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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 9:46 am 
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Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
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Location: Bondi Beach
Juddment Day wrote:
Jamison out of form???
are you !@#$%& retarded???
he lost 2 one on ones last night
every other week he has dominated his opponent
he is number 1 in comp for spoils
out of form???
clearly some of you dont understand a full backs role
and he is our only pure key position player bar the 4 ruckman


Have a look at the Pros and Cons thread JD.
The general feeling is that Jamo is not on song.
That implies that his form is down.
You're on your own. Have another look at the last month's footy.

I think you missed a bit of footy if you think Jamo failed on 2 occassions for the game.
Geez, just have a look at the shots at goal by his opponents in the 1stQ alone.
Have a look at some of his spoiling attempts...against kids...terrible timing.
Have a look at the frees and 50's he's given away last night and the last month.
He has to change his ways. He is a shadow of the player he was in the early part of the season
I think you may be a tad bias.

If he continues to play as he did last night, Hall will kick a bag on him.
What do you expect from Jamo in his current form when Minson goes down to play FF.
Are you with me? I'm not confident in Jamison any more. Too many mistakes. Liability.

Unfortunately we don't have much choice. SOS has retired...long long time ago.
TBird use to do it when we had no other choice. Jamo is looking like TBird did in the past.
Austin is no FB. Bower is an attacking HB. Setanta is playing forward...not much choice for FB I'm afraid.
Hence why White is being considered in discussionas a possibile look in.
Jamo needs to get out of his slump and lift.

Keep up the Bluebagger spirit, but...
Please do not use the word 'retarded' when describing anyone.
It is highly offensive and unecessary.
It's been on my mind since I read this post last night.
Do you understand?
Do you know anyone with Down Syndrome?

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 9:52 am 
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Horrie Clover

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Outs:
Thornton- not needed
Joseph- He too often gets lost in the D50, he has lost his midfield tagging job to Carrots & doesnt do enough anywhere else to warrant selection
Setants-needs to find form, cant keep carrying him, his past 4-5 games have been well below par

In:
Bower
Lucas
Wiggins or Fisher- whoever performs today


Wouldn mind seein Kerr have a crack, not dominatin in the Ants but sounds like he has the composure, skill & decision making abilities of a veteran

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:12 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Blueboy_Dan wrote:
Kaptain Kouta wrote:
A little worried about this match, now that the Dogs lost, and by a close margin afterhaving more scoring shots. Will definitely be out to make amends.

We'd better be switched on for dour quarters or we're in trouble.


Oh dont worry we will play dour quarters of football :grin:


:lol: :lol: :lol:

We're not St Kilda or Sydney, we may be slow and negative at times, but I wouldn't go as far as dour.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:36 am 
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Geoff Southby
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If the upset masses all cry something in unison it doesn't make it correct or representative.

Jamison made a few mistakes, but the whole game was one of mistakes. Russell made some obvious mistakes but he's not up for demotion (although the same Pros and Cons thread has it in for him). Jamison didnt have a natural matchup and perhaps underestimated Cornelius in a couple of those one on ones or pack marks.

Suggesting he's on the outer or up for demotion is plain wrong. One of the first picked each week, one of the best players on the list and one player not considered for demotion by the MC this week. Hall will be a good match up for him and looking forward to it.

Jamison is more in the Presti mould with his stats - <10 per game - and I think is trying to do something about it by playing on and making position (much like AJ is). Id say its a team instruction because there is wide recognition now we need more polish in defence. He plays his 50th in 2 weeks time so at this level he is still on a learning curve in some aspects of the game, but he is miles ahead of any other player on the list for deep in defence. Miles ahead. EVen if he makes a mistake or two.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:41 am 
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Vale 1953-2020
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molsey wrote:
If the upset masses all cry something in unison it doesn't make it correct or representative.

Jamison made a few mistakes, but the whole game was one of mistakes. Russell made some obvious mistakes but he's not up for demotion (although the same Pros and Cons thread has it in for him). Jamison didnt have a natural matchup and perhaps underestimated Cornelius in a couple of those one on ones or pack marks.

Suggesting he's on the outer or up for demotion is plain wrong. One of the first picked each week, one of the best players on the list and one player not considered for demotion by the MC this week. Hall will be a good match up for him and looking forward to it.

Jamison is more in the Presti mould with his stats - <10 per game - and I think is trying to do something about it by playing on and making position (much like AJ is). Id say its a team instruction because there is wide recognition now we need more polish in defence. He plays his 50th in 2 weeks time so at this level he is still on a learning curve in some aspects of the game, but he is miles ahead of any other player on the list for deep in defence. Miles ahead. EVen if he makes a mistake or two.


Right on!!!!

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 12:52 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

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molsey wrote:
If the upset masses all cry something in unison it doesn't make it correct or representative.

But that doesn't make it incorrect. There must be something seen that was not of the standard expected. I for one saw 5 mistakes made by him in the 1st. And some of the frees he gives away are ddead set stupid and unnecessary...this season.The media were questioning his output after the last round.

Jamison made a few mistakes, but the whole game was one of mistakes.


The game did not make Jamison's mistakes, Jamison did. He needs to take responsibility for those mistakes, and you don't need to make excuses for him. They were mistakes that he is making on a regular basis. I'm pointing that out. He is not a protected species AFAIC

Russell made some obvious mistakes but he's not up for demotion (although the same Pros and Cons thread has it in for him).

The discussion here is on Jamison. Don't worry about deflecting. Jamison needs to iron out some of his issues imo without having to worry about Russell.

Jamison didnt have a natural matchup and perhaps underestimated Cornelius in a couple of those one on ones or pack marks.

What are you saying Molsey? Other than you making excuses for Jamo, I don't get it.

Is the fact that he underestimated his opponent perhaps the root of his problems?
Does the problem become a non issue because Jamo chose to underestimate him?
What's this about 'natural' match up? Is this your term or have I missed something in one of Ralph's HUN articles?

It is well know amongst Carlton people and the broader football community that Jamo (and Bower, and supposedly TBird) can play on both talls and smalls, kids and veterans. Are you making excuses for him? Get real Molsey.
He didn't match up for the match. He is out of form. His output was finally (hooray) qusetioned last week with his 5 possessions and ridiculous handball to Russell....it's not just this week. Like I said, lets focus on Jamo and his output this last month


Suggesting he's on the outer or up for demotion is plain wrong.

I'm not sure where you got that from. Is this another diversion from the issue? Are you referring to Psych's team? I'm not. The reason alternatives are discussed just proved one thing: there are no alternatives and that it is important that Jamo lifts his output and improves on his current form.

One of the first picked each week, one of the best players on the list and one player not considered for demotion by the MC this week.

We all know that. We also know how important he is for this spot in the team. When in form he gives us stability and structure. When he is out of form, getting beaten and giving away undisciplined frees it unsettles the team. We know he wont be demoted. Who will take his place? Get it? It doesn't imply that there isn't room for improvement.

Hall will be a good match up for him and looking forward to it.

It should be a good clash or a bath. Early this year many of us were expecting Jamo to finally be recognised as one of the top3 FB's in the comp, and that puts him in AA contention. You can't tell me that he is travelling at these lofty heights at present. He is nowhere near his earlier AA form. Agree?

Jamison is more in the Presti mould with his stats - <10 per game -

That's your expectation. I've seen Jamo do better than that.

...and I think is trying to do something about it by playing on and making position (much like AJ is).

I wonder why? Because it's not good enough. There's room for improvement. Agree?

Id say its a team instruction because there is wide recognition now we need more polish in defence.

Someone agrees that there's a need for improvement...and obviously he has shown the potential in the past, so he does have it in him. Hence the AA comments.

He plays his 50th in 2 weeks time so at this level he is still on a learning curve in some aspects of the game, but he is miles ahead of any other player on the list for deep in defence. Miles ahead. EVen if he makes a mistake or two.

or 3 or 4 or 5...look Molsey, he's making plenty more mistakes than you are suggesting. He is miles ahead of any player on our list. That's because there is no one on our list who could do the job he does. That's why it's is vital that he gets back to the form he has displayed in the past, because its a damn better sight than the Jamo of the last month.




I'm a fan of Jamos. I'm disappointed and have been disappointed in his efforts over the last month.
I know Pych has him demoted on his team, by White.
Interesting that it's White who was plucked from obscurity (just like Jamison was from Nth Ballarat as a rookie) who is earmarked as his natural replacement if Jamo's shoulders break down.
But FFS, the guy isn't immuned for criticism. I'm not living in denial. He's just out of form. That's all.

If you wish to cut him some slack and accept a few mistakes that's cool, but that's not the same Jamo I have learned to admire.
I prefer to question his efforts and output when he is down. I know what I expect of him and it isn't unreasonable.
He will react from the truth and his failures if they a known to him, or he can take things for granted because people choose to protect him from any criticism.

I expect him to beat kids. I expect him to show maturity (because he is mature and intelligent) and not give away undisciplined frees and 50's. If every one follows that rule we will be much better off. It was a theme after the game. Lets look at him: he is a leader after all.

He's an integral cog in the team. He needs to lift for the team. That's all.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 2:39 pm 
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John James

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Having watch the Dogs / Hawks game last night I'm a bit worried.

At present the Blues are not playing with the same intensity that last nights game was played at.

However lets hope the Dogs will be a little drained after that match. I noticed Minson was limping pretty badly and Johnson was also.

I'm interested to see how Judd pulled up after Thurs night. I think he hurt a shoulder :sad:

Here's hoping Bower is finally right to go. He's one of our best backs.

And lay off Jamo. He's got that many points in the bank it's not funny....

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 2:40 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

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Agro jr wrote:
Pretty sure that Lake will get a few weeks for his last quarter snipe on Franklin.

He should get a week and was lucky not to give away a 2nd goal.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 6:19 pm 
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Harry Vallence

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Extremely confident this week..the Dogs are our bitches :thumbsup:

Have a feeling the Dogs would like to play Lake fwd for a whole game....this could be the week.
Hope it happens as our blokes will run riot.!

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 6:38 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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No team plays us back into form like the Dogs :thumbsup:

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 6:47 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Elusive Turtle wrote:
Outs:
Thornton- not needed
Joseph- He too often gets lost in the D50, he has lost his midfield tagging job to Carrots & doesnt do enough anywhere else to warrant selection
Setants-needs to find form, cant keep carrying him, his past 4-5 games have been well below par

In:
Bower
Lucas
Wiggins or Fisher- whoever performs today


Wouldn mind seein Kerr have a crack, not dominatin in the Ants but sounds like he has the composure, skill & decision making abilities of a veteran


Couldn't agree more with your outs...Thornton is too static and upsets the whole Ratts game plan of run from the back....and his attitude is and has always been negative..Bower for Thornton and I was surprised Lucas was dropped in the first place so he must come back in for AJ IMO he has been appalling the last few weeks... the Irishman well what can one say I have watched him closely the last month and he really is in the top 5 all time worst footballers I have ever witnessed...here I am talking football ability and smarts...he has none of these traits and only brings passion to the table...reckon Fish or Austin must be able to offer more surely...

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 6:54 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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I'm still convinced that our forward line functions better with Setanta and Hendo together.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 7:43 pm 
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Harry Vallence

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Bulldogs have only beaten us twice since late 2002.

Not since July 2006


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 10:35 pm 
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Horrie Clover
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ryan2000 wrote:
Blueboy74 wrote:
Why do we seem to be getting criticised more than Brisbane after last night?

Injuries? Bower, Kruezer, Waite, Mclean + Judd/Gibbs with ankle problems and others who will be better for the run.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/w ... 5886932390

One minute, we cant beat ordinary sides, now we are flat track bullies!



Jon Ralph is a knob (just ask Andrew Bogut)

This...........
Quote:
The suspicion is that Carlton can throw around weaklings like Melbourne, West Coast and Brisbane, from where its taken its only three wins of the past six weeks.

Sorry.......... who was the last team to beat Geelong twice in a row? And while your answering that........when was the last time a team beat both Geelong and StKilda in the same year?

And This..............

Quote:
Then the predictable happened. The young Lions ran out of puff.

Ummmm.......... Raplhy you Git........ If you bothered to do your research, you'll see that the 'Young Lions' had the same avereaged aged team as we do...........


Look, I aggree we need some work............... But that piece of so-called journalism was written for one reason only.............. Jon Ralph wanted a contriversial piece that gets attention JUST to sell papers.


Sad thing is............. It worked........

Funny thing is........... More people now know that he's a knob!



PS. Hi Ralphy............ I know your reading this......................


You're right, a total fluff article - but if he were to be reading this, he could be just as critical of your spelling and grammar :donk: :razz:

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:56 pm 
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Garry Crane
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ive been goin to all our games
i just think jammo is getn harshly judged
against brisbane it wasnt his night
apart of that was lack of midfeild pressure
he usualy has great closing speed
number 1 in comp for spoils
has not even played 50 games yet!!!
last time he got injured our backline fell in a heap

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 1:04 am 
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The standard of the Hawks-Dogs match was at so much a higher standard than the Blues - Lions game and it was played in worse conditions.

Unfortunately I think we will cop a beating.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 2:58 am 
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Harry Vallence
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Juddment Day wrote:
ive been goin to all our games
i just think jammo is getn harshly judged
against brisbane it wasnt his night
apart of that was lack of midfeild pressure
he usualy has great closing speed
number 1 in comp for spoils
has not even played 50 games yet!!!
last time he got injured our backline fell in a heap



I agree with both sides of the argument.
Jamo has been struggling but is absolutely vital as our "ROCK'.

His first quarter on Thursday was woeful, not only being beaten by his opponent but also his disposal.
If you watch the replay; i think you'll see he got a little better each quarter.

His last 10 minutes were back to his best.
He attacked the ball, dummied an opponent and hit up a great pass.
I think he's back!!

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 7:58 am 
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Craig Bradley

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There's no way Griffen should be playing next week, shoulder to the head of Mitchell in the second quarter should put paid to that.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 12:00 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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In - Bower Lucas
Out - Thornton Joesph

I believe White had the flu and that is why he didnt play for the bullants yesterday. If he had played then i think he would have come in for strong debate about his inclusion for this game.

Joesph has been ordinary all year and he must be one of Rattens pets to be still in the side given there are other's in the bullants who surely warrent selection before he does.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 12:07 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

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choo wrote:

I agree with both sides of the argument.
Jamo has been struggling but is absolutely vital as our "ROCK'.

His first quarter on Thursday was woeful, not only being beaten by his opponent but also his disposal.
If you watch the replay; i think you'll see he got a little better each quarter.

His last 10 minutes were back to his best.
He attacked the ball, dummied an opponent and hit up a great pass.
I think he's back!!


I've looked at the game a few times and I also did note that in the last 10 minutes of the game Jamo really stepped up.
He did attack, dummy and pass well. He looked like he knew he had to make amends. I hope he turned the corner.
I like that kind of urgency.

His 1stQ was ordinary. I think we all agree on that.
In the 2nd Q there was 2 times his kicks didn't make the mark: one out of bounds (missed Judd by 20m) and the other right into the hands of the Brizzy player. Really bad disposal and lacking confidence, timing....something was amiss.
The 3rdQ he did nothing, and then we overran them. I think Brizzy tired in the last.
Without a doubt, Jammo will be one of the first pencilled in.

So there's a good chance Minson, Johnson and Reid are out injured this week. Big chance of that.
There's talk of Lake being reported for striking in the last few minutes. I didn't think much of the hit. Doubt he will miss.
I'm hoping Griffin is injured too.

With Freo 2 games and % ahead and only 8 rounds to go, I think the final 4 is settled, unless the round 22 decides that for us.
If North lose today (and they should), we have 3 Vic clubs fighting for the last 4 spots (Blues, Dogs, Hawks) and Sydney playing for a home final against 1 of those 3.
We have to win this one if our Final 4 aspirationa are to stay alive, otherwise Freo will be 3 games ahead of us after the next round.

Really hope to see Bower back to bolster the back six and increase our run from there.
Really should have Lucas in the firsts...someone has to make room...it should be Grigg imo.

I don't know what we should do about Setanta. He's clearly lacking touch, but he might be playing a role for the coach.
Fisher for Setanta? Fisher kicked 4 goals in the Ants. Against the fast moving Doggies Fisher's lack of pace will be a liability imo.
There's no one to replace Setanta. Waite is still out.
If Hammer was to be the tall KPF instead, it implies Warnock would come in the take the 2nd ruck position. I don't see that happening.

We've got to win the keep our finals campaign alive....same goes with the Doggies.

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