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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:38 am 
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Robert Walls
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AGRO wrote:
Is it any wonder with Sticks "the top up, we're close, we can pinch a flag with this list" Kernahan in charge of this club and it's football direction since 1997.

He should be asked to flower off right now, and the current Board as well, otherwise we will just sugar coat and overate where we are as a club AGAIN and make the same flowering mistakes all over again.


:mad:

:roll:


I am assuming that you were slightly displeased with the boys effort and intensity last night???

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:42 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Cretylus wrote:
Effes wrote:
Cretylus wrote:
1%ers


Carlton had 47 1%'ers to Essendon***'s 35.


tackles were about even at 57 to 51 in our favour and the contested ball was about even at 123 to 125.

Inside 50 was 55 to 29 in essendons favour

And marks inside 50 were 21 to 7 in their favour

They had more of the ball with about 450 possessions to our 317.

What does that tell you???

(1%ers are measured differently by every club, some include pressure acts some don't - what did you think of our harassing and pressure acts last night? Very impressive intensity and team related acts by the boys wasn't it Effes??? I know I was impressed - I have never seen anything like it in my life)


That's what the statisticians recorded.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:42 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Well I came half way around the world to watch that.
All I can say is that they were rabble.
Can't kick.
Don't run at the ball carrier which is the surest way I know to make sure your man doesn't get a look at the footy and to make sure that if the kick is a bit wayward you can autocorrect.
Don't overlap.
Can't mark.
Apart from a few, don't want the hard ball and those that want it can't kick when they get it.
We have a ruckman who's bet hit out for the night went straight down the throat of an unattended opposition player in the clear.
We have key forwards that are sooks and can't be bothered covering the ground they need to cover and even when they do, they can'd kick straight.
We have a midfield full of B listers. No, not blisters.
We have one of the fastest and most creative players in the comp playing down back where the opposition can make sure he never gets a touch in space.
We have 3 #1 draft picks in the team, one of which has played about half the games available, aonther who should be in the midfield but is played as a stopgap and tagger because he has no idea how to play contested footy and one who is our captain and gets tagged out of the game weekly and couldn't captain a little league team.
We also have 2 #2 picks. One of them played hisbest footy as a third forward and has been played as a third back ever since. One is a new comer from Collingwood who is yet to make his mark.
We have one #3 pick whi has played his best footy and will never be the same.
We have several other top twenty picks who are mostly playing shit footy or playing in the twos because they either aren't good enough or the coach wants them to get more time there while the ones get thrashed or narrowly beaten three weeks in a row.
We have a coach who belongs in another decade and whom we should NEVER have taken aboard. We already had a coach who was doing a fair to middling job. Now we have another one who is doing a crap job.
We have a board made up of people who were at the club during the glory days and who still think we can buy a premiership and that the draft and trade table is for mug clubs like Hawthorn.

And then we have dicks like me, rusted on for fifty years or more who are just wide eyed with disbelief at that is happening but can't take our eyes off it. My grand daughter proudly wears her Carlton jumper and announces that Carlton is her second team because Hawthorn markets itself so well in tassie and are winning to boot. My grandson lists Carlton as his fourth favourite team but he's only 6 and doesn't understand yet.

My niece used to go for Carlton but is now a mad Kangas supporter (poor girl) because her husband likes them.
Her sister was a mad Carlton supporter ut now goes for the Cats because she lived in Geelong.

It just goes on and on and on.

Well I am just about over it and if Gary Ablett keeps on keeping on and those kids keep playing good footy I might just watch them instead. They'll never be my team because I'm too Carlton but if I'm going to sit up all night to watch a game of footy I might as well watch one that won't break my heart.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:47 am 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Wed May 30, 2007 11:10 am
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I just wish that the players showed the same passion and love and dedication to the club that we supporters all have.

What pisses me off so bad is that Essendope used their players as drug test dummies and pin cushions yet their players re-signed in droves and play hard for their teammates and the jumper. While our players dont give a shit. They want to know 'what the clubs plan is' or whatever Bryce Gibbs is sooking about before re-signing.

Why should we all care when the players who step out on to the field and wear such a proud jumper and play for such a great club don't!


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:49 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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azza? wrote:
They want to know 'what the clubs plan is' or whatever Bryce Gibbs is sooking about before re-signing.


Are the club able to answer his/his manager's question?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:54 am 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 10:49 am
Posts: 1650
What l want in the immediate short term is for our blood head CEO to not appear weekly on SEN.

I have no idea why he does it. Do other CEO's do it?

Does his 5 minute spiel equate to a reconnecting with fans ? Is it a communication strategy? A marketing opportunity? What the F@@" is it?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:59 am 
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Rod Ashman
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ThePsychologist wrote:
Just shows it can change and change quickly IF you have the right people in charge.

Don't underestimate how much influence Alan Richardson had when Ratten was coach then as part of the Port rebuild. He is a first class coach who has a poor St Kilda side playing good hard team football.


Malthouse makes the decisions, the game plan, the structural framework. He is the one that disciplines, inspires and determines their mind set.
He is the one that builds a captain, a team and a totally solidified unit
not the president
not the assistant choach’s
not the ceo or the board

he prepares and sends them out in the best possible shape to take everything that is thrown at them.

He has failed and failed miserably in his duty as a teacher and a leader.

When you see a skinny 18 year old runt pushes and taunts your captain with no recoil or any show of retaliation during the game the coach along with his on field leaders should be embarrassed ashamed to the highest order.

I’m not upset in our loss last night I am mortified and disgusted in the way we lost and how it was dissected by our all mighty coach.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:02 am 
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Harry Vallence

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Effes wrote:
azza? wrote:
They want to know 'what the clubs plan is' or whatever Bryce Gibbs is sooking about before re-signing.


Are the club able to answer his/his manager's question?


They should be able to but i wouldn't know.

Don't get my wrong, I'm extremely disappointed in the club but even more so in the players, and Gibbs is one of them. It just looks like no-one gives a damn and that's what hurts the most for me!


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:06 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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Location: Kaloyasena
Cretylus wrote:
AGRO wrote:
Is it any wonder with Sticks "the top up, we're close, we can pinch a flag with this list" Kernahan in charge of this club and it's football direction since 1997.

He should be asked to flower off right now, and the current Board as well, otherwise we will just sugar coat and overate where we are as a club AGAIN and make the same flowering mistakes all over again.


:mad:

:roll:


I am assuming that you were slightly displeased with the boys effort and intensity last night???


It hurts more because it was these gloating, self serving drug cheats.

It also hurts more because I have to front up to work less than 12 hours later to cop the water cooler/coffee machine crap as the anger is still bubbling just underneath like a super volcano about to explode.

Otherwise everything else is fine.

:donk:

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:35 am 
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Bert Deacon

Joined: Sun Jun 21, 2009 3:58 pm
Posts: 539
THANKS ESS for last night you have exposed how fake ,imposters we are.Last night was the reality we are miles behind good clubs.
I blame our recruiting , soft training no hard tough bodies to weak players. I am a 20yr member and nothing has changed must do something about game plan.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:40 am 
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formerly cj69

Joined: Sun May 03, 2009 9:52 am
Posts: 7893
redback wrote:
ThePsychologist wrote:
Just shows it can change and change quickly IF you have the right people in charge.

Don't underestimate how much influence Alan Richardson had when Ratten was coach then as part of the Port rebuild. He is a first class coach who has a poor St Kilda side playing good hard team football.


Malthouse makes the decisions, the game plan, the structural framework. He is the one that disciplines, inspires and determines their mind set.
He is the one that builds a captain, a team and a totally solidified unit
not the president
not the assistant choach’s
not the ceo or the board

he prepares and sends them out in the best possible shape to take everything that is thrown at them.

He has failed and failed miserably in his duty as a teacher and a leader.

When you see a skinny 18 year old runt pushes and taunts your captain with no recoil or any show of retaliation during the game the coach along with his on field leaders should be embarrassed ashamed to the highest order.

I’m not upset in our loss last night I am mortified and disgusted in the way we lost and how it was dissected by our all mighty coach.


I understand your anger but you can't put this totally on MM. Personally he has me worried because of the position we are in. However, this has been a continuing problem for a decade. It hasn't happened in the last 18 months.

The culture is shit, no leadership, the recruitment and development extremely poor and our list is woeful.

I still don't understand how our list could fill the salary cap?? :?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:48 am 
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Rod McGregor

Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2013 5:23 pm
Posts: 158
Blue Sombrero wrote:
Well I came half way around the world to watch that.
All I can say is that they were rabble.
Can't kick.
Don't run at the ball carrier which is the surest way I know to make sure your man doesn't get a look at the footy and to make sure that if the kick is a bit wayward you can autocorrect.
Don't overlap.
Can't mark.
Apart from a few, don't want the hard ball and those that want it can't kick when they get it.
We have a ruckman who's bet hit out for the night went straight down the throat of an unattended opposition player in the clear.
We have key forwards that are sooks and can't be bothered covering the ground they need to cover and even when they do, they can'd kick straight.
We have a midfield full of B listers. No, not blisters.
We have one of the fastest and most creative players in the comp playing down back where the opposition can make sure he never gets a touch in space.
We have 3 #1 draft picks in the team, one of which has played about half the games available, aonther who should be in the midfield but is played as a stopgap and tagger because he has no idea how to play contested footy and one who is our captain and gets tagged out of the game weekly and couldn't captain a little league team.
We also have 2 #2 picks. One of them played hisbest footy as a third forward and has been played as a third back ever since. One is a new comer from Collingwood who is yet to make his mark.
We have one #3 pick whi has played his best footy and will never be the same.
We have several other top twenty picks who are mostly playing shit footy or playing in the twos because they either aren't good enough or the coach wants them to get more time there while the ones get thrashed or narrowly beaten three weeks in a row.
We have a coach who belongs in another decade and whom we should NEVER have taken aboard. We already had a coach who was doing a fair to middling job. Now we have another one who is doing a crap job.
We have a board made up of people who were at the club during the glory days and who still think we can buy a premiership and that the draft and trade table is for mug clubs like Hawthorn.

And then we have dicks like me, rusted on for fifty years or more who are just wide eyed with disbelief at that is happening but can't take our eyes off it. My grand daughter proudly wears her Carlton jumper and announces that Carlton is her second team because Hawthorn markets itself so well in tassie and are winning to boot. My grandson lists Carlton as his fourth favourite team but he's only 6 and doesn't understand yet.

My niece used to go for Carlton but is now a mad Kangas supporter (poor girl) because her husband likes them.
Her sister was a mad Carlton supporter ut now goes for the Cats because she lived in Geelong.

It just goes on and on and on.

Well I am just about over it and if Gary Ablett keeps on keeping on and those kids keep playing good footy I might just watch them instead. They'll never be my team because I'm too Carlton but if I'm going to sit up all night to watch a game of footy I might as well watch one that won't break my heart.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:49 am 
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Rod McGregor

Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2013 5:23 pm
Posts: 158
DOES THAT MEAN WERE STILL A CHANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:50 am 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 12:44 am
Posts: 3136
Braithy wrote:
Also the whole playing personalities thing needs to be adjusted.

Hearing that rowe is getting AFL minutes over Cas, despite being an inferior player and much, much less of a prospect, but a better 'personality' than what casboult is.

That stuff sticks in my craw. We're here to win, not play favourites. (Which is a big knock on Malthouse's entire career, re plays his favourites).


Can you expand on that?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 12:00 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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Posts: 7182
4thchicken wrote:
Braithy wrote:
Also the whole playing personalities thing needs to be adjusted.

Hearing that rowe is getting AFL minutes over Cas, despite being an inferior player and much, much less of a prospect, but a better 'personality' than what casboult is.

That stuff sticks in my craw. We're here to win, not play favourites. (Which is a big knock on Malthouse's entire career, re plays his favourites).


Can you expand on that?


Only that a Tassie lad I use to play footy with is now a coach down there. He has a loose link through some kids he trains, with Casboult and that's what he's hearing from them. Mick doesn't like Cas.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 12:17 pm 
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Robert Walls
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Location: looking for a good bloke to have a beer with
azza? wrote:
I just wish that the players showed the same passion and love and dedication to the club that we supporters all have.

What pisses me off so bad is that Essendope used their players as drug test dummies and pin cushions yet their players re-signed in droves and play hard for their teammates and the jumper. While our players dont give a shit. They want to know 'what the clubs plan is' or whatever Bryce Gibbs is sooking about before re-signing.

Why should we all care when the players who step out on to the field and wear such a proud jumper and play for such a great club don't!


Once zone selections went out and the draft came is this became a thing of the past. It's not tribal anymore, there is no hate, it's big $$, latte's, haircuts, fashion labels and a 3hr job once a week in winter where you're all mates at the end of the day.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 12:18 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Posts: 2645
ThePsychologist wrote:
redback wrote:
ThePsychologist wrote:
Just shows it can change and change quickly IF you have the right people in charge.

Don't underestimate how much influence Alan Richardson had when Ratten was coach then as part of the Port rebuild. He is a first class coach who has a poor St Kilda side playing good hard team football.


Malthouse makes the decisions, the game plan, the structural framework. He is the one that disciplines, inspires and determines their mind set.
He is the one that builds a captain, a team and a totally solidified unit
not the president
not the assistant choach’s
not the ceo or the board

he prepares and sends them out in the best possible shape to take everything that is thrown at them.

He has failed and failed miserably in his duty as a teacher and a leader.

When you see a skinny 18 year old runt pushes and taunts your captain with no recoil or any show of retaliation during the game the coach along with his on field leaders should be embarrassed ashamed to the highest order.

I’m not upset in our loss last night I am mortified and disgusted in the way we lost and how it was dissected by our all mighty coach.


I understand your anger but you can't put this totally on MM. Personally he has me worried because of the position we are in. However, this has been a continuing problem for a decade. It hasn't happened in the last 18 months.

The culture is shit, no leadership, the recruitment and development extremely poor and our list is woeful.

I still don't understand how our list could fill the salary cap?? :?



Malthouse was brought in part to address nearly all the points you have made about psych.

Our culture can change in a blink of an eye when the right coach is brought in that has been proven on multiple occasions and this needs to be done immediately by the incoming party. He has failed to make a statement.
Not only did he elect the wrong leader of our club he also has failed to inspire and protect him.

He has recruited more of the same old. For me Everitt and Daisy are not in any way going to add anything to our team. I’m not familiar with Doherty but I hope he can.

Our development is on par if not under par when ratten was in charge and I wasn’t thrilled then either. Play the kids and give them experience. Our current crop of bottom 8 or so aren’t up to it so why are we still persisting with them.
We need to give the kids like Watson, lucas, Graham and so on consistent time and games wether they fail or not. We need constantly build and not become stagnant by gifting games to the same players again and again and expecting a different output.

The salary cap I can only presume we pay exuberant amounts to what we think are a needed and wanted by others, which I cannot see.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 12:28 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:02 am
Posts: 1770
Another thing that I noticed is that we are ball watchers. We would have a player a couple of meters from the Essendon* player with the ball and our player would run half paced and not even put pressure on them as they are about to dispose the ball. At least look like or act like you are making an effort. I am sure if our player made up at least 1 meter on the opposition player and put some pressure on it would increase the chance of them turning it over. We had no pressure on the ball carrier which allowed them to use the ball however they liked and keep it from us.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 12:39 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Posts: 1323
Casboult can clunk a mark, but can not kick.

that is still one up on most of our senior players.

He is 24 and out only KPF in the VFL. Perhaps it is time to give him a guarantee of 10-12 games and cut him if he doesn't make an impact.

We clearly need Henderson down back.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 12:41 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2009 2:56 pm
Posts: 2477
DOC SHERRIN GONE A BIT QUIET

HOW ABOUT CAZZEMAN AS WELL?


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