with no resolution on Duigan.....might be that we are forced to use 51 on Tippett, Thorpe or Cornelius?

Who the @#$%&! is responsible for list management.

we are a shambles.

I am only going by what others have said that Duigan is contracted so can delist him

we can delist anyone who's contracted, just have to pay them out.

the galling thing is that two years running we've had a number of fringe players who we couldn't offload and ended having to retain them.

You can only assume that we are really tight on the salary cap which is laughable.

in a way i'm hoping GWS pick up scotland and we are forced to draft another kid.

for all malty's huff and puff about rebuilding via the draft and we are going to have the only 3 picks.


They better nail those picks.

Again with Lucas.

Lucas played 17 games last season. McInnes 8, Duigan 5, Ellard 3.

I can't understand why he continues to be grouped with blokes who hardly get a game.

Nope. That was a temporary measure as a concession through the initial years of GWS & GC due to the litany of picks they had.

I believe (though I have not been able to confirm) that this is the case with the third year rookie system. If anyone knows of an example of a 3rd year rookie on a list this year or last that didn't involve a re-drafting process, let me know!

So with two rookie elevations and assuming no more delistings, we have a full senior list for next year.

_________________
29 different attributes,
And only 7 that you like;
20 ways to see the world,
Or 20 ways to start a fight.

35 on the primary list by my count

02. Troy Menzel 22/9/94 (2012 ND#11)
32. Nicholas Graham 12/6/94 (2012 ND#54)
18. Tom Temay 6/2/94 (2012 ND#35)
15. Sam Docherty 17/10/93 (2011 ND#12 Bris, 2013 Tr.P)
07. Dylan Buckley 16/3/93 (2011 ND F/S #62)
21. Joshua Bootsma 22/2/93 (2011 ND#22)
10. Matthew Watson 16/7/92 (2010 ND#18)
26. Andrew McInnes 20/3/92 (2010 ND#67)
09. Kane Lucas 26/6/91 (2009 ND#12)
28. Tom Bell 13/6/91 (2011 RD#14, 2013 ND#??)
13. Chris Yarran 19/12/90 (2008 ND#6)
41. Levi Casboult 15/3/90 (2009 RD#44, 2012 ND #89)
23. Lachlan Henderson 14/12/89 (2007 ND #8 Bris, 2009 Tr. P)
42. Zach Tuohy 10/12/89 (2009 RD#73, 2012 ND#102)
35. Edward Curnow 7/11/89 (2010 RD#18, 2013 ND#??)
38. Jeff Garlett 3/8/89 (2008 RD#6, 2010 ND#85)
12. Mitch Robinson 7/6/89 (2008 ND#40)
08. Matthew Kreuzer 13/5/89 (2007 ND PP #1)
04. Bryce Gibbs 15/3/89 (2006 ND #1)
46. David Ellard 13/3/89 (2007 RD #34, 2010 ND#99)
33. Andrejs Everitt 13/3/89 (2006 ND#11, 2010 Tr.P, 2013 Tr.P)
43. Simon White 17/6/88 (2009 RD#56, 2010 ND#108)
03. Marc Murphy 19/7/87 (2005 ND PP #1)
39. Dale Thomas 21/6/87 (2005 ND #2, 2013 FA)
11. Robert Warnock 19/1/87 (2005 ND #42 Fre, 2008 Tr. P)
17. Sam Rowe 19/11/87 (2011 ND#44)
27. Dennis Armfield 22/12/86 (2007 ND #46)
40. Michael Jamison 11/6/86 (2006 RD #17)
01. Andrew Walker 18/5/86 (2003 ND PP #2)
14. Brock McLean 11/3/86 (2003 ND #5 Mel, 2009 Tr. P)
34. Nick Duigan 7/9/84 (2010 ND#70)
06. Kade Simpson 5/5/84 (2002 ND #45)
44. Andrew Carrazzo 15/12/83 (2001 RD #5 Geel, 2003 RD #2)
05. Chris Judd 8/9/83 (2001 ND PP #3 WCE, 2007 Tr. P)
30. Jarrad Waite 4/2/83 (2001 ND F/S #46)

I thought we would've been able to pay him the same whether he was on the rookie list or senior list. Being on the rookie list doesn't necessarily mean a pay cut. Wasn't bell on a higher salary than the rookie scale this year?

_________________
@cecil_anderson

Cant clubs have different combinations of senior/rookie numbers? I thought they could have 38/6, 39/5 or 40/4.
Can anyone confirm this?

I was sure that the rookie elevations count as some of the compulsory 3 ND picks, they are read out on draft day and use a pick.
Someone will clarify this.

Rubbish.
If Duigan has a contract, he receives the same money regardless of whether he's on the senior list or the rookie list.
The only difference is if he is on the rookie list, only half his salary counts in the cap.

Haven't the Crows already said they're using just the two picks in this years draft? Elevating Laird and Hartigan?

Crows List Manager David Noble said


http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-10-30/t ... ikely-over

Yes, you can have any of those combinations.
All signs are that we will again have a 38/6 split for 2014, and will therefore use 3 National Draft picks and 4 Rookie picks.

You don't need to re-draft a rookie going onto their 3rd year on the list. After 3 years as a rookie, you must elevate them or delist.

Rookie elevations used to be able to count as (a maximum) 1 of your minimum 3 draft picks.
This may possibly have changed this year to be able to count as more than 1, because the actual rule seems to be poorly written.

Duigan's another one we signed up in case he got poached

_________________
"I had to eat"

This is a part of the old Veteran's list system, which is currently being phased out. That has since been replaced with the nominated rookie system which allows for 2 rookie elevations in pre-season on a list of 38, with another elevation after round 11 up until the Tuesday before the final round of the season.


These were concessions during the initial drafts for GC & GWS:

Clubs could nominate 3rd year rookies, and clubs could burn one compulsory ND pick on a rookie elevation. It would seem the former has been retained but the latter was moved on once those drafts were complete, or so I thought:


The fact that this shit is not written down publicly and never @#$%&! adhered to when implemented as a temporary concession is very frustrating when following it as a fan of the code.

_________________
29 different attributes,
And only 7 that you like;
20 ways to see the world,
Or 20 ways to start a fight.

This.
The transparency by the AFL (and to a lesser extent the Clubs) in regards to draft and list rules is flower hopeless.

Here is the best source I can find on the state of rookies & nominated rookies (specifically page 11):

http://www.nabafldraftnom.com.au/images ... 202013.pdf


This is an informative statement, not the actual listing rules. The only time I have seen the rookie listing rules from an official AFL source, it has mentioned that you can only retain 2 first-year rookies for a second year and 1 second-year rookie for a third year in a given off-season.

Whether that is still true or not, I don't know, but there has been no information publicly disseminated regarding this.


This kind of matches up with what you were saying regarding additional rookie list positions if you forego the additional 2 senior list positions.

They need to do away with all of this, set it to a maximum of 48 on the senior list, with no minimum number so clubs can structure salaries fairly and allow for opportunities to develop raw talent on the senior list. No more cap umbrellas and hidey holes, just adjust the TPP to reflect averages and scale the minimum payments to something a little easier on the hip pocket of the smaller clubs.

Maybe 85%?

_________________
29 different attributes,
And only 7 that you like;
20 ways to see the world,
Or 20 ways to start a fight.

I agree with the above to an extent.
Set a List number, currently 44, which doesn't include Irish etc.

Rookies defined by nothing other than being selected in the rookie draft, and therefor receive a 1 year contract as opposed to a minimum 2 years for National Drafted players.

Also, the $112,500 salary cap allowance for Veterans should stay.

I would still have scholarship lists and a development squad, but any player recruited with the intention of them seeing playing time that season form and fitness permitting should be on the senior list.

So 48, then have scholarships and development squads for the category B & long shot international types. The veteran payments reward teams for having an aging list, which is completely arse backwards. If it's going to be retained as a reward for showing player loyalty, then it needs to be toned down further. For the average veteran that's a 20-30% exemption on their salary, which is more often than not is just going to get tacked on to ensure they stay with the club.

$110k per 10 year player is silly.

_________________
29 different attributes,
And only 7 that you like;
20 ways to see the world,
Or 20 ways to start a fight.