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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 6:21 am 
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Stephen Silvagni
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On paper the list looks better balanced with runners Daisy and Docherty plus biggerbodied Cripps Holman Everitt.

Still some doubt about our KPPs though.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 6:41 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Rexy wrote:
On paper the list looks better balanced with runners Daisy and Docherty plus biggerbodied Cripps Holman Everitt.

Still some doubt about our KPPs though.


Some one is going to snare a good KPP in the next couple of years because there is not enough room in the forward line for Cameron Boyd and Patton

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 6:46 am 
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Stephen Silvagni
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Sydney Blue wrote:
Rexy wrote:
On paper the list looks better balanced with runners Daisy and Docherty plus biggerbodied Cripps Holman Everitt.

Still some doubt about our KPPs though.


Some one is going to snare a good KPP in the next couple of years because there is not enough room in the forward line for Cameron Boyd and Patton

Not sure we can afford to trade though Syd - we need to lure a decent KPP via free agency I reckon


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 7:05 am 
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formerly cj69

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Sydney Blue wrote:
Rexy wrote:
On paper the list looks better balanced with runners Daisy and Docherty plus biggerbodied Cripps Holman Everitt.

Still some doubt about our KPPs though.


Some one is going to snare a good KPP in the next couple of years because there is not enough room in the forward line for Cameron Boyd and Patton


and McCarthy.

It's smart List Management. They will be able to keep replenishing their list and controlling their Salary Cap for years to come because of it.

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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 7:07 am 
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formerly cj69

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Rexy wrote:
On paper the list looks better balanced with runners Daisy and Docherty plus biggerbodied Cripps Holman Everitt.

Still some doubt about our KPPs though.


Agree. Be a big call for Giles to step up next year.

Still tempting to pick Tippett in the Rookie Draft to allow Henderson to go forward. If we can do that we are okay at least in the short term.
The fitness of Waite and the improvement in Watson are the key.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 7:44 am 
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Ken Hunter

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ThePsychologist wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Rexy wrote:
On paper the list looks better balanced with runners Daisy and Docherty plus biggerbodied Cripps Holman Everitt.

Still some doubt about our KPPs though.


Some one is going to snare a good KPP in the next couple of years because there is not enough room in the forward line for Cameron Boyd and Patton


and McCarthy.

It's smart List Management. They will be able to keep replenishing their list and controlling their Salary Cap for years to come because of it.


..and Jaksch.. ..and that's just the fwds, consider some are true kpps it might even be one of their kpd's that gets pushed out.. ..and other clubs [maybe us] will need to offer overs to make the trade, and overs in contract [dollars/term] to entice the player to agree to come to us as well.. ..trading in players, especially kpps, is too costly to sustain on a frequent basis.. ..but we will never learn.. ..and it's far too limiting cos the 'pool' to choose from is likewise limited.. ..and the same goes for free agents as well, especially cos the overs you pay for restricted hurts the tpp, and unrestricteds will most likely offer only short term aid.. ..free agents will be at least mid-way thru their careers, there's no real longterm plans with free agents.. ..they are just the cherry on the top, but we think we can build a cake thru the off-season..

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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 7:45 am 
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Ken Hunter

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ThePsychologist wrote:
Rexy wrote:
On paper the list looks better balanced with runners Daisy and Docherty plus biggerbodied Cripps Holman Everitt.

Still some doubt about our KPPs though.


Agree. Be a big call for Giles to step up next year.

Still tempting to pick Tippett in the Rookie Draft to allow Henderson to go forward. If we can do that we are okay at least in the short term.
The fitness of Waite and the improvement in Watson are the key.


..big call for most kids to step up in their first year save a very good few.. ..but for what it's worth, i think Giles will be more ready than say Watson was for us [in his first year and possibly even in his second]..

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 8:35 am 
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Craig Bradley
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I hate our chances, if we're putting any eggs into the Mathew Watson development basket.

Old Lead Legs, they call him. He plays like he's 57 years old, they say.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 11:00 am 
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Rod Ashman

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Easy for GWS to stock pile picks in excess of requirements when they are handed 30 picks for free over 3 drafts.
It was not a strategy open to the CFC and does not make us "dumb", "stupid" or other critical references that are bandied about


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 11:58 am 
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formerly cj69

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Michael Jezz wrote:
Easy for GWS to stock pile picks in excess of requirements when they are handed 30 picks for free over 3 drafts.
It was not a strategy open to the CFC and does not make us "dumb", "stupid" or other critical references that are bandied about


Maybe, but they have been smart with it. They are spreading their age and salary cap to be able to keep at the top.

In a few years clubs will fall over themselves to get Patton, Boyd or McCarthy? May take 2 first round picks. They lose a player they can cover and bring in too more guns.

They traded 20yo Tyson and got 18 yo Kelly! They still have Scully, Whitfield, Sheil, Greene, Coniglio, Ward, Smith, Treloar through the midfield and their ages will very and be balanced.

It's very smart list management IMO. GC had the same opportunity and I don't believe they have used it as well.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 12:09 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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What we need most is sureminded players who are clean and quick under pressure - Cripps seems to fit the bill


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 12:22 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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ThePsychologist wrote:
Michael Jezz wrote:
Easy for GWS to stock pile picks in excess of requirements when they are handed 30 picks for free over 3 drafts.
It was not a strategy open to the CFC and does not make us "dumb", "stupid" or other critical references that are bandied about


Maybe, but they have been smart with it. They are spreading their age and salary cap to be able to keep at the top.

In a few years clubs will fall over themselves to get Patton, Boyd or McCarthy? May take 2 first round picks. They lose a player they can cover and bring in too more guns.

They traded 20yo Tyson and got 18 yo Kelly! They still have Scully, Whitfield, Sheil, Greene, Coniglio, Ward, Smith, Treloar through the midfield and their ages will very and be balanced.

It's very smart list management IMO. GC had the same opportunity and I don't believe they have used it as well.

I agree that staggering the list in terms of age groupings is good, but I think they've mucked up some of their picks as they go along.

McCarthy at 14 was a mistake IMO. They have a fair chunk of height on the list already and he's just not special enough to warrant it. That's a Sheedy pick IMO. Paid a premium for pace off the mark and aerial ability without much thought for pattern running and legitimate tricks to evade zones/loose players/direct opponents.

Acres, Lang or Hartung would have done wonders for them.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 12:25 pm 
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Ken Hunter

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Michael Jezz wrote:
Easy for GWS to stock pile picks in excess of requirements when they are handed 30 picks for free over 3 drafts.
It was not a strategy open to the CFC and does not make us "dumb", "stupid" or other critical references that are bandied about


..but if we keep on ignoring certain weaknesses, as we have over 10 yrs, then yes we have been 'dumb'.. .... ..cos eventually we panic, it's why our list has been unbalanced for so long..

..and still is..

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 12:30 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Big Kahuna Boot wrote:
Michael Jezz wrote:
Easy for GWS to stock pile picks in excess of requirements when they are handed 30 picks for free over 3 drafts.
It was not a strategy open to the CFC and does not make us "dumb", "stupid" or other critical references that are bandied about


..but if we keep on ignoring certain weaknesses, as we have over 10 yrs, then yes we have been 'dumb'.. .... ..cos eventually we panic, it's why our list has been unbalanced for so long..

..and still is..

If we're going for value with the philosophy that we should be able to develop them and move them on (read: on trade) as needed to give us access to types we need then I'm all for it.

I'd rather take what's good at the pick than reach and not have a real back up plan if something goes wrong.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 1:15 pm 
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Ken Hunter

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..for sure, i agree.. ..we ought not to reach, but when there are good options across a variety of 'player types' available, and we skip the more essential types [kpp/pure mid] and instead go for small fwds, flanks, hbfs, 3rds etc then we're not building up the spine and engine room.. ..you get that sorted as a priority, but we never did before we started to add the cream.. ..we have no cake.. .... ..but plenty of cream..

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:16 pm 
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John Nicholls

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Wouldn't even worry about Patton. Get the feeling that his knee might be rooted hence why they took McCarthy last night.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:37 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

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Braithy wrote:
I hate our chances, if we're putting any eggs into the Mathew Watson development basket.

Old Lead Legs, they call him. He plays like he's 57 years old, they say.


Who is saying that Braithy?

His team mates?

Coaches?

Wouldnt be the recruiters.

What do you think?

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:46 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

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ThePsychologist wrote:
Michael Jezz wrote:
Easy for GWS to stock pile picks in excess of requirements when they are handed 30 picks for free over 3 drafts.
It was not a strategy open to the CFC and does not make us "dumb", "stupid" or other critical references that are bandied about


Maybe, but they have been smart with it. They are spreading their age and salary cap to be able to keep at the top.

In a few years clubs will fall over themselves to get Patton, Boyd or McCarthy? May take 2 first round picks. They lose a player they can cover and bring in too more guns.

They traded 20yo Tyson and got 18 yo Kelly! They still have Scully, Whitfield, Sheil, Greene, Coniglio, Ward, Smith, Treloar through the midfield and their ages will very and be balanced.

It's very smart list management IMO. GC had the same opportunity and I don't believe they have used it as well.



Tyson wanted out and was going back to Victoria. They had to trade from what I hear from wealthy Dee supporters.

Boyd said last night he's a passionate Carlton supporter because his parents got into him early.

What can GWS do if Boyd wants to come home to Melbourne in 2016? And he chooses Carlton? And Carlton offer then their 1st round and 2nd round pick for him?

They aren't all going to stick with GWS. Have a look at the plethora of KP s they have. It aint all on their terms. They're hoping to cheery pick from their squad.

Have you been to western Sydney? No way Boyd will be living in Bondi Beach to enjoy the surf and beach culuture and commute to Western Sydney to train and play....that's an 80 minute trip plus you have to factor traffic jams, so make it 120 minute trip you have to give yourself to be sure....same if he chooses Coogee or even worse North Shore.

He isnt going to surf for a couple of hours, drive 80 minutes then train for 2 hours...daily.

Tough ask for an interstater to live out west imo.

Mark No3 lives around the corner from Homebush but he also is around the corner where he has a fantastic job with a publisher, but that's a different story: Mark is happily married with kids too. Boyd is young and single.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:50 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

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bondiblue wrote:
ThePsychologist wrote:
Michael Jezz wrote:
Easy for GWS to stock pile picks in excess of requirements when they are handed 30 picks for free over 3 drafts.
It was not a strategy open to the CFC and does not make us "dumb", "stupid" or other critical references that are bandied about


Maybe, but they have been smart with it. They are spreading their age and salary cap to be able to keep at the top.

In a few years clubs will fall over themselves to get Patton, Boyd or McCarthy? May take 2 first round picks. They lose a player they can cover and bring in too more guns.

They traded 20yo Tyson and got 18 yo Kelly! They still have Scully, Whitfield, Sheil, Greene, Coniglio, Ward, Smith, Treloar through the midfield and their ages will very and be balanced.

It's very smart list management IMO. GC had the same opportunity and I don't believe they have used it as well.



Tyson wanted out and was going back to Victoria. They had to trade from what I hear from wealthy Dee supporters.

Boyd said last night he's a passionate Carlton supporter because his parents got into him early.

What can GWS do if Boyd wants to come home to Melbourne in 2016? And he chooses Carlton? And Carlton offer then their 1st round and 2nd round pick for him?

They aren't all going to stick with GWS. Have a look at the plethora of KP s they have. It aint all on their terms. They're hoping to cheery pick from their squad.

Have you been to western Sydney? No way Boyd will be living in Bondi Beach to enjoy the surf and beach culuture and commute to Western Sydney to train and play....that's an 80 minute trip plus you have to factor traffic jams, so make it 120 minute trip you have to give yourself to be sure....same if he chooses Coogee or even worse North Shore.

He isnt going to surf for a couple of hours, drive 80 minutes then train for 2 hours...daily.

Tough ask for an interstater to live out west imo.

Mark No3 lives around the corner from Homebush but he also is around the corner where he has a fantastic job with a publisher, but that's a different story: Mark is happily married with kids too. Boyd is young and single.


Point is that its not easy to hold players if they want out.

We got Docherty for pick 32. He was a first rounder...pick 7 or something...same with the other 5 "mummy's boys" who left the Lions this year.

Watch this space as the tables turn.

The AFL can give them everything to succeed, but there's no guarantees.
People still debate which model is the best: GCS vs GWS.
I reckon in the long term they will have their highs then theyll become a post circa 2011 Lions combo.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:54 pm 
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John Nicholls

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Docherty was Pick 12 from memory.

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