Byron Pickett - Norm Smith medalist - premiership player 1999 and 2004

Draft picked at pick no. 67



Andrew McLeod - dual Norm Smith medalist and premiership player

traded by Fremantle for Chirs Groom.


Adam Goodes - dual Brownlow and premiership player

draft pick number 43 in 1997



Simon Black - Norm Smith medalist and 3 time premiership player

draft pick number 31


Carlton's best player excluding the incomparable Lance Whitnall (who won our best and fairest by the way)?

Draft pick number 38 in 1998- The Fev.


It is fools gold to think that high draft picks alone maketh the team. It is big and wise spending on the football dept, clever planning, good coaching and resources that make the difference these days.

Richmond let Franklin go / Hawthorn were wise enough to recruit them.

President Pratt has done the right thing by increasing resources in the football dept.

Hawthorn also let Franklin go the first time around when they picked Roughead

Exactly!!!

what a load of crap. I do my business ethically and with integrity. Losing to gain an advantage is doing business with no integrity. That's for clubs like Collingwood and Richmond.

we didn't purposely tank to get those players. We got them because we tried but weren't good enough, hence we got them via fair business with integrity.

Start winning games, and you will see the development of the players speed up in leaps and bounds. West Coast never had to tank to stay at the top. Now that's a club that is a role model.

If 5 years at the bottom isn't enough to gain the talent to win a premiership, we are doing something very very wrong. Are you all afraid to make it the hard way? Want to take the easy route by finishing bottom for 5-7 years and then finally win a premiership or two and then tank for another 5-7 years? What a pathetic way to do it.

"Business is Business".






Look at the buisness we are in and were we are coming from....




"Imagine the club withouth Murphy, Gibbs or Walker"



Not saying that ain't true, what i am saying is that people wanted to win a few extra games and get players you might not be able to build around....




Not a fair comparison when you conside what westcoast have to work with, and where we are coming from. No club has been delt the hand we were dealt.




I just don't think we can afford to take too many chances. We have made too many mistakes in the last 10 years, and we have to make it count this time.....We must rebuild properly.

We won't have to finish bottom for 5 years ever again. Next time we will have our draft picks, and a good list to work with come trade time in the years ahead. Most importantly/hopefully we will have learnt from the past.

Remember it's like we are starting all over again, and the first cut is always the deepest....

_________________
Circumstance has no value. It is how one relates to a situation that has value. All true meaning resides in the personal relationship to a phenomenon, what it means to you.

Hey Synbad, take a read of an article written by a person who actually knows what he's talking about. This guy has coached teams to 5 grand finals and a whole bunch of finals finishes in the past 15 or so years. So I'm guessing he knows what he's talking about.

http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,865 ... 11,00.html

"The draft process is one giant gamble. Every club can compile evidence to show how clever and prescient it has been by spotting players others have rejected.

At the same time, every club can produce a list of potential champions it missed in the annual lottery. "

Science may help you identify the athletes, but it won't help you identify the footballers. And at the end of the day, I'd take a footballer over an athlete any day. Tony Shaw would agree with me on that one also.

http://realfooty.com.au/news/news/athle ... 69612.html

That's why as much as you criticise Lance, he still has plenty to offer this year. Because he is a footballer.

I've been the same, on the fence, maybe one foot on Pagan's side, only because we had bigger problems off field to worry about and of course the fact it was unrealistic to get rid of him as we couldn't afford it.

We probably still can't afford it, but after last weeks game (no plan to counter the Fev Flood everyone knew was coming and no protection for Murphy) I've swung the other way and hope Round 22 is Pagan's last game.

Regarding a PP this season. I'm sick of losing, sick of wooden spoons, sick of the tanking talk and people saying its the only way....but deep down I'd love to finish 15th with 4 wins, not because its the only way, but because it will make our path to #17/18/19/20 a bit easier. I've put up with 5 years of losing, wooden spoons and tanking, I can live through another 16 weeks of it if thats what happens. I'm not going to curse the club and the football gods if it doesn't though.

_________________
"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

Wayne Harmes is that you??? you legend!

Carlton's best player excluding the incomparable Lance Whitnall (who won our best and fairest by the way)?

Draft pick number 38 in 1998- The Fev.

Synbad wrote,

"Lance is our best player????? "


I was taking the mickey about Lance being our best player... i thought putting the word incomparable in the description would be the give away.

The bit about the best and fairest was there because people seem to hang their hat on Lance winning the B & F as being some big deal -it isn't when the voting is dodgy.

re: draft picks. I just want to see Carlton improve - and if that means getting rid of the coach, or whatever... good. I don't want Carlton down the bottom of the ladder year after year.

and now we're back tot he "but you can get good players with late picks" argument

you could almost set your watch by the coming and going of half-baked ideas on this site

_________________
Love Cricket? Love me

tank

Come on boys, why is it so hard to understand??? We arent good enough. You would think we will pick up better players with the PP. What would you prefer, picks 1, 4 & 20 or picks 3, 19 & 35???

I've said it once and i'll say it again, i will be very pissed off if we win 6 meaningless games this season!!!

_________________
Walk on, Walk on,
With hope, in your heart,
And you'll never walk alone,
YOU'LL NEVER WALK ALONE!!!

08/02/1981 - GATE 7...Our brothers will never be forgotten!!!

GAV, you haven't bothered answering any of my questions yet, so I'll try again.

You've expressed doubt about Kennedy and Russell in their player threads. Ironic as both were early draft selections and Kennedy was in fact our reward for finishing last a couple of years ago.

Given the fact that in your eyes early draft selections can be such a disappointment, why are you so obsessed with getting an extra one?

_________________
"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

The stupid expectation about tanking is that the players wont purposely Tank so why bother worrying about it. we are loosing games because of the list inbalance with week senior leadership ... Missing mid range players in the 24 - 28 area and a Dinasour for a Coach with a crap game plan and lacks faith in the youngsters.
We arnt tanking we are loosing and to all the tankers Pagan is assisting your cause..


If the team where encouraged to tank throw games or play below par how long do you think Murph and Gibbs would hang around you reckon these players want to be around a team purposly loosing games ....

I want to see a new coach installed to see if someone new and hopefully more recent to the game is able to get what i consider to be an okay list to play what i believe this team can play to.

Having said that there will still be changes come years end and i reckon we need to nab a decent mature mid 20' Mid to help out young kids develope.

_________________
CFC TAC Squad everyone over 25 must be traded sounds like Loguns Run

Because True Blue Brad we are talking about getting 2 picks in the Top 4 of the National Draft. We need the opportunity of getting these 2 players on our list - lets not worry about how good or bad they are yet, lets get them first and second lets get a coach that can coach them.

_________________
"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

We will get the PP this year becuase we win 4 games or play the crap coaching game plan of Pagan not becuase we are tanking

the only time a coach will timker with the list and maybe manage the list in away that we dont win another game is around round 18 or 19 not round 6 or 7

_________________
CFC TAC Squad everyone over 25 must be traded sounds like Loguns Run

Thanks GAV

_________________
"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

How about Ty Zantuck? I hear he is available.

Bradley, i'm disappointed that u arent paying attention. I've already addressed ur question in the 'Jordan Russell' thread.

Had the Blues adopted my suggested approach a few years back, we would now have Deledio or Franklin in our team instead of Russell. Winning IRRELEVANT games is exactly what landed us Russell. Russell may haver been a first round pick but he wa sat pick 9!!! I want picks 1 & 4 this season.

_________________
Walk on, Walk on,
With hope, in your heart,
And you'll never walk alone,
YOU'LL NEVER WALK ALONE!!!

08/02/1981 - GATE 7...Our brothers will never be forgotten!!!

why the hell would i want to recruit ty Zantuck Malleefowl.

I said we need to target a quality mid 20 Midfielder IE a Del Santo / Judd or any other of that level available

Why would i want the Blues to recruit a recycled hack like Ty Zantuck we have done that enough already..

The reason we dont attract players like Goddard or Mcphee last year as none of them wanted to even come to the Blues because of the look of the Blues looking like a train wreck. Hopefully now we arnt seen so much like a basket case like we have in the past 4 years.

_________________
CFC TAC Squad everyone over 25 must be traded sounds like Loguns Run

You've addressed half the question mate. Now tell us why you want another Kennedy.

http://www.talkingcarlton.com/phpBB2/vi ... &start=288



Are disappointing performances really worth all this losing?

_________________
"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010