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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 9:04 am 
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Stephen Silvagni
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Most talked about people on TC:

1. Russell
2. Fevola
3. Setanta
4. verbs


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 9:05 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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verbs wrote:
Most talked about people on TC:

1. Russell
2. Fevola
3. Setanta
4. verbs


Gibbins

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 9:07 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Poor verbie berbie...............

ya JUST missed out on Bronze................!


kindest regards tommi




















i like to keep it topical...............!

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 9:31 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Don't tell me Beano was wrong?

Setanta doesn't hate Ratts?

Where is Beano anyway?

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 9:34 am 
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Geoff Southby
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BrizzyBlue wrote:


Hans-on

Great headline


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 11:29 am 
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Herald Sun columnist
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molsey wrote:
BrizzyBlue wrote:


Hans-on

Great headline


The paper said that Carlos was looking for "piece of mind" - WTF :-D

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 11:33 am 
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Geoff Southby
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DownUnderChick wrote:
molsey wrote:
BrizzyBlue wrote:


Hans-on

Great headline


The paper said that Carlos was looking for "piece of mind" - WTF :-D
Think they meant "relief"

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 11:37 am 
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Robert Walls
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I thought the MC hated O'Hailpin???

Did I get this wrong somewhere???

:-D :-D :-D


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 12:51 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Molly wrote:
I thought the MC hated O'Hailpin???

Did I get this wrong somewhere???

:-D :-D :-D



didn't you know, the whole family is hated, :roll:

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:18 pm 
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Harry Vallence

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kingkerna wrote:
Don't tell me Beano was wrong?

Setanta doesn't hate Ratts?

Where is Beano anyway?

Pretty pathetic comment that - putting words into Beano's mouth which he didn't say.

Beano suggested that the lack of love was going the other way - that he was the target of disrespectful and upsetting comments.

And that seems to be entirely consistent with yesterday's news reports. There were comments about friction and frustrations involving Santy and Aisake and others.

How about this for a scenario. Santy has had health issues for the whole year which were hard to diagnose and treat. Then he copped calf problems around the time of the Bullants' match against Bendigo. There were those at the club who started ridiculing Santy for being a sook and a wimp because of the problems he was complaining about.

Now, the 2 most inflammatory things you can say about a footballer, or any team sportsman, are that he's a dud and he's a coward or wuss.

I'd say that the latter is the worst. I'd say most of us have heard that sort of stuff at footy clubs - someone complains of injury and others throw about barbs that he must have pulled a heart muscle. At least if someone talks you down as a dud, you can prove yourself on the field. But if you're restricted by injury or health issues, your performance will tend to vindicate malicious gossip. As such comments go to your character, there's nothing worse that can be said of you. Have a look at the attitude to Sally Robbins at the selection trials for the Olympic Games this year. There was consistent commentary from others involved that she shouldn't be given a spot even if her results qualified her, and there was unprecedented jubilation when she didn't qualify. Such a reputation is absolute poison for a team sportsman.

In Santy's case, it appears from whispers passed on by some who say they have inside info that the dirty war reached a crescendo when Santy pulled up with injury in the Bendigo game. There was a suggestion that doctors couldn't find objective evidence of the injury, but as anyone with half a brain knows that doesn't mean that the conclusion can be drawn that no injury exists. Soft tissue and neurological issues aren't easy to diagnose objectively. Just look at Fev - he played on in 2005 as the club doctors thought his groin was ok, but then the surgeon subsequently described the damage in the muscle as the worst he'd ever seen. And this year we've seen Judd play on when the club doctors cleared him of concussion, only to find that he supposedly suffered "delayed concussion" when there was a wave of criticism when he couldn't play the following week.

It appears the malicious gossipers were suggesting that Santy was either neurotic, or worse, that he was a sook who couldn't take being dropped. Can you imagine how much damage either characterisation could have created to his relationship with his team mates and coaches?

All of this was so unjust. When you're drawing conclusions about players, you have to look at their overall character. Santy deserves to be considered in a separate category to players such as Karl Norman and Laurence Angwin on one hand, and Ackland and Stephen Oliver on the other. Obviously, KN and LA found it difficult to commit themselves totally to their football given their off-field activities. Ackland and Oliver have, at least some of the time, found it hard to muster the fanatical desire to succeed in AFL footy - they would have been just as happy to spend their time elsewhere. Compare that to Craig Bradley or Robert Harvey. Nathan Burke related a story on radio about the club being mystified by soft tissue injuries that Harvey sustained in preseason as they thought they’d tailored the perfect program for him. Subsequently, they found out that he was running long distances in his time away from the club and working for hours on an exercise bike in his home. I’d put Santy towards the Bradley/Harvey end of the spectrum when it comes to dedication to his sport. He has come from the other side of the world and left behind friends and family to pursue his dream (and Stephen Oliver found a 2 hour car trip an insurmountable obstacle). Like Harvey, he has been criticised for overtraining. He doesn’t drink at all, and there have never been any suggestions that things outside football have distracted him. And you just have to look at his reactions after the Port win to see just how much passion he has for the sport and our club. To rubbish the concerns he has expressed about his health has always been breath-takingly disgraceful. If he says he has a problem, THEN HE HAS A PROBLEM – no objective evidence is required.

That’s what makes the recent announcement of his trip to Germany so wonderful. It looks as though the club has now rejected the viewpoint of the malicious gossipers and is accepting Santy’s concerns. Not only that, but it’s putting $20,000 into the treatment, so it isn’t just lip-service. It was great to hear Santy in his interview. He seemed like a guy who’d had a weight lifted off his shoulders, and it seems that he is just as keen to succeed with us as when he arrived (and he said all the right things to heal any rift that may have occurred). I can understand the way he feels. I feel so much more optimistic now. I don’t even know the guy like Beano does, but I feel jubilant and relieved that an injustice has been remedied and a wrong righted.

If a medical problem is identified and treated, then I would hope that those within the club who have trashtalked Santy are either moved on or are told in no uncertain terms that such poor player management cannot be repeated. With complete recovery, there’d be every chance that his speed and reaction time on the leading forward will rise to the same high standard as he showed this year with his body-on-body work against the gorillas. That is truly an exciting prospect.



PS:
I just hope that Carlton’s decision to pay for his treatment in Germany isn’t a strategic investment to:
* ensure that Santy and Aisake don’t torpedo Carlton’s attempts to sign up the 2 Irish boys who are trialing with us (as you’d think that the Irish boys would seek out their opinions); or
* be able to present Santy to other clubs during trade time as a player who has overcome his injuries.

I also wonder about the problems between Lappin and Aisake. Until now, the assumption has been made that Santy’s relationship soured with some at Carlton after Aisake was demoted because of his run-in with Lappin. But the news report suggested that the injury issue with Santy had caused friction for Aisake. Could it be that we had it around the wrong way - that Aisake might have had a run-in with Lappin because of comments about Santy? If that is the case (and that is purely speculative of course), then I’d hope that the announcement regarding Santy’s trip to Germany will have a beneficial effect on Aisake too.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:25 pm 
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Geoff Southby
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Great post Indie. Love Setanta to bits and hope he recovers.

It prompted me to watch the Interviews - Setanta did very well. I just wish Ian Coutts would have let him talk (Hi Ian) rather than jutting in all the time.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:26 pm 
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Ian Coutts talks way too much in those interviews.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:52 pm 
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Bob Chitty
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DownUnderChick wrote:
Ian Coutts talks way too much in those interviews.


He is the master of the 40 second question.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:59 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Indie my smart arse comment was actually meant to say "you mean Ratts doesn't hate Setanta?"


Beano has hinted many times that this is the situation, my gripe with him is that he puts a player above the club.

I have always said that Setanta is a required player.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 5:39 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Sounds like Setanta needs to TTFU hey Indie


Question what happens if he sees the German Doctor and he says sorry there is nothing I can do for you . Correct me if I am wrong but in the Interview they didn't exactly state that what was wrong and wether it could be cured


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:33 am 
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Serge Silvagni
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kingkerna wrote:
Indie my smart arse comment was actually meant to say "you mean Ratts doesn't hate Setanta?"


Beano has hinted many times that this is the situation, my gripe with him is that he puts a player above the club.

I have always said that Setanta is a required player.


No, you tried paraphrasing and semantics.
I put the player above the club because I thought that that was acceptable, or is that just with Marqee players??
The issue I took with the club, and no-one in here I may add, because that would be childish, was that both lads were being treated unfairly, Zack has had to cop a full year of watching because of 1 bust up with coaches, F me if it was the same for eveyone how many would be in the 2's every week?

I don't know for sure about Setanta taking sides, his struggle was his own, only now is a year long problem being recognised.

Kerna, do you think is should have been let go for a year without proper treatment.

I am not saying for one second that any club, anywhere should bow down to 1 individual, especially one who has not got a background in the game and is never going to have a Judd or Fev like influence on a game, what I am saying is that every player, EVERY player, should be given the same treatment.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 10:02 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Beano wrote:
kingkerna wrote:
Indie my smart arse comment was actually meant to say "you mean Ratts doesn't hate Setanta?"


Beano has hinted many times that this is the situation, my gripe with him is that he puts a player above the club.

I have always said that Setanta is a required player.


No, you tried paraphrasing and semantics.
I put the player above the club because I thought that that was acceptable, or is that just with Marqee players??
The issue I took with the club, and no-one in here I may add, because that would be childish, was that both lads were being treated unfairly, Zack has had to cop a full year of watching because of 1 bust up with coaches, F me if it was the same for eveyone how many would be in the 2's every week?

I don't know for sure about Setanta taking sides, his struggle was his own, only now is a year long problem being recognised.

Kerna, do you think is should have been let go for a year without proper treatment.

I am not saying for one second that any club, anywhere should bow down to 1 individual, especially one who has not got a background in the game and is never going to have a Judd or Fev like influence on a game, what I am saying is that every player, EVERY player, should be given the same treatment.


thanks beano, I believe you have proved my point.

If Setanta got traded to say, Melbourne would you follow them?

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 10:06 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Blues87 wrote:
DownUnderChick wrote:
Ian Coutts talks way too much in those interviews.


He is the master of the 40 second question.


It's basic media management. He's doing his job.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 4:14 pm 
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Serge Silvagni
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kingkerna wrote:
Beano wrote:
kingkerna wrote:
Indie my smart arse comment was actually meant to say "you mean Ratts doesn't hate Setanta?"


Beano has hinted many times that this is the situation, my gripe with him is that he puts a player above the club.

I have always said that Setanta is a required player.


No, you tried paraphrasing and semantics.
I put the player above the club because I thought that that was acceptable, or is that just with Marqee players??
The issue I took with the club, and no-one in here I may add, because that would be childish, was that both lads were being treated unfairly, Zack has had to cop a full year of watching because of 1 bust up with coaches, F me if it was the same for eveyone how many would be in the 2's every week?

I don't know for sure about Setanta taking sides, his struggle was his own, only now is a year long problem being recognised.

Kerna, do you think is should have been let go for a year without proper treatment.

I am not saying for one second that any club, anywhere should bow down to 1 individual, especially one who has not got a background in the game and is never going to have a Judd or Fev like influence on a game, what I am saying is that every player, EVERY player, should be given the same treatment.


thanks beano, I believe you have proved my point.

If Setanta got traded to say, Melbourne would you follow them?


How.

And if he moved to the Dees, I would of course look out for their resultsand if they played Carlton while thecurrent MC was in place, I would have to want a Dees win,

BUT, over the last 5 years I have grown to love the blues and a lot of their players, even FEv who pisses me off like you wouldnt believe.
So I would still cheer the famous old dark blues.


How is your point lookin now?

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 4:23 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Quote:
How.

And if he moved to the Dees, I would of course look out for their resultsand if they played Carlton while thecurrent MC was in place, I would have to want a Dees win,

BUT, over the last 5 years I have grown to love the blues and a lot of their players, even FEv who pisses me off like you wouldnt believe.
So I would still cheer the famous old dark blues.


How is your point lookin now?


my point is looking very good, you put a player in front of the club, your judgement is clouded.

You could say I put the club in front of the player, that's how it should be. I make no apologies for this.

I loved Carlton before Setanta was born, of course I am going to support them regardless, you won't.

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