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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 12:37 am 
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Ken Hunter
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Posts: 12528
Location: Brisbane
Bring back Brittain.

Seriously.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:28 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Location: In the box.
Cretylus wrote:
AGRO wrote:
DocSherrin wrote:
Cretylus wrote:
Director of Coaching and Development - the most critical role at the club

previous Experience in the role?


Disagree with this one. Few more worrying roles held at the club before I get to Wiley.

Image



Guy in back row on the right touted as one of the best match day tacticians in the AFL, little evidence of that last night.


Depends on whether Mick was listening to any suggestions Laidley was making (if any)

If you recall, in the 2011 grand final Mick sat in the box like a stunned mullet with Didak on Scarlett all day and crucifying Reid on Hawkins....Geelong couldn't believe their luck in the second half.

People must understand if you lay blame solely on the President, for the clubs condition, then you must also lay blame on Wiley for the performance of the coaches and the quality of our development. You must also lay blame on MM for what the players dish up when they run out to play.

As we all know, its not as simple as that.

I tend to look at the players who run out onto the ground - their leadership, their mental toughness, their pride in performing to their highest abilities, their devotion to team goals.,... etc.. etc

Now the club cultures extends past the playing group dynamics - but if the playing group is dysfunctional, no other club strength can compensate for this short fall.

Recruit the right players first - character, mental strength, motivation, etc.,, comes first - just like Geelong and the Swans do it.

Selwood and McVeigh eat footballs for breakfast, Murph likes wearing suits, (and I am a fan of Murphy)



Ridiculous!!! :screwy:

You blame the president and board for the appointment of the CEO and in conjunction with the board for appointments of the coach.. and every other position....
Thats how it works.. you dont blame Wiley because he cant coach... he never hired himself. Neither did Malthouse.. and actually the other piece of that puzzle is McKay.
One thing i find fascinating Cretylus is the sheer refusal to blame anyone Carlton for the state of the Carlton footy club... its always someone else who we blame for us.
Our problems begin with the people at Carlton who dont have the answers and fixatedly found Collingwood people to fix them.
This is what people so stupidly sidestep.
Sticks is president of our board of directors.. and as a board of directors they are charged to direct this footy club.
The rest is idiotic!!!...
Originally they empowered a pretty stupid coach with hardly any experience to coach because Brown said "Ratts can coach this team with his eyes closed". Thats when they should have appointed better.. then they panicked and had no time to find another rookie coach... or take a chance.. the clock was ticking and they had already wasted FIVE YEARS.
So they brought in a premiership coach... the problem is they have not invested any more money (because they dont have it ) on other coaches.
He wanted OBree.. we didnt pay him enough
He wanted Ling... we didnt pay him enough too...
He wanted McLeod.. McLeod didnt believe the money warranted him moving here.
The Director of coaching isnt Malthouses doing.. we also had part time coaches who were teaches in charge of our VFL kids the year before.

Its about structures.. the pyramid.. were trying to make it stand up with the single top block.Its all over the club... ive been in a situation were ive seen the club closer up than most people.. as have you.
Seeing our club close up.. talking to coaches and presidents over the last 12 years has been scary.
In fact i think Denis has been one of the most intelligent ones.. certainly more so than speaking to Ratts who was straight up meat and potatos.. you were there and you were shocked as well.
Smorgon didnt understand footy and had a tight arsed approach to this club that was about evolving through AFL hand outs.
Sticks is plain old dumb also.Hes the guy you find in the pub
Collo was by far the more intelligent and worldly than them all but he was dull... though he was also funny if you knew him personally.

The board members? They have been a bunch of self serving individuals with little backbone all wanting to be part of the club but offering very little.
Ive met a few over the years.. some would even approach me on opinions.. :screwy: :yikes:
The closer i got to the club the more i realised were [REDACTED] and i was much better off never having gone anywhere near it .. and just sticking to game day .

Knowing who is running our football club from close up over the last decade has depressed me. When i meet most .. not just coaches or board members or presidents .. i like to ask them questions to get some feedback on their philosophies. ...

Very few had a philosophy... Denis did....Sticks didnt... Ratts didnt...
You saw the depth of Ratten yourself as did the Princes Park Whistler... he was in charge of our team for 5 years... and its not like he didnt wanna answer questions..he was enjoying the questions.. we just cringed at the answers....
He was obsessed with defenders (not defence)...Fevola and statistics.
His judgement on the players who he believed would be All Australians are no longer at the club.
He rattled of statistic after statistic off the top of his head.

Ive had 3 very scary moments over the years.
1)Talking to Marcus Rose
2) Ratts
3) Knowing Sticks is president

There are others too.. but if Carlton was a Black forest cake i was eating.. these three things are the sour cherries on my cake.

Now thats not to say that esteemed people from other clubs have not said bizarro stuff to me.... they have...

and thats why i think footy clubs are dumb and you can easily improve a club if you raised professionalism and cut out the mates and the boys

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:40 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 33188
Location: In the box.
BTW i also kind of knew Jack a bit.. been to luncheons with him and spoke footy with him over reds a number of times.
I dont think anybody that has anything to do with the Carlton footy club was as intellectual as jack or as passionate about footy and carlton in a bright sense.The guy understood everything.. super smart mind... but lost the plot in the end.He was having some personal problems and Carlton was his escape.
But as a sheer footy braniac nobody came close to jack. Interesting , flamboyant , bombastic and larger than life.

Now we have dull and unintelligent
Coupling him and Wes.. was brilliant.. they complimented each other and for a while the club ran well.
They were unwilling to bend with the times and re constitute themselves and the club

But the current people lack imagination.. they lack endeavour.. theyre not bold... they have no charisma... and theyre dulll

They reflect us and what we are today

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:44 am 
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Adrian Gallagher

Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:16 pm
Posts: 81
Synbad wrote:
Cretylus wrote:
AGRO wrote:
DocSherrin wrote:
Cretylus wrote:
Director of Coaching and Development - the most critical role at the club

previous Experience in the role?


Disagree with this one. Few more worrying roles held at the club before I get to Wiley.

Image



Guy in back row on the right touted as one of the best match day tacticians in the AFL, little evidence of that last night.


Depends on whether Mick was listening to any suggestions Laidley was making (if any)

If you recall, in the 2011 grand final Mick sat in the box like a stunned mullet with Didak on Scarlett all day and crucifying Reid on Hawkins....Geelong couldn't believe their luck in the second half.

People must understand if you lay blame solely on the President, for the clubs condition, then you must also lay blame on Wiley for the performance of the coaches and the quality of our development. You must also lay blame on MM for what the players dish up when they run out to play.

As we all know, its not as simple as that.

I tend to look at the players who run out onto the ground - their leadership, their mental toughness, their pride in performing to their highest abilities, their devotion to team goals.,... etc.. etc

Now the club cultures extends past the playing group dynamics - but if the playing group is dysfunctional, no other club strength can compensate for this short fall.

Recruit the right players first - character, mental strength, motivation, etc.,, comes first - just like Geelong and the Swans do it.

Selwood and McVeigh eat footballs for breakfast, Murph likes wearing suits, (and I am a fan of Murphy)



Ridiculous!!! :screwy:

You blame the president and board for the appointment of the CEO and in conjunction with the board for appointments of the coach.. and every other position....
Thats how it works.. you dont blame Wiley because he cant coach... he never hired himself. Neither did Malthouse.. and actually the other piece of that puzzle is McKay.
One thing i find fascinating Cretylus is the sheer refusal to blame anyone Carlton for the state of the Carlton footy club... its always someone else who we blame for us.
Our problems begin with the people at Carlton who dont have the answers and fixatedly found Collingwood people to fix them.
This is what people so stupidly sidestep.
Sticks is president of our board of directors.. and as a board of directors they are charged to direct this footy club.
The rest is idiotic!!!...
Originally they empowered a pretty stupid coach with hardly any experience to coach because Brown said "Ratts can coach this team with his eyes closed". Thats when they should have appointed better.. then they panicked and had no time to find another rookie coach... or take a chance.. the clock was ticking and they had already wasted FIVE YEARS.
So they brought in a premiership coach... the problem is they have not invested any more money (because they dont have it ) on other coaches.
He wanted OBree.. we didnt pay him enough
He wanted Ling... we didnt pay him enough too...
He wanted McLeod.. McLeod didnt believe the money warranted him moving here.
The Director of coaching isnt Malthouses doing.. we also had part time coaches who were teaches in charge of our VFL kids the year before.

Its about structures.. the pyramid.. were trying to make it stand up with the single top block.Its all over the club... ive been in a situation were ive seen the club closer up than most people.. as have you.
Seeing our club close up.. talking to coaches and presidents over the last 12 years has been scary.
In fact i think Denis has been one of the most intelligent ones.. certainly more so than speaking to Ratts who was straight up meat and potatos.. you were there and you were shocked as well.
Smorgon didnt understand footy and had a tight arsed approach to this club that was about evolving through AFL hand outs.
Sticks is plain old dumb also.Hes the guy you find in the pub
Collo was by far the more intelligent and worldly than them all but he was dull... though he was also funny if you knew him personally.

The board members? They have been a bunch of self serving individuals with little backbone all wanting to be part of the club but offering very little.
Ive met a few over the years.. some would even approach me on opinions.. :screwy: :yikes:
The closer i got to the club the more i realised were [REDACTED] and i was much better off never having gone anywhere near it .. and just sticking to game day .

Knowing who is running our football club from close up over the last decade has depressed me. When i meet most .. not just coaches or board members or presidents .. i like to ask them questions to get some feedback on their philosophies. ...

Very few had a philosophy... Denis did....Sticks didnt... Ratts didnt...
You saw the depth of Ratten yourself as did the Princes Park Whistler... he was in charge of our team for 5 years... and its not like he didnt wanna answer questions..he was enjoying the questions.. we just cringed at the answers....
He was obsessed with defenders (not defence)...Fevola and statistics.
His judgement on the players who he believed would be All Australians are no longer at the club.
He rattled of statistic after statistic off the top of his head.

Ive had 3 very scary moments over the years.
1)Talking to Marcus Rose
2) Ratts
3) Knowing Sticks is president

There are others too.. but if Carlton was a Black forest cake i was eating.. these three things are the sour cherries on my cake.

Now thats not to say that esteemed people from other clubs have not said bizarro stuff to me.... they have...

and thats why i think footy clubs are dumb and you can easily improve a club if you raised professionalism and cut out the mates and the boys


Bravo- well said. Never a truer word spoken, especially the last bit! :thumbsup:


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:45 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 33188
Location: In the box.
because theyre intelectual pygmies.. themselves
they see collingwood as giants and theyre jealous.
so they have looked to collingwood for the answers we dont have

we want to be collingwood...

Collingwood is who we are ... and wish to be.

Thats not Collingwoods fault... :roll:

That has happened because we dont have our own ideas.. because of the people I KNOW that are around our footy club.

people think i get stuck into them for some kind of agenda.
ive met these people.. or alot of them.... thats why i know theyre no good!!

jellyfish
no imagination
no intellect
never read a real book
selfish
dreamers
bogans

when it comes to football and the afl thats who we have running the club.... is there any wonder we look to collingwood for answers???

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:18 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 2:37 pm
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Location: afl.virtualsports.com.au
Does this: http://www.afr.com/p/national/boards_sh ... nTgyhfCqIL affect football clubs?

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:22 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:09 pm
Posts: 17218
No


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:15 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 33188
Location: In the box.
Great for the corporate world though...

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 11:03 am 
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Horrie Clover

Joined: Fri Dec 16, 2011 7:27 am
Posts: 308
blues mission statement 2011-2015 http://www.carltonfc.com.au/staticfile/ ... eprint.pdf

How many of these boxes have we managed to tick? I would say very few.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 11:18 am 
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John Nicholls
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:22 pm
Posts: 9603
Location: Beijing
sandramd1967 wrote:
blues mission statement 2011-2015 http://www.carltonfc.com.au/staticfile/ ... eprint.pdf

How many of these boxes have we managed to tick? I would say very few.


Looks all very nice. My experience with Strategic Plans is that they are not worth the paper they are written on unless they actually acted upon. As outsiders we hear the words but as my old school's motto said "deeds not words".

I am more than a little disenchanted with the direction of our club (on and off the field) and do not see much enduring change in terms of our club leading the way in the critical areas as mentioned in the pretty SP. We rely too much on history rather than looking forward.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 11:53 am 
Online
Craig Bradley

Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:36 am
Posts: 6380
We are the old pies.
So what happens if someone like H Mitchell decides to put a ticket together and there the right people to take the club forward.
We have a vote to see which ticket takes over the club

I spoke a fellow Blues supporter who refuses to believe there is a culture problem which stems from board level.

So even if an election was held I reckon not much would change because the general population are as dumb and short sighted as the board.

I pointed out to this bloke how the board sacked Pagan and Ratten after appointing them.

As we know when in 2011 the board had made a Beline for Malthouse without thinking about the other options available. I reckon if you watch the post match coaching press conferences from last weeks contest you can clearly see a coach at the peak of his powers in Hinkley and a old bloke who is clearly passed his best. MM was an embarrassment. This board could have got Hinkley for under half of what we are paying Mick. So flower dumb.

Good luck to MM. His super will be topped up nicely because of the stupidity of the empty suits on the Carlton board
Get Denis
Get Juddy
Get Mick
Guess what. The supporter walked off but as he did said we would win the flag saying I was just being a negative prick

That scares me how dumb people can be

As for big Jack he was the origin of all this mess.
In 1987 when we won number 15 he promised when we won number 16 he would vacate the chair.
Going back on his word cost the club severely.
Elliott is convincing but in the end is full of shit.
Just about every business he has been involved in from Fosters to Rice growing has gone belly up and it has never been his fault. According to him.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 4:15 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:52 pm
Posts: 2044
I think we can turn it around in 3 years and the fact that someone from inside the club can see it round 1 is positive

Put 4 football people and a marketer on the board with 1 seat for Pratt and 1 for Mathieson
(Who is the question because no one puts their hand up)

Swan to go replaced by ?????

Silvagni head of recruiting

Play the kids

Give mick time with a mandate to rebuild.

Give him the coaches he wants including a young one.

Chase KPPs (one or two) and leave the rest to the draft

This is not like 10 years ago. At least the finances, membership and facilities are there and we have a coach that is good enough for the first time. If he is got the energy he can get us to the stage where we are about to challenge.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 4:22 pm 
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formerly BlueRob
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Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 12:45 pm
Posts: 3073
Don't Worry ...

Dr Strangelove knows what he is doing. Old fashioned football and a 10 year contract will get us back on track.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 4:30 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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Posts: 28377
Location: *Currently banned*
Looking like a likely bottom 5 side this year. You'd expect St Kilda and Melbourne to finish below us, but even one of them will be above us at the end of the round. One would think GWS also would finish below us.

Collingwood, Bulldogs, North, Richmond, West Coast, Adelaide. All touch and go as to if we can get ourselves ahead of those guys. Brisbane and Gold Coast?

The rebuild window is beginning to open.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2014 12:47 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:52 pm
Posts: 2044
Synbad if you want blame.
I would replace Sticks, Swann and almost every board member apart from 1 Pratt and 1 Mathieson.
Swann will go anyway

However, nobody has really stood up to want to be president. We have had a power vaccum for 12 years.
Even Ahmed would not commit.
So who are the replacements? (SOS is obvious, Walls, Mclure)


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2014 7:52 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2007 6:36 pm
Posts: 1057
Location: melbourne
we have overrated our list for years..
1. recruitment.
massive concern....
lucas - talia
watson - atley/darling
kreuzer - cotchin
bootsma - kerridge
total overhaul required, common sense..

2. coach and co.
why would your number one play maker be used as a defender???
talking about yarran, its a joke.
don't see jetta or cyril playing that role.
the game plan, kicking it long!!! does it work?? does it suit our players???

3. playing list.
judd, carrazzo, scotland and waite, lucky to have two years left in them.
too many of the same types, slow and average skills,
mclean, bell, curnow, robinson, ellard, rowe, bootsma,
cachia, white, casboult and mcInnes.
how many names above would get a game at a top club, hawks or freo????
key forwards and key defenders, we have two only, jamison and henderson.....
time for the kids to get a run,
menzel {not sub}, buckley, docherty, cripps, temay, giles, holman,
reynolds, graham and johnson.

4. draft/FA/trade week.
james frawley, chase him, simple, he is a key defender and only 26.
reckon we lack,
two key forwards.
another key defender, james frawley would be nice.
mids x 3/4.
use it wisely for a change...

we have a long way to go, we need to give the kids a run, simple.
kicking long around the boundry is working so well for us!!!!!!
lacking skills and running both ways is evident..
fingers crossed that,
cripps, docherty, holman, giles, graham, reynolds, temay and buckley
can make it, or at least a couple can, otherwise its going to be worse..
rebuilding time, lets face it, our window has closed and its now winter time..
just my silly opinion..


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2014 8:02 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 10:24 am
Posts: 40291
Location: seaside
And still..........

no one's asked for a flying car.......!

what's WRONG with you people......!


kindest regards tommi

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2014 8:06 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 10:14 am
Posts: 22357
blueboy23 wrote:
we have overrated our list for years..
1. recruitment.
massive concern....
lucas - talia
watson - atley/darling
kreuzer - cotchin
bootsma - kerridge
total overhaul required, common sense..

2. coach and co.
why would your number one play maker be used as a defender???
talking about yarran, its a joke.
don't see jetta or cyril playing that role.
the game plan, kicking it long!!! does it work?? does it suit our players???

3. playing list.
judd, carrazzo, scotland and waite, lucky to have two years left in them.
too many of the same types, slow and average skills,
mclean, bell, curnow, robinson, ellard, rowe, bootsma,
cachia, white, casboult and mcInnes.
how many names above would get a game at a top club, hawks or freo????
key forwards and key defenders, we have two only, jamison and henderson.....
time for the kids to get a run,
menzel {not sub}, buckley, docherty, cripps, temay, giles, holman,
reynolds, graham and johnson.

4. draft/FA/trade week.
james frawley, chase him, simple, he is a key defender and only 26.
reckon we lack,
two key forwards.
another key defender, james frawley would be nice.
mids x 3/4.
use it wisely for a change...

we have a long way to go, we need to give the kids a run, simple.
kicking long around the boundry is working so well for us!!!!!!
lacking skills and running both ways is evident..
fingers crossed that,
cripps, docherty, holman, giles, graham, reynolds, temay and buckley
can make it, or at least a couple can, otherwise its going to be worse..
rebuilding time, lets face it, our window has closed and its now winter time..
just my silly opinion..


So really the answer is get better players?

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dane's trolling again


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2014 8:17 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 10:04 am
Posts: 28377
Location: *Currently banned*
dane wrote:
blueboy23 wrote:
we have overrated our list for years..
1. recruitment.
massive concern....
lucas - talia
watson - atley/darling
kreuzer - cotchin
bootsma - kerridge
total overhaul required, common sense..

2. coach and co.
why would your number one play maker be used as a defender???
talking about yarran, its a joke.
don't see jetta or cyril playing that role.
the game plan, kicking it long!!! does it work?? does it suit our players???

3. playing list.
judd, carrazzo, scotland and waite, lucky to have two years left in them.
too many of the same types, slow and average skills,
mclean, bell, curnow, robinson, ellard, rowe, bootsma,
cachia, white, casboult and mcInnes.
how many names above would get a game at a top club, hawks or freo????
key forwards and key defenders, we have two only, jamison and henderson.....
time for the kids to get a run,
menzel {not sub}, buckley, docherty, cripps, temay, giles, holman,
reynolds, graham and johnson.

4. draft/FA/trade week.
james frawley, chase him, simple, he is a key defender and only 26.
reckon we lack,
two key forwards.
another key defender, james frawley would be nice.
mids x 3/4.
use it wisely for a change...

we have a long way to go, we need to give the kids a run, simple.
kicking long around the boundry is working so well for us!!!!!!
lacking skills and running both ways is evident..
fingers crossed that,
cripps, docherty, holman, giles, graham, reynolds, temay and buckley
can make it, or at least a couple can, otherwise its going to be worse..
rebuilding time, lets face it, our window has closed and its now winter time..
just my silly opinion..


So really the answer is get better players?


And in the
future
we must try and stay
away from the return
key until the
paragraph is
finished.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2014 9:28 am 
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Bruce Comben
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Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 5:37 pm
Posts: 34
Image


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