To do that you need to supplement a Forward tall with a designated Ruck man (206) and then Kruizer becomes that second roaming tall up forward and alteranting ruck. that would be potent i think

Thats how i would be setting up .

But Kreuze with a licence to do what he ikes.
He doesnt get possies but he does do aot of work that doesnt get stats
crucial work

doesnt need to be in forward line exclusively .. but im sure he can also sneak out the back

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Anyway teams traditionally structure with a couple to 3 talls.. they would be in trouble.. as long as we play out of their hands... and into ours
but need a smart hard workig team

i reckon the play tallls at all costs is silly.. cos most arent cutting it... and i mean across the league... dure they straighten you up... but theyre slow cumbersome on most occasions.. the ball is mostly not in contested situations anymore...

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yeah agreed his greatest asset is that he's a 23ft ruck rover so I agree you use him in a roaming role back center or forward. Allows you to position your designated Ruck-man strategically to suit, helps with fatigue having to get to every ball-up contest and gives tap out and height target advantage over more parts of ground. Smalls and mids work of them both.

be interesting to see what unfolds in next few weeks.

..i can see the merits of dropping a tall, and i agree that it does increase run, and more goals are created these days from fwd pressure and turnovers, vs big fwds kicking bags..

..however, you need 2 talls up fwd, one to be the roaming designated CHF that leads up the the ground, draws a KPD away and becomes a good marking option for the runners off HB.. ..and the other to be a tall FP/Ruck relief that doesn't stray too far from the deep fwd..

..smalls such as Betts, Garlett and Yarran to crumb, be defensive and provide leg speed.. ..a medium such as Walker to play small and tall, provide a heap of run and be a fast leading hit-up target FF style..

..i say no to Krooz being used up fwd, mostly cos he doesn't have actual KPF smarts, his footy nous which he has plenty of is as an onballer, and not a fwd.. ..you let him play on instinct up fwd and he'll run around so much that he'll be spent by the time he needs to play 2nd ruck.. ..you keep him as a more deep fwd, and you negate his biggest strength, which is his ability around the ball..

FF: Betts Walker Hampson
HF: Garlett Henderson Yarran

..i'd set up like that, and rotate mids up fwd with a pick of betts, garlett, yarran and walker..

..krooz to ruck majority of game with hammer giving him a spell.. ..henderson to play the roaming CHF all game..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

yeah definitelly a rob paul to pay peter scenario.
just peter will do more than poor would have done

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..we need balance with our spine, currently our best and most experienced kpps are down back together, and the kpfs have no senior support [as senior as our kpps are]..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

Everyone is focused on our forward pressure or lack of but that is assuming we are defending. The way I see it is we need to attack also and inflict score board pressure.
Yes we need to defend but we need to kick a competitive score to win.
I think we need to realize that we break down at half forward. We don't go deep enough in the first place.
We need a contest and a focal point like Cloke or Riewoldt (a KP) then we needs one or two smalls to crumb off him if the ball hits the deck.
Secondly this then opens up our forward line and we need a lead up forward that starts from the square and crumbing forwards hitting packs and not running back with the flight forced to take one off overhead marks or kick spectacular goals. We can’t do this consistently and we need to play the advantages.
We can’t have player running the length of the field all day every day.This might have some effect in some games but when the season enters its second half or at the end of the game players tier and we are compromised. Even against strong fast non compromising defenders the game plan is flawed.
Thirdly we need our mids and links to learn how to kick to advantage and not bomb blindly or favour the opposition so the ball comes out easily which catches our lazy mids out of position and open our defenders.
We need to attack through the middle of the ground and get deeper so our shots for goal have the greatest percentage of success.
We need 2 talls for that quick centre break or hurried kick either for marking and contesting.
We need tall’s and at least two and possibly a third for pressure games (ie: finals) when the ball is hacked forward and later in the game.
We need tall’s to not only mark the ball but contest and bring the ball down.
Our biggest problem isn’t our tall’s talents at the moment it’s how we structure and deliver the ball in the forward line.

Unfortunately it is in contested situations for us.
We're kicking the ball longer than anyone else in the AFL. Instead of using pace and "run and carry" to retain possession, we're kicking to contests.
Hence we cant drop any talls.

That's the bloody minded stupidity. By all means kick long if you have the weapons to capitalise but if you haven't, you're simply conceding the advantage of hard earned possession.

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

Talls are OK if they lead and the ball goes to them. They aren't so good if they just get shit delivery like ours do.
Hawthorn supporters would disagree with Synbad.
And if we had Buddy and Roughead he'd be singing a different tune.
Or Cox and Natanui and Kennedy.

Our problem is we don't have them so as I wrote elsewhere, we have to adapt the game plan to the list we have.
We also suffer from having smalls who get out marked 80 % of the time the footy goes inside 50 and rebounds as twice the speed because other teams set up for tall forward lines. Then we bomb it long right into their hands (literally).
Our fwds do better when the ball is on the ground in a contested situation, which is the Synbad option. Fair enough. No doubt of that but we have to have someone who can get it there.
I am a believer in two talls but one of them has to be able to mark or bring the ball tot he ground most times and take out a few skittles on the way, preferably. The other should be able to do the same but perhaps be more mobile. I like Hampson as a forward. I am in the minority there I know but MM is in that same minority. He can mark it and he can split the packs. For me he's the stay at home one with Waite(in my dreams) or Henderson or Casboult at CHF.
I also like Walker as a medium forward. He shouldn't fly for absolutely everything though.

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Let slip the Blues of war (with apologies to William Shakespeare) (and Sir Francis Bacon, just in case)

Hmmm. Sounds like something Ratten was doing.

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

Bv are you serious? Lol
Ratts had five years so without a consistent game plan ratten did everything including using a guy that's 172 cm to bomb the ball on his head for years.
What he didn't do I'd identify other forwards and delist his we need today and keep guys we don't need.
Let's give Mick five years and six games to cover all bases and be fair.
Were in this position today because of the clubs stupidity starting from the very top down and including their attention to coaching needs.


Ratten won't ever coach AFL seniors again. There is a reason why clubs wouldn't ever chose him again and we are the only coin that gave him a go for five years and six games..
It's because he was shit.
Maltouse in that time led a team to positions on the ladder they could consistently challenge.
Being stuck with bad habits and Joseph and Davies types and a bunch of half back flankers is hardly what Mick world have enjoyed having inherited.

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He'll be 65 and just coming into his prime.
Masterstroke by the board! Lets see what Parko and Wallsy are doing too.



Very true. And like the saying goes, "the tradition continues..."

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

Fact remains we all knew first five games will be difficult.
One we would like to back ourselves in
Two are flag contenders.
If someone told you prior to the games you'll be up to your neck in those games into time on you'd take that.!
He will get there.!
But I reckon this team won't win a flag now for quite a few years
.
We wasted too much time and need a mini rebuild.

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Agree on the positive to being in the game to the end against 2 flag contenders. Richmond is the one we should have won.

The problem is we should be aiming for top 4 but we're 0-3. Being competitive doesnt get you into finals.

Hoping to see the kinks get ironed out by halfway through the season, our effort being there 100% of the time, and those lazy uninspiring periods of games eradicated.

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"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

..won't get to top 4 without decent spine.. ..spin it any way you want, but it's not just us lacking real quality kpps, we barely have enough to be even decent.. ..and unless we sell the farm to get them, the real avenue is via the draft.. ..which takes time.. ..and more time when we ignore obvious choices..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

Wat about Watson? The 1st pick tall FB/ CHB we drafted?

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..synners..

..i've still got hope/faith.. ..another year or two will confirm one way or another if it's a bust or not.. ..but at the time, he was highly rated, and was the best KPD of the draft [again, at the time].. ..AA CHB if i recall when we drafted him.. ..and a huge glaring hole on our list.. ..we got Hendo in the previous season, and played him all year long at CHF and he settled into the position well for an inexperienced kid kpp..

..as a kid, Watto's superb reading of the play and good judging of the ball in flight enabled him to offset acceleration/agility issues.. ..he had good hands, was decent using his body in a contest [though that could be just him oversizing his juniour peers], and had/has an excellent long range accurate boot.. ..as i mentioned elsewhere, i believe at the time it was a sound selection, only in hindsight do you look at Darling and slap yourself..

..Jamo is a decent FB, though injury prone and lately decision making has become suspect.. ..Hendo i firmly believe could become a top line CHF, has good hands, smart fwd craft and most importantly has the tank and work ethic, which is a huge positive for a CHF..

..it can drive you battly though, if you stop to think that when we traded in Hendo, we could have drafted Talia.. ..we'd have our CHF-CHB taken care of, which may have brought Darling the following year into the equation.. ..who knows.. ..but what i do know, is leaving kpps to later rounds and rookie selections is just hoping more than anything else.. ..we need to top up kpps every couple of years, not leave it until we're desperate and then reach for whoever is there..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

Most of us don't know the details of players and of course there are many that any recruiter would have selected yet prove not to have been the very best choice but I'm not sure if Watson is that category. Having said that, I approved of the selection pre-draft.

Who's to know where to draw the line when it comes to a lack of athleticism? Some players pre-draft are the butt of jokes because of their supposed unsuitability while others are looked at as the next White Hope. It seems to be a fine line, sometimes. Watson also comes across as being a bit 'goofy' when you see him interviewed, which you wouldn't know if you had only seen him play. I don't know if that has anything to do with his playing ability but it might.

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Just because I'm offended, doesn't mean I'm wrong.

..i also think watson needs a consistent opportunity at senior level, i think he'd be one to develop better in the 1's, not sure if ressie level is enough to spark him into action, which unfortunately he seems to require..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..