I agree B. If we can counter the goals these talls kick from contested marks with hard rebound footy off the contested marks they miss then I believe we don’t have a problem. The fast counter from defense sets up our whole game. Gives us use of the corridor which in turn opens up our forward line.

We might get caught out every now and again but more times than not going with a more mobile defence will make us a better side.

Name the top-line defenders in the AFL who are 195cm or taller. It's not lack of height that troubles us against bigger forwards such as Brown and Hall.

I actually don't know why we don't play to our strengths abit more with the 3 amigos up forward. At ground level they are the equal of any smalls in the AFL. Setanta and Hendo would be better off trying to direct any high balls into the running path of these guys like Big Nick use to.

Contested Marks inside the forward 25 are like hens teeth but snapped goals by our little fellas are more likely to result. Both Hendo and Setanta get their hand/hands on the high ball most of the time in the contest but rarely mark cleanly as everyone has stated. Instead of trying to mark it they should be palming/hitting/deflecting it to a spot either front, side or back. To me the flip over the back is hardest for the defenders to defend because of the natural momentum of the ball is in that direction. To do that though the ball needs to land 20-25 out from goal so that the smalls have some room to work.

I'm not suggesting it should happen every time but if Hendo and Setanta are aware the smalls are at their feet (and they should be) then they should forego the effort to mark and play the ball like a ruckman.

You have one slim chance of a contested mark and 2 or 3 chances of a picking it up off the pack.

It just adds another dimension to the forward options. At the moment the 'Forward goes for the mark the back man attempts to spoil' is so engrained in a footballers brain that the KPP tapping the ball never seems to occur.

We have the right tools in Talls and Smalls up forward so why not think outside the box. Just a thought.

Regards Cazzesman

I actually don't know why we don't play to our strengths abit more with the 3 amigos up forward. At ground level they are the equal of any smalls in the AFL. Setanta and Hendo would be better off trying to direct any high balls into the running path of these guys like Big Nick use to.

Contested Marks inside the forward 25 are like hens teeth but snapped goals by our little fellas are more likely to result. Both Hendo and Setanta get their hand/hands on the high ball most of the time in the contest but rarely mark cleanly as everyone has stated. Instead of trying to mark it they should be palming/hitting/deflecting it to a spot either front, side or back. To me the flip over the back is hardest for the defenders to defend because of the natural momentum of the ball is in that direction. To do that though the ball needs to land 20-25 out from goal so that the smalls have some room to work.

I'm not suggesting it should happen every time but if Hendo and Setanta are aware the smalls are at their feet (and they should be) then they should forego the effort to mark and play the ball like a ruckman.

You have one slim chance of a contested mark and 2 or 3 chances of a picking it up off the pack.

It just adds another dimension to the forward options. At the moment the 'Forward goes for the mark the back man attempts to spoil' is so engrained in a footballers brain that the KPP tapping the ball never seems to occur.

We have the right tools in Talls and Smalls up forward so why not think outside the box. Just a thought.

Regards Cazzesman

I saw Carlos try that a few times in the preseason and have noticed Sandilands do it around the ground. Another tactic I discussed with friends while having a drink was to kick high floaters and missed timed torps into crowded ,zoned out 50 meter arcs. Making it more a 50/50 chance of a win than a 35/65 that a kick in usually is. I woke up the next morning thinking perhaps I had a bit too much to drink but I have noticed the cats do it a number of times this season.

I'm surprised that you have that view Jimmae. I'm one of those that believe we should have as many who are close to the 190 cm mark as possible in the back half (as long as they are agile), but I'm not sure monster defenders are the way to go IMO.

Name the top-line defenders in the AFL who are 195cm or taller. It's not lack of height that troubles us against bigger forwards such as Brown and Hall.

Its not the height and size of forwards that causes issues, its the pressure further upfield. If our midfield and forwards are chasing our defenders arent exposed.

Bower and Jammo are fine with Walker playing as a third tall.

I agree with jimmae.

The blokes 195-200cm+ have always been a problem for us.
We've seen what opposition coached do to stretch Jamo 193 and Bower 193...they send in the ruck or the super tall forwards.

I think the point jimmae makes is that our backmen do struggle against the very talls like Brown, Bradshaw, Hall etc and the next crop of upcoming KP's of similar size and maybe ilk will likely do the same as they develop into bonafide stars of the game.

To respond to your comment Spornstar re Jamo and Bower being rarely beaten by height. I have. I have lots of times, by the types jimmae mentions.

Jamo was outmarked against Buddy, and probably the reason he isn't outmarked many of the times is that he chooses to try and get away with giving away the free kick because he's about to lose the marking duel. Everyone must recall umpires catching Jamo giving away free kicks. Same applies to Bower. Refer to last year's Final against Brizzy. Last year when Maric went forward, and Birdman.....it has been discussed at length.

Rutten isn't as slow as some believe. He ran off Fevola all day a couple of weeks ago. Now Fev has got a decent take off and against Rutten it didn't look effective. I wish we had a big bodied tall to out muscle and move KP giants aside and away from a marking opportunity; not necassarily Rutten, but his strength would do just nicley in a GF.

That's not to say I'm unhappy with the current crop of defenders we have. Good thing for us is the mids and forward have been pretty decent this year kicking higher scores than we did in the past and win despite being towered in the backline. Although in a GF, against a competitive midfield, we better have a plan for the tall timber the opposition coach will send to the FF line to stretch Jamo and Bower; after all, that is standard practise.

That's why I'd like us to consider developing Hammer in other roles such as backline in the future, otherwise we have to send back Setanta in times of need and when we did that this year that really robbed Peter to pay Paul as it usually does.

Not after a monster defender, just one who is around 197 cms. But it's the reach that I'm most keen on, not the height or the weight. These bigger blokes simply dominate when the kick is remotely to advantage because they are physically too big.

Long term I want a guy in there to support Bower & Jamo. They can handle all comers except these taller types.




Midfield pressure certainly helps, but I'm just staggered at the lack of taller defenders in the AFL at present. I am casting my mind through teams and only Cale Hooker & Tom Lonergan come to mind, and they're certainly not top-line.

Jamo & Bower are great, but I'd like to see a capable 195 cm+ defender come in and compliment them. That or someone with Fletcher-esque arms.

We'll have to agree to disagree on this one.
Sure, if there was a brilliant 195cm+ mobile defender then great, but they don’t grow on trees and I can’t even think of one (maybe Fletcher, but he’s not used in that role anyway. Somone else suggested Gilbert, he is useless one on one. I suppose Merrett would be handy. ).

We may have struggled against Brown in the past, but that’s mainly because Thornton was playing on him. Let’s not forget how inexperienced Jamo and Bower are. They are only going to get better and stronger. I like the idea of another key defender for depth, but IMO they need not be 195cm+ (and if they are, they need to be good when the ball hits the deck, a very rare commodity).

West Coast tried to stretch us on the weekend with height, and even without Bower it didn’t work (almost all their marks were on the lead, and Lynch was useless). And I reckon our run out of defence will make coaches think twice about sending the tall timber forward to stretch us.

I’d rather we have a good lead up key forward. Hopefully Hendo will provide us with that, but obviously that’s no certainty and we could probably use another for depth in any case.

BTW I'm not averse to giving Hammer a go in the backline, but I don't want to see Setanta being sent back unless the situation is dire.

Name the top-line defenders in the AFL who are 195cm or taller. It's not lack of height that troubles us against bigger forwards such as Brown and Hall.

I thought that was part of what we are doing Cazz? Which I thought was contributing to us being number one for goals inside 15 metres.

I just read jimmae's post above re Fletcheresque.
Exactly.

Exactly what I and the other poster Indy aka Mav have been stating for years. Hence our support for Setanta in the team as insurance. But that was before he was accepted by the MC and supporters to be a good and valuable KP forward.

Look they are rare these backmen with a huge reach (remember SOS? He had the great reach too), but we shouldn't dismiss the fact that we have a gap which we have to fill by player or by tactics. I just can't help of thinking of Hampson type specimen (being developed for that role); especially give we havve 3 other ruckmen to do the ruckwork.

No, that's because Hendo can't mark in a contest and just brings the ball to ground. And Setanta doesn't trust his 9 iron, and generally gives it off within about 20 metres (last week aside).

Cazzesman is suggesting perhaps they shouldn't even bother trying to mark it in contested situations, they should just tap the ball on to advantage. It's a question of intent. I think this is worth experimenting with against weaker sides. Once Hendo has just fisted the ball over the back off the pack to a running Yarran/Garlett a few times, it would have to put an element of doubt into the backman's mind about whether to contest, and if not, where to position themselves. Having thouroughly confuzzled them, in the second half he could just go for his marks, probably under less pressure.

I reckon most teams would like a Fletcher, probably a Scarlett as well . Fletch can play on smalls and talls and uses the ball very well which is why they free him up, but as has been mentioned that combination in the one player is rare. Could there, just maybe, be a reason why there aren't that many really tall defenders?

Interestingly, Carlton are ranked first this year for conceding the least amount of contested marks at an average of 6.3 per game. So much for the theory that we need an oversized defender to negate opposition KPPs.
Jamo is ranked one of the most effective spoilers in the game today despite his skinny frame.