Based on Ratten's coolish response last night about both Irish boys, plus other 'stuff' that went on over the pre-season, does anybody get the feeling that both boys will not be at the club in 2009?

I don't know what is going on behind the scenes but just on Saturday nights performance Waite played on J.Brown for 1 quarter and had 3 goals kicked on him and Setanta played on him for 3 quarters and had 3 goals kicked on him. Admittedly Brown did kick a few points as well but he also got the softest free kick of the night in the 2nd quarter courtesy of RAY C.
I am not quite sure what Setanta is expected to do? Waite knows who and where he will play each week, Setanta has been forward, back, forward, back. Saturday night he goes into the game looking at playing a particular role and after 30 minutes he is playing on the gun forward of the opposition because a bloke that was born to play football can't handle it.
There must be something happening behind the scenes.

Got the impression Aisake is definitley gone.

Setanta really needs to show something by years end. Can't say I agree about the comments of him being a forward?

This is probably my biggest disappointment with Ratten’s coaching thus far. He appears to be suffering from mild form of Paganism and is not being open-minded and flexible with his approach with Carlos. His reading and opinion of where Setanta is best utilised is off the mark. Carlos has shown ability as a defender where he can unleash his aggression, use his athleticism and not be required to create play. Brett’s continued insistence that he is seen as a forward is wrong and disappointing coming from a senior coach who should have a better feel and understanding of these things.

A major factor in the stagnation of Setanta’s development has been his mismanagement and inability to establish him in a role. Woof’s comments comparing him and Waite are spot on and demonstrates the discriminate approach between these 2 players. Whether Brett’s dislike for both O’hAilpin’s is based on footballing reasons or perhaps personal (reports that they don’t always listen to instruction and are single-minded at times) is hard to substantiate but they have fallen out of favour since Brett’s appointment.

The boys will always be below your native footballers in regards to footballing nous and all-round ability but they can play a role. I believe you can carry up to 3 of these types of players who aren’t bonafide footballers (Wiggins, Bannister, Ackland, etc.) in the senior side and even more so when they can play a key defensive role. Aisake seems to have stagnated and doesn’t seem to be grasping the game. Maybe that is a genuine flaw which will lead to his exit but Brett’s comments on Setanta appear to be misguided

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C'mon Blueboys!

Our coach is in a better position then any of us to judge Setanta, he clearly has a game plan that involves having SKILLFUL versatile defenders. Setanta doesn't fit this role - how long can we carry a 25? year old player in the hope that he will develop?

I think Ratts is hoping for him to be a crash and bash type player in the forward line but I could be wrong on that.

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Between our dreams and actions lies this world

Asaike is definitely gone, he is marking time in the ants reserves.... I just get an inkling that Carlos will say shove it and go home too.

Biggest problem I see with the Irish boys and you can throw Ackland in with them - they don't hurt the opposition - Houlihan is more aggressive at the ball and the player. I can't recall seeing any of these big blokes make a bone crunching tackle or even hit the pack that hard where there are bodies everywhere . These lot play like flankers not big bodied KPP .

I'm sure that if Setanta at fullback hit his player hard at the first contest that he would get on top of most of his opponents , but you get the feeling they are all so unsure of their own ability that they approach contest in a timid way.

They are big they are strong and they are certainly ugly but the play like girls

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

He gets caught out about as much and makes skill errors on a similar level to Waite but he wont have the backing or leeway Jarrad does. As long as Brett is being completely objective and unbiased then no-one can complain but his revelation that he sees Setanta as a forward is wrong AFAIC

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C'mon Blueboys!

Setanta is a FB.. put the field ahead of him .. hes fast enough to stay with a lead and he can punch... plus he has height.
Ratten plays him everywhere but....
ruck.. CHF as the patsy forward....pathetic really...
If Ackland was given an opportunity why isnt Aisake???

If Ratten likes skillful types for his gameplan what are the likes of Wiggins Russell Carrazzo Fisher doing there????


Why do we overpossess the ball anyway?????

Ratts should look at himself first....

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yeah lets go back to Pagans Paddock

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Between our dreams and actions lies this world

I would have thought 117 to 33 would have explained that

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

I thought that Setanta was in great form for the first 6 or 8 games last year when he played at fullback. We lost a fair bit when he had to move to the ruck as a result of Clokes injury.

Synbad, I agree. Why can't we settle him down at FB and give him a chance to develop further.

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“Before you criticise someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticise them, you're a mile a way and you have their shoes."

Coach does not like him and has hung him out to dry.

My guess is they will both be gone at season's end.

Aisake is clearly nowhere in Ratten's plans, and so will be shipped off. That will mean that Setanta will throw in the towel too.

In my view it was a worthwhile experiment given we had not other real opportunities to get access to players given the salary cap penalties.

Shattered about Setanta - thought a kpp defence spot was all his.

Ratts obviously doesn't agree with me and he's in a better spot to know.

Hope he can turn Ratts around before the end of the year.

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Richard Pratt - A Carlton legend.

I don’t necessarily agree with that. He came over without him and he has always been incredibly determined to eek out a professional sporting career. I wouldn’t think he would give that up solely on the back of what happens to Aisake.

Sad though, Aisake was on the verge of senior selection when horrible timing saw him succumb to a groin/OP injury on the eve of his senior debut. Has returned to that level of play and form

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C'mon Blueboys!

wow, we must have a crackerjack list brimming with A-grade talls if ratts has the luxury to just throw a couple of projects onto the scrap-heap ...

aisake is 203 cm and can run like a gazelle, but let's make sure we give proven hacks like Ackland every opportunity to stay on the list ...

setanta's performance on brown was far more convincing than waite's but let's see how many excuses we can make for waite. ratts is right, waite keeps coming up with creative ways to turn the ball over ...

yes ratts, i now see how the total dominance of charman in that first quarter did not hurt us on the scoreboard, it was just those pesky handballs over the top or those flukey bounces that undid all our good planning and preparation ...

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... an eagle flew out of the night. he was something to observe, came in close i heard a voice, bending stretching every nerve, had to listen had no choice ...

i'll drink to that.

Ratts once said Wiggo will be a 200 gamer for Carlton. Maybe he still believes it..... god help us

Top post. Ratten's Coaching, selection and posiotioning of the talls is quesionable at best