TalkingCarlton :: View topic - Slash & Burn Brigade: please consider:-

Did we, or did we not, play a fantastic
game of footy in the Wizzer Cup Final?

Didn't we play as a skilled, cohesive, aggresive and committed team?

Do you not agree that if we replicated that on game day in the real season that we would be capable of beating any team in the comp?

I'm as disgusted with yesterday's effort as much as anyone, but I will not say that this team is substandard.

The team is suffering from a huge lack of confidence, in themselves and each other.

C'mon Blues, get over it, and play the way I believe you are capable of.

They were only practice matches.

Why did no team get extra numbers down in defence during the Wiz cup?
Why have every side we've played since rd 1 get extra numbers back?
Get over the practice matches, they were a confidence builder but they certainly mean absolutely nothing now.

Arguably West Coast do have a better team

Quote:

Arguably West Coast do have a better team

Ya reckon!

TheGame wrote:

Quote:

Arguably West Coast do have a better team

Ya reckon!

If I didn't I wouldn't have said it

And yes, they are better than us, and yes, we beat them. No, it wasn't a practice match because both sides had almost their best team on the park. We are capable of beating any side, as long the team is dedicated, switched on and confident in themselves and each other. So what are you trying to say?

Author:	windy [ Sun May 08, 2005 3:31 pm ]
Post subject:	Slash & Burn Brigade: please consider:-
Did we, or did we not, play a fantastic game of footy in the Wizzer Cup Final? Didn't we play as a skilled, cohesive, aggresive and committed team? Do you not agree that if we replicated that on game day in the real season that we would be capable of beating any team in the comp? I'm as disgusted with yesterday's effort as much as anyone, but I will not say that this team is substandard. The team is suffering from a huge lack of confidence, in themselves and each other. C'mon Blues, get over it, and play the way I believe you are capable of.

Author:	TruBlueBrad [ Sun May 08, 2005 3:40 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Slash & Burn Brigade: please consider:-
windy wrote: Did we, or did we not, play a fantastic game of footy in the Wizzer Cup Final? Didn't we play as a skilled, cohesive, aggresive and committed team? Do you not agree that if we replicated that on game day in the real season that we would be capable of beating any team in the comp? I'm as disgusted with yesterday's effort as much as anyone, but I will not say that this team is substandard. The team is suffering from a huge lack of confidence, in themselves and each other. C'mon Blues, get over it, and play the way I believe you are capable of. Great Post windy. I'm not sure Wizard Cup form means a lot, but the Wizard Cup final does. West Coast are flying and we're up for the Wizard Cup as well.

Author:	TheGame [ Sun May 08, 2005 3:57 pm ]
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They were only practice matches.

Author:	windy [ Sun May 08, 2005 4:05 pm ]
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Yeah, right. $200 grand worth

Author:	Kaptain Kouta [ Sun May 08, 2005 4:09 pm ]
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TheGame wrote: They were only practice matches. That's a ridiculous statement. Melbourne, the Bulldogs and the Eagles sure weren't just having a practice hitout against us. The Eagles team we played in the WC final was 90% full-strength. Woosha said he was having a red-hot go at the WC. Why we haven't ONCE repeated that same desire skill and teamwork we showed in the WC matches has me absolutely stuffed. If we can play in real matches with the same ardour as the WC for a whole match, not just 1 or 2 qtrs, we should be able to match any team in the comp.

TalkingCarlton http://www.talkingcarlton.com/phpBB3/

Slash & Burn Brigade: please consider:- http://www.talkingcarlton.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2017	Page 1 of 2

Author:	TheGame [ Sun May 08, 2005 4:10 pm ]
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Why did no team get extra numbers down in defence during the Wiz cup? Why have every side we've played since rd 1 get extra numbers back? Get over the practice matches, they were a confidence builder but they certainly mean absolutely nothing now.

Author:	bluegirldanielle [ Sun May 08, 2005 4:11 pm ]
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Agreed windy. What annoys me is that this was the only game where we've played 4 quarters of bad football & got flogged accordingly. Had we have beaten Port, & one of Kangas, pies or freo then most people would be bleating about how great the team is & the wiz cup win is reflective of where we are at as a team.

Author:	Effes [ Sun May 08, 2005 4:21 pm ]
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TheGame wrote: Why did no team get extra numbers down in defence during the Wiz cup? Why have every side we've played since rd 1 get extra numbers back? Get over the practice matches, they were a confidence builder but they certainly mean absolutely nothing now. Exactly There was hardly any tagging whatsoever in the WC You just have to look at our forward line in the WC compared to now. Coaches gave us space then, but not now

Author:	BlueWorld [ Sun May 08, 2005 4:33 pm ]
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Since then every other coach has studied us and worked out how to beat us. We were at full strength then but have had major structural problems with loss of key position players since the WC final. Our confidence levels have dropped substantially (especially yesterday when we found ourselves virtually out of contention before we'd even got going) and we're not taking risks like we were then. We were a lot fresher then. We've had a gruelling schedule last 4 weeks.

Author:	Macfart [ Sun May 08, 2005 4:33 pm ]
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You should consider we are a very very average team thats why dramatic changes are required and you are kidding yourself if you think the Wiz Cup is anything more than a trial game for a lot of clubs

Author:	BlueWorld [ Sun May 08, 2005 4:35 pm ]
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For some clubs yes (Essendon*) but I don't think the Demons, Bulldogs or Eagles weren't fair dinkum.

Author:	DiS [ Sun May 08, 2005 4:41 pm ]
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The Carlton team that won the Wiz Cup was completely different to the one that turned up to play the Tigers yesterday. These are the teams that played in the Wiz Cup: CARLTON B: Houlihan, Livingston, Teague HB: Sporn, Thornton, Bannister C: Camporeale, Stevens, McGrath HF: Chambers, Whitnall, Lappin F: Deluca, Fevola, Walker Foll: French, Koutoufides, Scotland Int: Morrell, Prendergast, Norman, Davies, Simpson, Carrazzo WEST COAST B: Wirrpunda Glass Banfield HB: Chick Staker Hunter C: Braun Fletcher A.Embley HF: Sampi Hansen Cousins F: Gardiner Lynch R.Jones R: Seaby Judd Stenglein INT: Kerr Waters Graham Butler B.Jones Wooden These are the teams for Rd7: CARLTON Backs: Carrazzo Thornton Teague Half-backs: Wiggins Koutoufides Houlihan Centres: Scotland Stevens Walker Half-forwards: Longmuir Waite Lappin Forwards: Deluca Whitnall Betts Followers: French Johnson Rover: Camporeale Interchange: Bannister Chambers Simpson Sporn CHANGES: Carrazzo, Chambers out, Prendergast, Oâ€™hAilpin in. WEST COAST Backs: Banfield Wirrpunda Glass Half Backs: Chick Hunter Stenglein Centre: Kerr Cousins Braun Half Forwards: Adkins Hansen Sampi Forwards: Embley Lynch Matera Followers: Judd Cox Fletcher Interchange: Selwood B. Jones Nicoski Staker For us, these 8 players were missing from yesterday's squad. Livingston McGrath Chambers Fevola Morrell Norman Davies Carrazzo And these 6 did not play in the Wiz Cup. Wiggins Longmuir Waite Betts Johnson Simpson For West Coast, these 7 players were missing in the squad that beat the Hawks today. Gardiner R. Jones Seaby Waters Graham Butler Wooden While these 5 did not play in the Wiz Cup. Adkins Matera Cox Selwood Nicoski It's pretty much even for both teams, yet the Eagles have had a much better year than we have. Arguably West Coast do have a better team, yet we were able to run over the top of them in the Wiz Cup GF. The differences then to now are the team's approach, mental attitude, confidence and leadership. Their confidence was sky-high going into the Wiz Cup GF. We'd won the first 3 games, and Stevens had chosen the GF over his brother's wedding. After the Wiz Cup, perhaps the boys were too confident and hence the loss in Rd 1 etc. Then the last 2 weeks, confidence was low after losing Fev, and the previous weeks of losing Livo and T-Bird, as well as the losses, had also had an impact. Then losing Carazzo hurt too. Even though we beat the Hawks it wasn't good football, like they played in the Wiz Cup. The boys only really played one good quarter, which apparently was inspired by a huge rev up from Campo. Obviously yesterday nobody took up that responsibility and it showed how much we were lacking in confidence and leadership. Yesterday was a bad game and one to forget. We know that the boys are much better than that, so yes Windy I agree with you.

Author:	TheGame [ Sun May 08, 2005 4:44 pm ]
Post subject:
Quote: Arguably West Coast do have a better team Ya reckon!

Author:	DiS [ Sun May 08, 2005 4:52 pm ]
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TheGame wrote: Quote: Arguably West Coast do have a better team Ya reckon! If I didn't I wouldn't have said it And yes, they are better than us, and yes, we beat them. No, it wasn't a practice match because both sides had almost their best team on the park. We are capable of beating any side, as long the team is dedicated, switched on and confident in themselves and each other. So what are you trying to say?

Author:	dannyboy [ Sun May 08, 2005 6:35 pm ]
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I say get your head of the Tavern and have a serious look. Better than who? We are soft defensively and until that is fixed we will continue to lose. Sadly we lack any kind of 'grunt' leadership - its all fair weather la de dah crap but when the tide turns we have leaders who go belly up or who play for soft, soft kicks so wide they share seats with the cheer squad. We lack skills, Shit how many times do we have to turn a ball over before we realize we have blokes out there who are shit kicks? We are short. We have too many slow players STILL!!!!! The speed of the wizzfizz is gone and we have returned to the plodders or joggers. For @#$%&!'s sake Betts and walker have to run back and forth back and forth to cover not their men but the @#$%&! midield's!!!!! We have more holes than a sieve! I have watched two weeks of the worst football ever seen in a bluebaggers jumper - luckily for us the Hawks are just shit. Toss in the Essendon* game for three quarters of joke football and we have a side that is no wher enear better than anyone. We are a laughing stock. Witht he filth and the bummers, we are shit! Yeah we'll wim some games. yeah we'll be competitive. But how close are we to winning the next flag - i think hardly any closer than three years ago. I hate this @#$%&! system!

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Author:	Kaptain Kouta [ Sun May 08, 2005 5:11 pm ]
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DiS wrote: TheGame wrote: Quote: Arguably West Coast do have a better team Ya reckon! If I didn't I wouldn't have said it And yes, they are better than us, and yes, we beat them. No, it wasn't a practice match because both sides had almost their best team on the park. We are capable of beating any side, as long the team is dedicated, switched on and confident in themselves and each other. So what are you trying to say? Well, he's trying to say he knows better than we do, and if he says that the WC matches were nothing more than practice hit-outs, then we should just genuflect and agree.

Author:	ScottSaunders [ Sun May 08, 2005 6:03 pm ]
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TheGame wrote: Why did no team get extra numbers down in defence during the Wiz cup? Why have every side we've played since rd 1 get extra numbers back? Get over the practice matches, they were a confidence builder but they certainly mean absolutely nothing now. Why? I will tell you why. We have yet to play a team that back themselves. Melbourne & Weagles certainly back themselves and dont feel the need to play a 7 man defence. This has worked so far for shit teams. North are shit and do it. Hawthorn are shit and do it. Collingwood had a day out as did Tigers. Port backed themselves and we drew against them at Port - Freo is always hard expescially after playing port the week before. We have yet to fill the same team that we have since the wizzer cup. We have yet to have the same quality of disposal we had during the wizzer cup. Every game this year - we have had 14 men in our forward line - what chance do they have? But this problem has been magnified by the fact that our disposal has been shithouse. IMO - i tend to think that is bad coaching. May sound strange, but for the life of me i cant understand why the message doesnt go out that everyone, excluding our full forward push up to the CHF line and put the FF on the goal line, giving the FF room to move. Get fev in a 1on1 and he will win mroe than he loses. If they dont allow us to do that, then they carry the ball into or near the f50 and go for goal. This is what we did in the wizzer cup and this is what works for us. The constant reference to our list being shit is just crap, granted, we certainly are not playing well, but a team that beats Melbourne and the Weagles is hardly a team we need to "slash and burn" and completly rebuild. I will put this out for the sceptics. we have played North, Essendon*, Hawthorn, Port, Freo, Collinwood and the Tigers and you know what, i will give you all the hot tip. With the exception of Port (which i think are extremelly crippled from injuries) we will beat every single one of these teams again when we replay them. Why - becuase we are better than them, so straing of the bat we have 7 wins there, plus the 2 and 1/2 we already have puts as at 9 1/2. We beat Geelong (a team that backs themselves) and Melbourne at OO and we have 11 1/2 wins. What say you negative nellies?

Author:	Blue Vain [ Sun May 08, 2005 6:17 pm ]
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How much do you want for that jousting stick?

Author:	blueman [ Sun May 08, 2005 6:38 pm ]
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As far as I am concerned, the Richmond match was a season defining test. The players failed to follow Pagans instructions and Carlton failed that test. We have had 2.5 wins and we are a third the way through our season, the two actual wins not being very convincing ones where you could say we played a full 4 quarters. To say that we are better than the teams we have played really is Pollyanna stuff. Theres been plenty of time to show that we are better and we havent done this at all - so its simple - we arent better than the the teams we lost to, we are the same or worse, but not better.

Author:	Elwood Blues1 [ Sun May 08, 2005 6:59 pm ]
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Wizzer cup format is different including the rules...its TV footy..some clubs are interested some are not....we got interested for the money. Danny is on the money with his thoughts.....