shit decision, very shit

club is happy to take our money, we get very little in return for that money

we count in the official AFL membership stats

yet we are too insignificant to the club to warrant a vote.

the club is very lucky i have a stupid thing in my head that i want to have my kids as members for life, they were signed up on the day they were both born - so i continue their memberships and along with theirs buy my own.

for no other reason than my own stupidity does the club get these memberships

its no wonder plenty of other interstate members refuse to re-sign

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*(grow - fun - gah)

Yeah but whatabout your whataboutism.

Under the new system, there is no longer a process of having to be "registered" to vote. The new membership application form provides the necessary consent in terms of liability in the event of a winding up (to $50) and once a person pays for their membership or agrees to do so by instalments, that person is a registered member and entitled to vote if they become at least an 11 game member. A direct debit arrangement has been in place for at least the last year so hopefully this will result in a greater number of automatic renewals. Otherwise, it has always been a mystery as to why our membership renewals are so far behind other clubs. Personally, i think there is a view that "all will be right" because we are a wealthy club with many wealthy benefactors - which is far from the case. For some reason, we seem to have many apathetic supporters who don't purchase memberships. I well accept that there are also aggrieved supporters who won't take out membership for principle reasons, such as is the case with some long distance supporters.

Just checked, i got an email too.

Thanks for the clarification

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"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

Its not a mystery mate - the club treats its members and supporters like shit - you shouldnt need me to point out examples of this - there are plenty of obvious ones floating around

the club needs to lift its game if it wants to attract more members and not sit on its hands and blame apathy or a mystery 'all will be right' attitude amongst supporters.

the CFCTV interaction has been a step in the right direction.

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*(grow - fun - gah)

Yeah but whatabout your whataboutism.

Hi Stephen, good to have you back posting.

I must say I use to be Captains Club but found it far to overpriced and lacked any value, particularly when told I had to pay prior to a date to get a scarf, yes a scarf. A scarf may seem a trivial item, but I see that as value, others might see the social club, or reserved seat or the cap as value, bottom line is add value to get more big ticket members if the club wants them.

My recommendation is to drop the prices and bring back real value as opposed to the clubs perceived value of a membership, the club sells on features, sell an experience.

Lets not start on principals either, this forum gives a great view of how the club deals with 'members' money, that needs to change.

and fix the caps

seriously

its such a small thing but the crap quality and fit over the past 5 years speaks volumes towards the 'value' of the membership

they are garbage

improve the membership pack / offering and more members may come

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*(grow - fun - gah)

Yeah but whatabout your whataboutism.

For what it's worth, there either is, or at the very least there is a perception that the club is all about the wealthy benefactors. I've been a member since I was 6 years old, I'm now 46. If I miss out on a seat at an Etihad sell out game or heaven forbid don't get a ticket to our next grand final, no one at Carlton will give a stuff. Right now Carlton is not the appealing proposition it once was - we are getting shown up for success principles by Geelong and Sydney (for crying out loud) I hate our supposed home ground, and I don't like the fact that we don't have a Carlton reserves team. I hate how we allow ourselves to be perceived in the media as tankers (the simple answer to that is to lock some of these journalists in a room and force them to watch all our games from 2002 to 2007 and see how crap we were from round 1 each season!) and how we lose the battle on 3rd party deals of which there are 80 odd, but we only hear about the Judd one. I want us to be professional but proud - defend us, promote us, but with better language and actions than "we are Carlton flower the rest".

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Get comfortable being uncomfortable

Hi Stephen.
I agree with everything Grro has said. About the interstate voting & the stupid ill fitting caps.
Most of all though, your post just affirms what many of us already think or know.
You guys are out of touch. You have no clue why we don't have more members, and worse, that old Carlton arrogance comes through in the way you blame 'apathetic supporters'. Really?
That's no way to talk to the life blood of the club now is it?
If people feel disenfranchised, and excluded, maybe it's because the club gives out the message that only wealthy benefactors are important. We're not apathetic. We follow the club despite its wretched attitude toward it's own members, it's crappy treatment of long term volunteers, and it's own staff.
We overlook the under performing and over serviced board room group, and a president who keeps telling us we've voted him in, when we haven't had a chance to vote for him until now.

You have a lot of work to do, if you want to really make everybody I AM CARLTON. Right now, that slogan is just a joke to many. We used to feel a part of this club. If you need the every day fans, and the Interstaters, then come down off your bloody high horses, get out of the Corporate boxes, and make the regular members feel like it's their club again. for real!!! geez.

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That’s not a political statement — it’s a harsh reality, and we must act,” she said. “He is a clear and present danger to the things that keep us strong and free. I support impeachment.”

Well said bg72

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James Hird and Essendon* FC - #FOREVERDRUGCHEATS

From the membership thread posted by Punter 22

"Interesting comments yesterday from the Hawthorn president on their view of Membership. I am paraphrasing here;

Members ARE the club

Membership is not only about the numbers of members, it is about the experience the club provides to its members

Successful membership promotes a sense of inclusion between club and member

One of their key measurements of success as a club (outside the usual grand final and profit indicators) is a 'sticky' supporter base.

Hawthorn's membership rose 7.4% last year, in a fairly tough economic climate off an already high base."

----------------------

Very good example. Right Values > Right Thoughts > Right Actions > Right Outcomes. Meanwhile the CFC board think we are apathetic and a mystery.

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Scott, things aren't as happy as they used to be down here at the unemployment office. Joblessness is no longer just for Philosophy majors - useful people are starting to feel the pinch.

Can I just say that I think that the "total"membership figures are very rubbery. What counts as a member? I think it can include someone who buys a 2-3 game membership, or even less if interstate. I think it is very open to abuse.

Lets look at some other indicators.

In terms of attendance at home games - Carlton is third on average, behind cwood, and just behind Essendon*. Hawthorn, who supposedly has 60K members, averages only 34K people at home games. If you look at all reg season games - carlton is ahead of hawthorn by over 3000 persons, and richmond by 4000.

Lets look at afl members with club support packages - something that cannot be manipulated - carlton has 7151 of these - this is the 2nd most - it is 500 more than Essendon*, hawthorn only has 3584 and richmond has 4324. This is even though carlton plays a lot of games at etihad.

I really think that clubs manipulate their total membership for marketing reasons, but if someone actually worked out how many real and actual members teams had, rather than token ones - i reckon carlton would be ranked 2 or 3.

The figures above would suggest that there are a lot of people "called" members who dont turn up to a game - do they exist?? who knows!! Whats stopping a sponsor saying instead of giving you 500k, i will buy memberhsip for all my employees so that the club looks more successful and maybe more sponsors will come on board....

Just my two cents.

Well said as always bg72. The club's attitude to supporters is nothing new. We were treated with contempt in the 70s too, it's just that we were a great side as well, and if you really wanted to go to any final, you could always get a standing room ticket back then.

I have just received the a letter from our esteemed president re electing even more people to our board, I thought we were trying to make it smaller? Stephen tells me :
Club revenue has more than doubled - How's our profit and loss statement looking?
Membership at all time high - How does our rate of increase look ag the other big melbourne clubs?
$19m trng facility - Yes that's good
Reduced debt and transformed revenue base - Have we? I thought it was the same old rely on rich supporters model, and isn't our debt still the largest in the AFL?
Increased footy spend - True, but coming from a dismal base, and several million over the last decade has been spent on poor coaching appointments and subsequent sackings and payouts.
Adopted a 5 year plan - So what, does that involve ensuring we make the best appointments, have the best recruiting staff etc, or is it just a few broad platitudes supported by thin air?
Refreshed board members - We haven't refreshed the temporary president and the refreshed board has still blown a mill on appointing and sacking Ratts and his assistants
We have one of the best coaches in the league - Or we have a 60 yr old who has coached one flag in 17 years and is driven by bitterness and avarice. Actually MM can coach but how do we make a comparative judgement when he is the only guy we spoke to?
We have a compelling vision - Really, what does that mean? Does it involve making good decisions and appointments

I have never heard of Joe Abbriano but if the board is telling me not to vote for him, then he sounds like the man for my vote.

You know what, i am going to vote for Joe. Have no clue who he is but want to send a message to the club.
Does anyone know who the mysterious Joe is?

It's not a mystery to me.
Some supporters want to feel included and appreciated. Others are just happy to pay their 100 bucks and go along to the footy. Until we can tap into the requirements of all the supporters and attempt to cater to their requirements, we're behind the 8 ball.
You dont have to meet the expectations of everyone but its negligent not to know their expectations.

Firstly, the club needs to understand that the supporters are not "apathetic". That is an excuse for a board that has failed to put the machinations in place to connect with the latent supporters and convert them into members.
It appears to me that we have a philosophy of replacement instead of renewal. Too many lapsed members are not followed up. Too many lapsed corporate supporters are not followed up. The strength of some of our opponents is they value all their members and make them feel included.
They dont advertise training sessions to see the new coach and finish the session 10 minutes after the advertised time. They dont get security guards to throw members out of training sessions. They set targets and put initiatives in place to achieve them instead of hoping it will happen.
They understand that content supporters equal increased merchandise sales, increased membership and more than often, membership retention.

Our recent 50 thousand supporters goal is a perfect example. Swann made the grand announcement about reaching 50 thousand but what initiatives did we put in place to achieve it? Even on this site many supporters were saying "if we win games, the supporters will come". That's not a plan. That's not an initiative.
Did we follow up lapsed members with phone calls? Several lapsed members I know weren't contacted. You only need 1 supporter out of a couple of hundred to re-sign to make it worthwhile.

Personally, I've previously supported the club in many of their initiatives. Family room, Kouta club, Blue suits, corporate boxes, match day functions for 20-30 people. Especially in the dark years when no-one wanted to know us.
In the past couple of years I've stopped doing it because I'm disappointed with the direction of the club.
If it was my business and a client dropped his annual contribution from 20k+ to $1200.00 per year, I'd want to know why. I'd follow it up and find out how we can offer better service.
I'd be assessing my own performance instead of making excuses about apathy and benefactors. It doesnt happen.

I appreciate the efforts of everyone who has given time to the board. Its a thankless job that eats into the time of people who have families and businesses and have chosen to help the club instead. But that doesnt mean we should accept less than ideal performance. Our board is stale and tired. It needs a huge shake up and infusion of young, energetic people who want to make a difference.
Thats where the apathy exists IMO.

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

If he tells the truth Brett Ratten is the reason why we did not reach the target, well at least that is what the board thinks.
So the initiative has been to replace the coach with someone who might "appeal'' more to the masses.

Stephen, thanks for visiting and clarifying a couple of points here.

As kindly referenced by my two cents, I would love to hear at the AGM a robust plan for driving membership growth and engagement. Or, at the very least that the club has a robust plan in place to drive membership and engagement.

And by "robust" I don't mean

1) "Jeanne Pratt is looking after membership". No Carlton supporter would question the commitment to the club the Pratts have demonstrated over many years in many ways, but how is Jeanne Pratt going to identify and drive a connection between the 'everyday' fan and the club? Where's the professional expertise there?

2) "We have a 5 year plan which says we will have xxxx members in 20xx" - seriously, what does this even mean. When it was released it sounded like a cobbled together list of aspirational targets Coutts, Sticks and co. slapped together at a Mornington Peninsular conference facility. Needless to say we feel well short of the 50k the plan called for last year.

We are getting slaughtered by other clubs in creating an atmosphere where members feel truly valued. We have high attendances yet a disastrous membership level when compared to clubs with a similar support base. I agree with you that it's apathy, but not in the way you suggest. On your logic/supposition, wouldn't it then follow that Collingwood and Hawthorn would have stagnant or declining memberships? We couldn't seriously suggest that any member of those clubs is joining because they believe their club is struggling financially and would struggle without their $130 11 game package. Perhaps, just perhaps more and more supporters of these clubs buy these packages because they feel (or want to feel) a part of a family/army which they value and want to identify with.

In my view the apathy stems from the club being seen as a plaything of various families and factions who will spend whatever it takes to keep their influence. What supporter is going to feel able to, or want to, identify with that? Supporters have a sense of pride in the jumper, memories of past glories, affection for the current group of players, and the intrinsic loyalty all supporters have for their club, but this club has never felt less of a members club than what it does now.

The board need to take some responsibility for this. Successful clubs have small, unified boards who appoint the best operators to senior management positions and then get out of the bloody way. They don't have a billionaire 'getting involved with membership'. They would be appointing qualified, professional people with the sole purpose of figuring out how to put this club back on the map in terms of being a fan friendly club. A club who not only values what the membership brings to the club (ie $$$), but truly wants to give something back to the members and make them feel a part of it. Not lip service, but true engagement. A good place to start might be sticking to an advertised time for training if you are going to invite your members and supporters to the ground.

Anyway that's more than enough from me. I would love to see some truly robust discussion and some evidence that the board is genuinely committed to driving performance in these areas (or at least holding someone accountable for it), but I won't hold my breath. I fear it will be fond farewells and introductions, and all to be wrapped up as soon as possible. Steady as she goes for Sticks' last year and all that.

BV - vigorous co-sign, well said.

Always appreciate your input Stephen, and giving us a window into how things are operating at the top. However, in this paragraph alone you have confirmed what we suspected and dreaded about the competence and attitude of the people in charge of this club.

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