding up all the consecutive games of anyone who currently has played at least ten games in a row by the end of the 2018.

It's not scientific, but was more an exercise to see where the cards fell.
Author:  toddkurnski [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 2:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Our best 22?
verbs wrote:
toddkurnski wrote:
verbs wrote:
Obviously injury means there's never a consistent best 22 playing, more like a best 22 of who's available. But it's one area we need to get on top of to improve our chances.

I added up, across the league, every player who's played ten or more games in a row as of the end of the 2018 season. Made for some interesting reading:

Collingwood 474
North 472
Geelong 417
Melbourne 410
Port 374
Essendon**** 342
West Coast 331
Hawthorn 331
-------------------
Sydney 300
GWS 286
Brisbane 274
St Kilda 268
Richmond 261
Gold Coast 233
Adelaide 216
Bulldogs 164
Fremantle 121
Carlton 88

Our 88 are made up of just 5 players:
Petrevski-Seton 30
Cripps 22
Curnows both 13
Polson 10

GWS, Sydney and Richmond have overachieved. Port, North and Essendon**** have underachieved. You'd think those three are a couple of injuries away from collapsing.


Just wondering how you calculated this? How did you calculate the 474 for Collingwood? Maybe my brain isn’t switched on for a Sunday morning. SPS has 30?


Petrevski-Seton has played 30 games in a row without missing.

Collingwood's 474 is made up by adding up all the consecutive games of anyone who currently has played at least ten games in a row by the end of the 2018.

It's not scientific, but was more an exercise to see where the cards fell.


Brilliant. Thanks.

Continuity is king when the competition is so weak in my opinion. It’s why GWS haven’t got there yet, and someone like the Tigers can pop up and win one and the Roos perform better than expected.

When I heard Andrew Russell talk about the importance of the team training together for the entire preseason without too many players missing sessions and that being a determining factor of what to expect during the season, it just reinforced to me that continuity is a significant part of success.
Author:  GreatEx [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 3:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
That Collingwood figure is interesting given that the narrative in GF week was "isn't it amazing how well they've done given their injuries".
Author:  ianh [ Sun Nov 25, 2018 3:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Our best 22?
Just had a crack at a firsts and reserves 22 post draft. FWIW I get

Carlton

SIMPSON JONES MARCHBANK
NEWMAN WEITERING DOCHERTY
WILLIAMSON SETTERFIELD MURPHY
FISHER C CURNOW FASOLO
McKAY McGOVERN DOW
KRUESER CRIPPS WALSH
E CURNOW FASOLO PETREVSKI-SETON PLOWMAN
Emerg: MacREADIE PHILLIPS J SILVAGNI THOMAS


Northern (using rookies as interchange)

CUNINGHAM MacREADIE B SILVAGNI
PICKETT KERR SCHUMACHER
LANG KENNEDY O'BRIEN
O'DWYER CASBOULT THOMAS
PHILLIPS DE KONING GARLETT
LOBBE STOCKER POULSON
BUGG GODDARD LEBOIS OWIES
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