TalkingCarlton :: View topic - Walker V Murphy Disposal Issues??

Watching the game for the 5th time and thought i would focus on Walker and Murphy and on their disposal in particular - I think its a Myth that Walker has poor disposal. I chose Murphy as the second player to watch as we know he is a gun and would provide an interesting comparison/snapshot when comparing

Walker:
Good: Great defensive mark under pressure and 40m kick pass straight to Stevens on near HBF
Good: Mark in near back pocket from Houlihan kick in - 50m kick pass to contest under pressure lands right on contest (whitnall)- downfield free for late contact to Walker
Bad: Great Mark under pressure from Roughead and copped a smack to the nose - 40m kick to the wing to no one in particular - ball rushed over for boundary throw in
QTR TIME - NOTES: two great marks under pressure - running his ass off to cover for loose checking team mates in D50 - NOT on Boyle is on Little has tried to cover Boyle who has gotten loose from his man - who is hard to tell who that is meant to be

Good: Handball receive running around back of O'Hailpin on last line of defence - running 50m kick to wing precise to Nick Stevens
Good: Gets ball at back of contest deep in defence - clearing handball to O'Hailpin
Good: Continues to run and handball recieves from O'Hailpin - 40m running kick precise to Gibbs on HBF(brilliant play results - walker to gibbs to whitnall to running simmo to leading kennedy mark to fevola GOAL)
Bad: Running around back of pack recieves handball - runs to just outside the D50 and blazes away to the centre line to absolutely no one ( looked paniched due to lack of options - kick looked fine - odd one really )
Good: Runs to recieve handball from Lappin after kickin - runs out of defence and handballs off
Good : Cuts back inside receives handball and kicks 40m precisely to Murphy in the square

HALF TIME - NOTES - let little give him the slip once that resulted in a goal- busts a gut in defence to provide run and drive - great spoiling and forcing pressure in a marking contest . Sets up most of our play from defence and drives forward

9 Disposals - 2 Bad / 7 Good ( 6 kicks - 2 bad/4 good )

Murphy:
Good - Rove from Fev - running handball to Carazzo who goals on the run
Good - Handball receive and 40m pass to Lance in F50 who gives away a free kick (Voss calls it poor choice - hmm harsh)
Good - Intercepts handball pass - 2 steps BANG supergoal !!!!
Good - running mark then run into F50 with dodgy bounce - short kick pass to Fev (places Fev under slight pressure- but gets pass to betts for Goal) Walls calls murphy a smart star
QTR TIME - NOTES: GUN - positioning off packs is great - tackling and pressure is spot on - smart player

Good: Good hands and pickup in a pack in centre square - quick chip kick to simmo under pressure- gets us a clearance and going forward (Lane calls kick inneffective - harsh)
Good - Sweeping handball out of pack backwards to Ackland at CHB to set up play
Good: good hands again pickup and turn sweeping handball to advantage for bentick to run onto but Bentick too slow
Bad: Murphy chases and picks up his own handball Bentick couldnt get but forces another handball to houlihan who is outnumbered - to his credit Murphy gets in there again but a turnover results
Bad: good pickup again - but too quick to sling the ball forward with a short kick to opposition - another turnover
Bad : good burst to pick up the ball off the pack- blazes for goal under pressure out of bounds on the full.
Bad: receives ball at back of pack - off balance kick goes 5 metres into one of our players bounces up and simmo gets it
Bad: Murphy turns to far wing and kicks over Simmos head - Simmo has enough space to gather though

HALF TIME - NOTES - Seems harsh to give murphy so many bad disposals as they were all a result of trying to create and putting in hard work - still a very good quarter with defensive pressure - great hands and positioning

12 Disposals - 5 bad / 7 good

Thats just the first half and if i get time i will do the second half - but i found in interesting that Murphy had worse disposal than Walker - seems harsh as they play different roles and positions and are in differeing circumstances but Walkers disposal was very good - Murphy was always trying to create something and his disposal seemed to be affected as he tired

I dont know if theres anything at all to really draw from this but both players are stars and i think Walker is harshly criticised.

Author:	grrofunger [ Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Walker V Murphy Disposal Issues??
Watching the game for the 5th time and thought i would focus on Walker and Murphy and on their disposal in particular - I think its a Myth that Walker has poor disposal. I chose Murphy as the second player to watch as we know he is a gun and would provide an interesting comparison/snapshot when comparing Walker: Good: Great defensive mark under pressure and 40m kick pass straight to Stevens on near HBF Good: Mark in near back pocket from Houlihan kick in - 50m kick pass to contest under pressure lands right on contest (whitnall)- downfield free for late contact to Walker Bad: Great Mark under pressure from Roughead and copped a smack to the nose - 40m kick to the wing to no one in particular - ball rushed over for boundary throw in QTR TIME - NOTES: two great marks under pressure - running his ass off to cover for loose checking team mates in D50 - NOT on Boyle is on Little has tried to cover Boyle who has gotten loose from his man - who is hard to tell who that is meant to be Good: Handball receive running around back of O'Hailpin on last line of defence - running 50m kick to wing precise to Nick Stevens Good: Gets ball at back of contest deep in defence - clearing handball to O'Hailpin Good: Continues to run and handball recieves from O'Hailpin - 40m running kick precise to Gibbs on HBF(brilliant play results - walker to gibbs to whitnall to running simmo to leading kennedy mark to fevola GOAL) Bad: Running around back of pack recieves handball - runs to just outside the D50 and blazes away to the centre line to absolutely no one ( looked paniched due to lack of options - kick looked fine - odd one really ) Good: Runs to recieve handball from Lappin after kickin - runs out of defence and handballs off Good : Cuts back inside receives handball and kicks 40m precisely to Murphy in the square HALF TIME - NOTES - let little give him the slip once that resulted in a goal- busts a gut in defence to provide run and drive - great spoiling and forcing pressure in a marking contest . Sets up most of our play from defence and drives forward 9 Disposals - 2 Bad / 7 Good ( 6 kicks - 2 bad/4 good ) Murphy: Good - Rove from Fev - running handball to Carazzo who goals on the run Good - Handball receive and 40m pass to Lance in F50 who gives away a free kick (Voss calls it poor choice - hmm harsh) Good - Intercepts handball pass - 2 steps BANG supergoal !!!! Good - running mark then run into F50 with dodgy bounce - short kick pass to Fev (places Fev under slight pressure- but gets pass to betts for Goal) Walls calls murphy a smart star QTR TIME - NOTES: GUN - positioning off packs is great - tackling and pressure is spot on - smart player Good: Good hands and pickup in a pack in centre square - quick chip kick to simmo under pressure- gets us a clearance and going forward (Lane calls kick inneffective - harsh) Good - Sweeping handball out of pack backwards to Ackland at CHB to set up play Good: good hands again pickup and turn sweeping handball to advantage for bentick to run onto but Bentick too slow Bad: Murphy chases and picks up his own handball Bentick couldnt get but forces another handball to houlihan who is outnumbered - to his credit Murphy gets in there again but a turnover results Bad: good pickup again - but too quick to sling the ball forward with a short kick to opposition - another turnover Bad : good burst to pick up the ball off the pack- blazes for goal under pressure out of bounds on the full. Bad: receives ball at back of pack - off balance kick goes 5 metres into one of our players bounces up and simmo gets it Bad: Murphy turns to far wing and kicks over Simmos head - Simmo has enough space to gather though HALF TIME - NOTES - Seems harsh to give murphy so many bad disposals as they were all a result of trying to create and putting in hard work - still a very good quarter with defensive pressure - great hands and positioning 12 Disposals - 5 bad / 7 good Thats just the first half and if i get time i will do the second half - but i found in interesting that Murphy had worse disposal than Walker - seems harsh as they play different roles and positions and are in differeing circumstances but Walkers disposal was very good - Murphy was always trying to create something and his disposal seemed to be affected as he tired I dont know if theres anything at all to really draw from this but both players are stars and i think Walker is harshly criticised.

Author:	AGRO [ Mon Mar 05, 2007 11:43 pm ]
Post subject:
Any player who can carry the ball 20/30 metres and then kick around 50 metres on his non-preferred leg is OK in my book - Walker is sensational and will only get better.

Author:	yibbida [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 6:55 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Walker V Murphy Disposal Issues??
grrofunger wrote: Watching the game for the 5th time and thought i would focus on Walker and Murphy and on their disposal in particular - I think its a Myth that Walker has poor disposal. I chose Murphy as the second player to watch as we know he is a gun and would provide an interesting comparison/snapshot when comparing Walker: Good: Great defensive mark under pressure and 40m kick pass straight to Stevens on near HBF Good: Mark in near back pocket from Houlihan kick in - 50m kick pass to contest under pressure lands right on contest (whitnall)- downfield free for late contact to Walker Bad: Great Mark under pressure from Roughead and copped a smack to the nose - 40m kick to the wing to no one in particular - ball rushed over for boundary throw in QTR TIME - NOTES: two great marks under pressure - running his ass off to cover for loose checking team mates in D50 - NOT on Boyle is on Little has tried to cover Boyle who has gotten loose from his man - who is hard to tell who that is meant to be Good: Handball receive running around back of O'Hailpin on last line of defence - running 50m kick to wing precise to Nick Stevens Good: Gets ball at back of contest deep in defence - clearing handball to O'Hailpin Good: Continues to run and handball recieves from O'Hailpin - 40m running kick precise to Gibbs on HBF(brilliant play results - walker to gibbs to whitnall to running simmo to leading kennedy mark to fevola GOAL) Bad: Running around back of pack recieves handball - runs to just outside the D50 and blazes away to the centre line to absolutely no one ( looked paniched due to lack of options - kick looked fine - odd one really ) Good: Runs to recieve handball from Lappin after kickin - runs out of defence and handballs off Good : Cuts back inside receives handball and kicks 40m precisely to Murphy in the square HALF TIME - NOTES - let little give him the slip once that resulted in a goal- busts a gut in defence to provide run and drive - great spoiling and forcing pressure in a marking contest . Sets up most of our play from defence and drives forward 9 Disposals - 2 Bad / 7 Good ( 6 kicks - 2 bad/4 good ) Murphy: Good - Rove from Fev - running handball to Carazzo who goals on the run Good - Handball receive and 40m pass to Lance in F50 who gives away a free kick (Voss calls it poor choice - hmm harsh) Good - Intercepts handball pass - 2 steps BANG supergoal !!!! Good - running mark then run into F50 with dodgy bounce - short kick pass to Fev (places Fev under slight pressure- but gets pass to betts for Goal) Walls calls murphy a smart star QTR TIME - NOTES: GUN - positioning off packs is great - tackling and pressure is spot on - smart player Good: Good hands and pickup in a pack in centre square - quick chip kick to simmo under pressure- gets us a clearance and going forward (Lane calls kick inneffective - harsh) Good - Sweeping handball out of pack backwards to Ackland at CHB to set up play Good: good hands again pickup and turn sweeping handball to advantage for bentick to run onto but Bentick too slow Bad: Murphy chases and picks up his own handball Bentick couldnt get but forces another handball to houlihan who is outnumbered - to his credit Murphy gets in there again but a turnover results Bad: good pickup again - but too quick to sling the ball forward with a short kick to opposition - another turnover Bad : good burst to pick up the ball off the pack- blazes for goal under pressure out of bounds on the full. Bad: receives ball at back of pack - off balance kick goes 5 metres into one of our players bounces up and simmo gets it Bad: Murphy turns to far wing and kicks over Simmos head - Simmo has enough space to gather though HALF TIME - NOTES - Seems harsh to give murphy so many bad disposals as they were all a result of trying to create and putting in hard work - still a very good quarter with defensive pressure - great hands and positioning 12 Disposals - 5 bad / 7 good Thats just the first half and if i get time i will do the second half - but i found in interesting that Murphy had worse disposal than Walker - seems harsh as they play different roles and positions and are in differeing circumstances but Walkers disposal was very good - Murphy was always trying to create something and his disposal seemed to be affected as he tired I dont know if theres anything at all to really draw from this but both players are stars and i think Walker is harshly criticised. so you are saying that both of them are crap ? No player would go through a game without kicking it to a pack or miscuing one to the opposition.

Author:	DOA [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 7:50 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Walker V Murphy Disposal Issues??
Quote: No player would go through a game without kicking it to a pack or miscuing one to the opposition. Exactly,and against that reality,all Carlton players are expected to go through their careers blemish free.

Author:	grrofunger [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 8:05 am ]
Post subject:
Im not saying they are crap at all I think they are both brilliant !! I think it does show that Walker is harshly judged though - not one person mentioned anything about miscued or poor disposal from Murphy yet Walker got criticised. This actually shows Walkers disposal was better in the first half, i just think everyone needs to lay off Walker and actually watch rather than etching in their minds the one or two poor disposals he might do in a game - hes no worse than any other player in the league, in fact i think hes a gun and better than at least half of the league.

TalkingCarlton http://www.talkingcarlton.com/phpBB3/

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Author:	TheGame [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 8:19 am ]
Post subject:
Good stuff I like this mythbuster stuff. My all time fave was when the Houlihan bashers were left with egg on their faces after reading the paper a couple of years ago to see Houla was the most effective kick in the comp and James Hird was the clanger king of the AFL.

Author:	Effes [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 8:23 am ]
Post subject:
TheGame wrote: Good stuff I like this mythbuster stuff. My all time fave was when the Houlihan bashers were left with egg on their faces after reading the paper a couple of years ago to see Houla was the most effective kick in the comp and James Hird was the clanger king of the AFL. Houlihan had the 4th most clangers in the competition last year

Author:	JohnM [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 8:23 am ]
Post subject:
I love watching AW play. I love the way he wholeheartedly puts his entire being into every passage of play he's involved with. I love his unbridled enthusiasm and his creativity. I love his athleticism. I love the fact that he's exciting to watch. And because I watch him for the wonderful things he's capable of, and not for the occasional times he (sin of all sins) makes an error... I walk away from our encounters a happier person. Bottom line: watching AW run around in a Carlton jumper makes me happy. And that's gotta be a good thing.

Author:	bluechucky [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 8:26 am ]
Post subject:
Good stuff Grrofunger.... I've been mightily impresseed with both Walker and Murphy. Murphys stepped up a notch. Walker too and he is huge (almost didn't recognise him when I saw him at the Essendon* game). Murphy's disposal is off mostly when he's under pressure. Walkers disposal is off when he tries to kick it too long. His distance is really no more than 35-40 meters. Any longer than that (and when kicking at full speed, he can be all over the shop) In those times, he should look for the boundary or keep running. but thats what I love about Walks game.... his linkage with Thornton/Carlos, and his running.... now that puts a smile on my face.

Author:	SurreyBlue [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 8:32 am ]
Post subject:
Great thread. Couldn't agree more and both players are going to be 300+ gamers for the mighty blues! Russell is the next one to surprise as well.

Author:	bluechucky [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 8:37 am ]
Post subject:
SurreyBlue wrote: Russell is the next one to surprise as well. For sure.... I'm rapt we sponsor him and hope we do so for a long time yet.

Author:	AGRO [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 8:45 am ]
Post subject:
bluechucky wrote: Murphy's disposal is off mostly when he's under pressure. What game are you watching???? Some of Murphy's best work I saw in the past few weeks is when he has been under pressure.

Author:	Sydney Blue [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 8:47 am ]
Post subject:
I am always amazed that Walkers Disposal attracts so much attention when we must have dropped 5-6 easy marks in the forward 50 ( 3 off them chest marks ) and missed 6 or 7 easy shots at goal . The side needs to learn how to sieze the moment and bury a team take their chances when they are presneted to them . Once they do that they will have turned the corner and you wont notice anyones disposal

Author:	Electric Blue [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:00 am ]
Post subject:
Great work Pullmyfinger! This is exactly the sort of stuff we should be discussing, not how shit Houilihan is, or why did we get Cloke. Analyse our player on actual performance and the results will be very interesting...

Author:	Molly [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:14 am ]
Post subject:
One of the most bizzare things I've seen online lately came from over at BigFooty. It was last week, and it was headed something like 'do Carlton fans overrate Andrew Walker?'. Then all of these supposed Carlton fans lined up and took it in turns to stick the boots into 1AW. Fair dinkum I'm sick of it! This kid almost never gets beaten in a one-on-one contest with some of the country's elite footballers, and here are some of our fans sitting around and whinging that we should have picked McLean or Sylvia. Get a grip people! The kid is twenty!!! Heaps of improvement to come, and he is already awfully good! As for the kicking - I dare say that if we were a team who had the skills to apply a solid gameplan that you would find 1AW would hit a lot more targets than he misses. Give Andrew Walker a break... and be thankful he plays for the navy Blues!

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Author:	bondiblue [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:02 am ]
Post subject:
Great thread grrofunger. Your diligent appraisal serves our club and supporters very well indeed. Thanks for your efforts Two junior champions analysed whilst on their journey towards becoming two more future AFL champions in the Dark Navy Blue jumper. The Game wrote Quote: Good stuff I like this mythbuster stuff. So do I The Game. Quote: My all time fave was when the Houlihan bashers were left with egg on their faces after reading the paper a couple of years ago to see Houla was the most effective kick in the comp and James Hird was the clanger king of the AFL. And the golden boy could do no wrong in the eyes of the media. Just goes to show how harsh some are on their own. Effes wrote Quote: Houlihan had the 4th most clangers in the competition last year What percentage of his disposals were clangers? That's important to know before we judge him with disdain. From grronfungers analysis we should all agree with one thing and that is AFL is a high pressure, physical contest, and in such a contest no footballer will have a career in the AFL devoid of clangers. Clangers will happen to all players when under extreme pressure when in possession of "the hot pill", "hospital pass"... Now I'm waiting for your 2nd half analysis. I believe there will be replay of Saturday's game on Fox at 12.30 today.

Author:	molsey [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:19 am ]
Post subject:
If sites like this are supposed to be about analysis of our football team and not just shitcanning players on off days, then we should take grrogfungers lead and do some more of this. I don't trust published clanger numbers at all - so many kicks will not go to advantage but somehow not all are collected in the stats - it is perhaps definitional by the stats takers. Maybe we could test out the clanger stats on this site. it would be better to do this test for a live game as you can see the whole ground set out before you but this weeks game would be interesting. How about we get 3 different people to report back on 3 different players with some form of clanger test? ie 9 people, 3 on each individual. The 3 reviewers shouldn't be in the same place monitoring the game. Next week we ask them to come back with results ie no of clangers out of no. kicks. If they missed a kick then it has to be ignored?

Author:	bluechucky [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:24 am ]
Post subject:
AGRO wrote: bluechucky wrote: Murphy's disposal is off mostly when he's under pressure. What game are you watching???? Some of Murphy's best work I saw in the past few weeks is when he has been under pressure. What I'm saying is that he doesn't miss when there is no pressure ... which admittedly is few and far between. I never said I didn't like his work in pressure. I'm intimating that he doesn't make a mistake based on ability.

Author:	SurreyBlue [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:26 am ]
Post subject:
Sydney Blue wrote: I am always amazed that Walkers Disposal attracts so much attention when we must have dropped 5-6 easy marks in the forward 50 ( 3 off them chest marks ) and missed 6 or 7 easy shots at goal . The side needs to learn how to sieze the moment and bury a team take their chances when they are presneted to them . Once they do that they will have turned the corner and you wont notice anyones disposal Couldn't agree more.

Author:	7dominator [ Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:54 am ]
Post subject:
Great piece of work Grrfunger. I have to say i came in late on Saturday and read the negative reports regarding AW's game. After watching Andrews game on replay it immediately struck me just what a bad wrap that he received. Wouldn't we love a few more with his running and enthusiasm!