If my Aunty had balls she'd be Nick Dal Santo - that kind of thing.

Cretylus..............Blueman Jnr. ?

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The problem with Socialism is, you eventually run out of other people's money.

Interesting question Molly. I saw Robert Walls play his first game and only missed a handful of others throughout his career. Walls was an excellent player, but maybe a tad under rated. Possibly because of the calibre of the team mates around him.
IMO he blended in more than stood out.
He didn't give the impression of being a ''hard arse'' BUT. I met Richmond CHB Robbie McGhie through a mutual friend, and he admitted to being very wary of Walls. Said if you gave Walls a clip, you knew you'd get it back, with interest.
Considering he played and shared a locker room with the likes of Big Nick, Barassi, Serg, Lofts, Rick McLean, Barry Gill etc I guess that shouldn't have been a surprise.

Syd Jackson ? A great player, as was another No 5, Ken Sheldon. (Apologies to Ken Greenwood ).
Rod Ashman also rightly mentioned in this thread, he was a class act.
So was Adrian Gallagher.

_________________
The problem with Socialism is, you eventually run out of other people's money.

PS.
Robert Walls played a fair bit of his early footy in the back pocket. Alongside W.V. Lofts. A sound apprenticeship in anyone's lingo.

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The problem with Socialism is, you eventually run out of other people's money.

One day, I have to get a copy of every Carlton game available, to compare older players with the more TV-exposed ones of more recent years.

Southby Vs SOS is a popular comparison. I'd also like to see a lot more of Swan McKay's games, Jezza's, of course, and as much of Big Nick's that exist on tape, bearing in mind that it's not the same as being at the game and getting a whole-of-ground perspective.

It's a dirty job but someone's gotta do it.

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'People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use.'
Soren Kierkegaard

I did something similar, but started with finals and some big rivalry matches.

.....a player must perform in big games and under pressure in order to rank highly and be a genuine champion player.

I Don't pay any attention to brownlow votes. Its staggering to see the list of champions that didn't win a brownlow (and sometimes didn't even poll well, like bruce Doull)

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Vice President, International Extreme Sarcasm Society (IESS)

Cretylus, if you want a list with a different slant, check out http://www.fromthemoshpit.com/2012/07/26/the-magnificent-seven/. A different KPI to the ones we're discussing here, although not completely unrelated.

_________________
Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience!!!

After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says W T F .........
Visit http://fromthemoshpit.com/

Well, I'm a bit older than most of you so I have both an advantage and disadvantage. I started watching them in 1961 as a young 11 year old. I saw them win in '68 and how sweet it was after the long drought. You young ones will get the same poleasure at the end of the current one. So will I, hopefully.

Here's mine.

1. Nicholls. Without peer in his day as a ruckman, enforcer and leader. Polly was perhaps his equal as a ruck but not the rest.
2. Jezza. Played everywhere and won. Back, midfield, FF? just did it. As good as GAblett senior in the air and better at ground level. Didn't have Ablett's strength though. He was a jumper, not a wrestler. Picked the wrong side of a political stoush and had to leave. What a waste.
3. Bruce Doull. His autobigraphy whoud have been called, "Punched Away" by Bruce Doull. I once heard someone say Doull had the best physique he had ever seen on a man. He was feared by all and not just for his footy. he had a presence. The silent deadly type.
4. Deisel Williams. If we had have had him all his career, we'd have won at least 17 by now.
5 Wes Lofts. Lofts was an enforcer in an era of hard men. He copped the likes of Wade, McKenna, Hudson, Blethyn in the golden era of full forwards. He was rarely beaten and if he was he made them earn it big time.
6 Geoff Southby. For mine the FB of the century even though I've put him below Lofts. Southby was one of the first running full backs and would get a game in today's era. He was too fair for his own good. If I recall he was the only FB to hold Hudson goalless. I may be wrong.
7. Wayne Johnson. I wish we had him playing today. He would be awesome. Played injured a lot apparently. Game changer.
8. Kouta. There can be only one. If he hadn't been struck down in his peak we'd have won at least 17 by now.
9. Robert Walls. Played with everything he had. was curbed a one stage bu the coach's instruction to bring the ball to ground instead of mark it (apparently). Should never have left Carlton. A travesty of club politics. Again.
10. Fev. Take away his silliness and he was a true matchwinner. He could have been anything and often was. I have no doubt had he stayed and been able to play football instead of creating headlines, we'd have given it a shake three years ago.
11. Wayne Harmes. Another player who would get a game today. And how. He could do anything and often did. Great overhead and one of the best kicks the game has ever seen. Hard and fast. I loved him.

We all have to leave out heaps in these exercises. They are always subjective but we tend to pick players we like in whatever era. I was never a huge Sticks fan but he could easily be in there. SOS I loved but I wanted him to play forward, not back. Madden, Crosswell (he would have been in there if he had staed longer), Ashman, Buckley, Maclure, Judd, Dean, Goold I almost included but his dash was offset by his propensity to mis-kick his dropkicks.. None would be out of place in that list.

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Let slip the Blues of war (with apologies to William Shakespeare) (and Sir Francis Bacon, just in case)

Nice list. Crane is interesting. He went from a fringe player to a very good one withing two seasons IIR.
Ragsy almost made my list (see above). I loved him. Pity he couldn't kick.

_________________
Let slip the Blues of war (with apologies to William Shakespeare) (and Sir Francis Bacon, just in case)

By the way, everybody - many people have mentioned wanting to see more highlights of some of the past champions.

All player highlights are being worked through by some very good people "around" the club, and they're up to about 100 players now.

Check out http://www.youtube.com/user/SpiritofCarltonTV/videos

_________________
Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience!!!

After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says W T F .........
Visit http://fromthemoshpit.com/

Thanks for that link, I will check it out.

30

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Vice President, International Extreme Sarcasm Society (IESS)

Blue Sombrero's top 11 and his short reasoning of each selection brought back a lot of memories of why these players were so great, and such accomplished champions in their time.

Is it any wonder that 1/4 of the afl/vfl team of the century was comprised of carlton greats?

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Vice President, International Extreme Sarcasm Society (IESS)

For the shear capacity of being able to take a game on and turn it on its head the following players I think were the greatest
Kouta
Buzz
Johhno
Judd
Jezza
Williams
and Fev

there have been a lot of greats - Doull Hunter Harmes Ratten SOS Big Nick Southby Walls Maclure Ashman etc

But the 7 above could tear a game apart

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

Good list of players who regularly tore games apart

(Although I am not sure which games played by Judd you are referring to. I class Judd as a different type of player)

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Vice President, International Extreme Sarcasm Society (IESS)

In no apparent order after 1st 3 legends
Doull
Nicholls
Jezza
Johno
Williams
Crosswell
Hunter
Kernahan
Bradley
Silvagni
Apologies to Kouta,Judd,Ratten,Southby,Mckay,Walls +Fev

John Nicholls
Alex Jesaulenko
Greg Williams
Geoff Southby
Ken Hunter
Steve Kernahan
Bruce Doull
Craig Bradley
Anthony Koutifides
Chris Judd
Wayne Johnson
Steve Silvagni

Once again not in any order

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Get the facts first.
Then you can distort them at your leisure.

No one is mentioning present day players apart from Judd. In my list I as I stated on p. 2 I would happily put Simmo in. Along with Kenny Hunter both were/are crazy courageous. Simmo can play centre, on ball and now across half back. He has endurance, is fast, a lovely kick, marks above his height and weight. Has anyone ever seen him shirk an issue or not go for a mark. Put away the rose coloured glasses of yesteryear he can make it into the squad.

In fact there are three crazy courageous players over 3 distinct eras at Carlton who would each rate a mention.

Hunter and Simmo are two.

The earlier of the '60s was Gary Crane and he has been mentioned previously. On one wing with Ian Robertson centre and Brian Quirk other wing they were the only centre line that consistently beat Richmond's famed Bourke, Barrot and Clay.

Crane was not particularly fast or a good kick but as tough as nails. old leather etc. never ever shirked an issue. The original baby faced killer.

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"Get ready, Teddy - you're on": Ron Barassi half time 1970 Grand Final

According to Walls, Hunter and Crane are the bravest players he has seen

If Simmo continues as is, for another 3 years, he will certainly make a few lists of all time greats (even though Simmo didn't get a single possession in his first three games)

_________________
Vice President, International Extreme Sarcasm Society (IESS)

There was one in Sydney in the wet that instantly come to mind

_________________
If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

What defines great? I'll just say for me it's players who stood out

I started watching footy in 79.

Didn't see enough of Jezza

Not necessarily in order

1 SOS
2 Johnston
3 Kernahan
4 Bradley
5 Doull
6 Williams
7 Harmes
8 Koutoufides
9 Hunter (actually sold him property once)
10 Ratten
11 Ashman