Why would that be on the list manager?

He’s not picking the team. He’s not developing the player.
He found the half backs. He found the senior winger. He added premium mids, then found a couple more for depth.

The coaching panel asked for small forwards. Now they’ve seen the light, dropped the labels & just want ball winners.

I just don’t see how Austin could be doing any better, given the circumstances. Maybe I’m seeing it more clearly as a way too invested onlooker. But, to my eyes, the Jagga pick was the first time he was able to get off the tram tracks.

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"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter" - Winston Churchill.

Austin has followed instructions. Club desired small forwards, wings and attacking HB.

2020 1st rounder got us 25yo running HB Saad and first live pick 31 on small forward Durdin
2021 1st rounder got us 23yo midfielder Cerra and first live pick 27 on small forward Motlop
2022 1st rounder got us a wingman Ollie Hollands, traded for Acres on the other wing, and back up wing Binns, and attacking HB Cowan

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

yeah mate, we are defs looking at this thru two different streams of thought.

my take is: the list manager doesn't leave a 21 year old kid to be getting killed on a defensive wing racking up 16 kays a game? have an older body doing that grunt work, not the kid? remember ollie blasted doc in the early rounds bcos doc never made a marking contest. didn't put his body on the line after ollie had just done it 3 times with repeat efforts?

that really sticks out to me. the kid getting slaughtered while the vet takes the game off.

maybe i'm being too critical of austin, but for me, he has fk'd us pretty hard. like someone said in another thread, we either have one of the league's best spines and mids group all earning a motza, and have surrounded that core with rookie contracts playing on training wheels bcos the core costs us so much.

we don't have much in that 24-28 bracket who are all in their prime on mid contracts all contributing heavily - pies last night have an abundance of. we don't have them bcos we can't afford them. the cream at the top is way too expensive.

... not surprised to read today that wright is going to shop harry or charlie this summer. highest bidder wins, first in first dressed. one goes, one stays and he's not fussed on who stays. you watch him fill that hole with 2 or 3 guys in that age bracket of ready to rock n roll for round 1, 2026.

again, cru... another confirmation our cap is fubar.

Mate, I think the only thing that’s confirmed is that you’re panicking.

37 contracts expiring, this year & next.

I think Bondi has it laid out pretty well, although I’d temper the ‘war chest’ expectations a bit.

Curnow, Cerra, McKay, Weitering contracted 2029 & beyond.
Provisional offers for De Koning & Walsh to join them.
Cripps until 2027.

We’ve got more flexibility than most, but it won’t last.

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"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter" - Winston Churchill.

no, no not panicking. i'm frustrated as, that we are losing, playing like shit and with list full of replication and top loaded contracts, yes. williams on 900k is blowing my mind to pieces.

while our top 6 or 7 earn more than the top 6 or 7 at any other club, the 37 contracts expiring is shuffling the deck chairs, for mine? those 37 will all have to be replaced, which means we'll bring in more of the same old dross.

when our bottom 6 is no longer among the worst in the comp, i'll be a bit more upbeat. and to my eyes the only way that happens is if we move off a big contract and spread that wealth around.

drafting jagga when we could have had 2 or 3 top picks is more of that cfc messiah bs, imo. but i'll let it all go and just watch what happens

Well for starters he has a record of 42-35-1, so he is winning more than he is losing.
While I dislike his need to only make small team variations after a loss, I understand that it is a very measured approach.
He seems to have the players on-board which is his main role, we haven't had too many players wanting to leave because of him, if any that are key players for that matter.
He is respected at the club and in the AFL, he has had premiership success as a player and understands the work and luck to win one.
The biggest hang up most people have of him is he doesn't make enough tactical changes during a game.
While I don't agree with this I also don't disagree.
He has made changes, some have worked and probably more have not.
On the sidelines we all have our opinions but it is he who knows his players best and what they can and can not do.
Plus our incredible run with injuries, lack of depth, lack of speed and skill and lack of A grade multi position players has really made a lot of tactical decisions not possible.
I mean we are on here talking about moving Saad up forwards because of lack of talent.
Our motto should be, We rob Peter to pay Paul.
Wright's first job is to add another ex-AFL coach, like the Pies and Melbourne have done.
Simpson would be great.

I think we also need a measured approach as a club, change some of the players, add depth and see what he can do with a healthy more versatile list.
Like I said before, I don't rate Chris Scott as a coach, but you can see what is possible with a list like he's had.
And Voss put him to the sword last game, he clearly out coached a premiership coach.

I'm not sure what you mean by have it both ways, but I'll try to explain.

Yes, that is what they did.
I can see why they did it, but for me we were in our window and you don't go that hard at the draft if you are IMO.
Kennedy - We have plenty of slow inside mids, what we don't have is fast line breaking goal kicking ones.
Owies - I thought we should've kept him but the club backed Motlop and Durdin, Owies had his ceiling as a player but I think we miss his on-filed leadership more than expected.
Martin - Injured, had to go.
Marchbank - Injured, had to go also.

Our list was and is still always injured and our results are directly because of this.
A slow team and one that also lacks skill only has one style to play, contested football and then that leads to injuries.
If we were slow and players could kick like Pies and Hawks players last night, we'd be a different side.
This isn't as liner as some would like to think, our coaching has its faults but our list is way out of balance first and foremost.

If TDK leaves, we can't do anything about that. He is a player we need though.
If we trade Harry, then I hope it is for an A grade ready made player to address our weaknesses in the middle and F50.
If we trade Walsh, which I hope not then it should be for a player like above.
I would hate us to lose that much talent for kids, that would not be building at all IMO.
I really doubt Wright would do that though, but time will tell.

My bday is the 3rd June. We sacked Bolts on my bday. This club has delivered me some horrible depths but that was a @#$%&! low day.

Was honestly half expecting another bday sacking this year.

How we are coached relative to the rest of the comp is a major issue.

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We are on our way back...

Thanks for taking the time, I do appreciate it.

My issue with Voss is that we lack a hard edge, which is what I expected from him. Too often our players are manhandled and there’s zero response. That’s a standard and I expect him to drive that (given what he was like as a player).

I also worry that the side doesn’t seem to be able to get all aspects to work, we constantly over correct and finish up exposed in an area that was formerly a strength. I get he’s not responsible for the individual plays, but he is accountable for how we play, and we suck.

Some of it is definitely the players and those available but I don’t accept that he has no say in the types that we recruit and the players, and in turn the way we play is a result of his vision.

I don’t think he’ll turn it around and I’m not confident that he’ll take advice or change his ways.

A well thought out response.

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

It really annoys me when I see the Swans getting smashed at home and GWS nearly falling for the Tigers in the weeks after we made a meal of both matches.
Everything we do seems so hard.

I watched the replay this morning, Was funny last night liusteneing to the disinterested Swans fans at the ground. Did you hear the commentators in the first quarter when the Swans weren't getting the umpires favouring them? Commentator said "The Swans fans wont like this".

Obviously the AFL reads TC and they know they have been busted with their bias umpiring. See what happens when the umpires are impartial? They become disinterested and the atmosphere just dies in the arse. The chit chat amongst the attendees becomes more interesting.

Well that's what happened. I noticed it from midway the first quarter.

The Crows are one of the Top 2 teams going atm, and they didn't take the foot off the Swans neck. They are a much better team than carlton. Have a look at their percentage.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

I read your posts at footy last night Sidex. Loved both recent responses. Spot on.

Its going to be difficult to Trade any Harry or Charlie whilst in contract.
Its a bit different to the Grundy situation. Grundy was prepared to look at options.
Harry and his manager have dug their heals in before.
Why would they want to go to Sydney? Harry is happy in Middle Park, and Charlie has his new business.

I can see Wright allowing TDK to walk to saints.
I can also see SOS pulling the ridiculous offer, after successfully disrupting the calm at Carlton.
Walsh is the one coming out of contract next year, and Wright doesn't have to offer him a good contract. Ditto TDK.

Its going to be an interesting watch post bye what the players dish up, and come seasons end to see the changes.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Sidex summary is sensible and situational. Patience is needed, and I know we've been patient till now, but there's obviously the final parts to put together to make us better.

I completely agree with the harder edge you expect, but I don't think our players are the "types" to show hard edge. They're a special breed to hard nuts.

When King says our style is to bash up the opposition, I just don't see that. What I see is our bigger bodies give us the advantage to win ball first, basically shepherding the ball before they dish it out. Calling us a bash and crash team is a fallacy imo

Vossy does have a say i the types he needs for his game plan, but he doesn't tell the List Manager who they MUST get. If he does, they would tell him to get back in his box. The club is forever, and the coach is a moment in time doing his best with what he's got.

Vossy, like Malthouse probably said during his intrview the list was a Premiership list and he can do to make them take the next step. That's on him.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

It's like going on a road trip and you have to pull over to the side of the road because you car is throwing out a dozen fault codes... watching every other car you passed earlier driving right passed you with their kids pointing and laughing at you from the back seat.

Voss may have a 'winning record' but his record over the past 12 months is what matters... especially in his 4th year.

We can throw out as many excuses as we want but the light at the end of the tunnel seems to be getting dimmer... that it's demoralizing to realise that we might have to start again, the extent of that is unknown. Meanwhile out best players ain't getting any younger.

Right or wrong (I honestly don't know), the next 4 weeks is crucial to whether we can fix our fault codes, at least enough to get to our destination... or be forced to trade in for a new model.

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“I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers that can't be questioned.” ― Richard Feynman

agree. i don't think professional players and high picks and talent like what we have here should be double the next worst afl team in disposal efficiency by foot and kicking skills in general.

we have, and continue to go backwards each year under voss. time to cut it all out and move on. and i think wright will be the guy who does it.

I doubt Voss tells them who they must get either, and agree he shouldn’t.

Craig Bellamy was a speaker at a work function years ago and I do recall him saying that he’d watch footage of potential draftees and conduct interviews to determine how coachable a kid was. It sounded like he had a major say in who got the nod, I liked the approach.

He also said that he’d take a risk on a kid ‘a bit rough around the edges’ if they had the talent and back their culture to get the best out of them. I think Carlton shy away from that approach and that hurts us.

I don’t see Voss setting the culture in the way McRae or Mitchell have, Clarkson and Longmire did….that’s what I want most from the senior coach

That's a really insightful post. I just had someone pick up my youngest to play footy. I don't watch him anymore. The blokw says to me, whats happened to your team? I reckon Voss can't coach". I asked him if just read the paper, listened to SEN or read TC? I'm sick of the Voss can't coach comment. No one seeems to recall what injury has negataively impacted us since 2022 when we missed out by a bees dick.

But, there must be an element Vossy has to take responsibility. Forward entry is a coaching issue.

Bellamy is a legend. His philosophy and his continuity as Storm coach has been part of the success.

Carlton has been shell shocked since Fevola ran amok, and wasn't reigned in, then the kids Mitch, Garlett and Houla followed and ran amok.

Now we want kids from good homes, nice schools, good manors, nice clothes , nice haircuts, and no tattoes. It doesn't work.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

listening to belichek talk about the nfl draft in the tom brady years is similar.

they drafted the best possible player at that pick, regardless of their depth in that position. if they worked out, they had a cheaper alternative to the expensive vet, and would trade them out for team needs where teams usually pay overs for a ready made vet. they drafted regardless of their off field issues and backed their culture and the leadership group to iron them out.

he went on to become the most SB winningest coach ever with that philosophy


how we can only draft private school, clean cut "good guys" and expect that not to go tits up is beyond me. and we look around the HT huddle and wonder where the mongrel is gonna come from ...