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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 2:31 pm 
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Bob Chitty
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I wonder how much the Tigers being flowers actually helped our performance. Our typically sedate, introverted team seemed to be fired up by their antagonism.
Our team need to learn to harness the energy that comes from peak arousal and not approach each game as a "business as usual, off to work" mindset.

What do you think?

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 3:01 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Blues87 wrote:
I wonder how much the Tigers being flowers actually helped our performance. Our typically sedate, introverted team seemed to be fired up by their antagonism.
Our team need to learn to harness the energy that comes from peak arousal and not approach each game as a "business as usual, off to work" mindset.

What do you think?


They certainly have more than their fair share of flowers in the team. Hreivwoldt is a juvenile, and I'm not sure they can ever win a flag with him in the team. Lots of ability, no brains.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 4:06 pm 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2006 6:54 pm
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Gab wrote:
Effes wrote:
Blue Sombrero wrote:
When Kreuzer is fit, Warnock will go straight back to the VFL where he belongs.


And Kreuzer will continue to get beaten at centre bounces against the giant rucks.


I agree with this, Warnock is far and away our best option in the ruck, we also tend to win more games when he is rucking than we lose. Obviously Kreuzer is better around the ground but that doesn't help with giving our midfielders first use of the ball. He dosesnt often place the ball to our advantage, he thumps trhe ball forwatd more oiften than not and more often than not the ball ends up in the hands of an opposition player.

Play Kreuzer as an onballer , fine, but Warnock needs to be our number 1 ruck option.


..who are the 'giant rucks'..??.. ..cos really, there's only 1 giant ruck and that's Sandi, he's just about cooked, and he doesn't have high hitout to adv percentages even with the extra taps he gets [just like knockers].. ... ..and Knockers is far too reedy thin/light and lacks physicality to do any better vs the 'giant rucks'..

..i'll say it again, Knockers as a tap ruckman is average.. ..very average ruck skill.. ..his extra height enables him to get more taps, but he does not consistently have high percentage hitout to adv games.. ..vs maric,he had 39 taps for 23% adv.. ..average.. ..and actually, on the low side of average.. ..maric had 33 taps for about 38% to adv [may be a touch off, but significantly higher than knockers].. ..for Knockers, who is extremely 1 dimensional ruck, his actual ruckwork is nowhere near as good as it needs to be to justify his lack of anything else.. ..if you watch his actual tapwork, his hands have very few tricks.. and he's far too weak to play as a prime ruckman..

..if our mids are off, you get nada from Knockers.. ..he's as close to impossible as you can get, for Knockers to have a good game if everyone else is down.. ..sometimes a team can get smashed but a few players stand tall.. ..but not him.. ..no presence, no intensity.. ..offers little when he's not rucking, and when rucking after the tap has no 'game'..

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 4:38 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 9:20 am
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Great win.

Thought Waite was very important across half-back.

Murphy was great around the stoppages.

Good to win with Bell, McInnes, Menzel, Casboult Bootsma and Graham in the team. There's barely 50 games between that group. Would absolutely love it if at least two of McCarthy, O'Keefe, Watson and Buckley made the grade.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 4:54 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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Expected to win,and we did.Well done fellas..............but ya gotta follow it up.Aint gonna be a footy match,its gonna be a war.Brace yourselves boys.DO NOT GIVE ONE INCH.No backward steps.Ferocity must be the theme this week.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 4:59 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:30 pm
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Location: Blisstonia.
The Duke wrote:
Bigredisback wrote:
The Duke wrote:
Yesterday was a good win, but let's not get too carried away. They had a much younger side in than we did. So we should have won, but normally we should have been expecting to win that game by 6 goals plus.

If we play to the level we should expect, we'll beat Essendon**** by 10 goals then Port by 3.

Expecting to beat a team fighting for top 4 who just thrashed hawthorn by 10 goals and u think we should be budgeting for a 6 goal win

Lol


It wasn't the same side that beat Hawthorn 3 weeks earlier. the average age of that team was 25y 5m & 88 games ave compared to 24y 4m and 74 games. Makes a massive difference.

IMO Judd hasn't given us anything like the return this year that he has in his past 10 seasons. He was of little loss yesterday. Kreuzer was compensated by Warnock, who, when he works hard enough, is among the top 6 ruckman in the comp.

I was so confident yesterday I put my money on the win. Had we played the same team that beat hawthorn, we wouldn't have had a hope.


Not sure Duke. Changes from the Hawks game:

Out: Newman, Edwards, White and Stephenson
In: Grimes, Pettard, Vickey and McDonough.

Not sure it's that glaring....

...And if is, it's an indictment on their depth if they cant cover those outs.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 5:52 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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The boys lifted the intensity and desperation after 1/4 time.

The Tigers still had a a dip but it was those desperate acts and smothers and tackles and dives at the opponent which made the difference.

Bring that intensity every week and we can go places.

Warnock lacks intensity after the ruck work. Watches players run past him or he just doesn't read the game.

Kreuzer does get smashed by taller ruckmen but I dont think it actually hurts us like it use to when McLaren, Cloke or Ackland were rucking. Hampson is more value than Warnock imo.

Menzel is a seriously good hard at it footballer...like Braithy I worry about his knees..its an inherent Menzel problem.

I really liked Casboult Waite and Hendo up forward, but with Menzel there too it didnt seem like we needed Waite there too.

Felt so secure when Waite was in defense, but love him up forward. Great if we van mix it up with swingmen rather than a swingman.

Bootsma also watched players run past him and could have shown more effort to put pressure on opponents. He isn't strong enough to play against the bigger forwards and if I read it correctly didnt seem to have the pace for the wing. He needs to put in a big preseason if he's going to step up. I do have faith in him because he does have some good skills with the spoil and the kicking...although yesterdays kicking from him was avearge.

McInnes needs to improve his pace too...I know he's only come back from knee reconstruction.

Graham looks like he belongs. I like him a lot.

Plenty of room for improvement with skills, especially kicking....Casboult can improve his kicking and needs to improve his stamina over the preseason...then he'll be hot property.

Brock is not a favourite of mine, but the guy just puts in week after week...that 3rd qtr was amazing for him. Much Brocky love in that 2nd Qtr.

Great to get a win. Lets finish the H&A with 3 consecutive wins and a win in the first final against Tigers or Bumbers...that'll top off a disappointing season.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 6:17 pm 
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John Nicholls

Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 12:18 pm
Posts: 9650
Location: Australia
Michael Jezz wrote:
Whatever you think of warnock we win when he plays


What happened last week then?


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 6:53 pm 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Thu May 11, 2006 6:11 pm
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Thanks Wallsy.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 6:54 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:54 pm
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kezza wrote:
Thanks Wallsy.


will counter it by attacking the bombers this week


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:03 pm 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Thu May 11, 2006 6:11 pm
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doofdoof wrote:
kezza wrote:
Thanks Wallsy.


will counter it by attacking the bombers this week

Someone had better gag him.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:04 pm 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Thu May 11, 2006 6:11 pm
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Cant wait to listen to KB on SEN tomorrow morning.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:07 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 9:36 am
Posts: 8136
Pros:

Great game from Robbo. Love his niggle as well. Takes a fair bit of attention away from Murphy, when opposition players want to line Robbo up.
Bell. Would have liked to see us put more games into him this year. He'll butcher the ball on occasions. He'll get run down on others. But is physical and aggressive and intimidating when running through a stoppage.
Like many others, really enjoyed seeing Gibbs in a more attacking role. He's great as the loose man in defence, but the opposition rarely allows this anymore. We need to recondition him for the second half of his career.
Most encouraging performance I've seen from Yarran for a while. Think he enjoyed being able to get some ball in defence and run it out.
Casboult has some obvious weaknesses, and may not make it. But surely he's a far better chance of doing so than Rowe. He's basically our only real kpf hope, outside of Hendo and Waite.
McLean, Tuohy, Curnow, Simmo.

Cons:

Still concerned by how easily opposition sides score against us when it goes into our forward 50. Especially since we moved Hendo forward. Waite made a real difference when he went back.
Loved the MC giving responsibility to Bootsma. And am convinced he's the future. But was poor. Don't know if it's confidence or not. But seems to struggle changing direction. Hope it's not an agility problem.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:16 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 9:36 am
Posts: 8136
bondiblue wrote:
The boys lifted the intensity and desperation after 1/4 time.

The Tigers still had a a dip but it was those desperate acts and smothers and tackles and dives at the opponent which made the difference.

Bring that intensity every week and we can go places.


I agree.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:18 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 6:42 pm
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kezza wrote:
Cant wait to listen to KB on SEN tomorrow morning.


Someone has to ring him, in the HUN on Friday, he tipped the Tigers by 99 points...........to top it off Michael Warner tipped the Tigers by 101 points.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:19 pm 
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formerly cj69

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kezza wrote:
Cant wait to listen to KB on SEN tomorrow morning.


Thats the first time I've ever heard anyone say that!

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:35 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Sun May 27, 2007 1:48 pm
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Stefchook wrote:
Pros:

Great game from Robbo. Love his niggle as well. Takes a fair bit of attention away from Murphy, when opposition players want to line Robbo up.
Bell. Would have liked to see us put more games into him this year. He'll butcher the ball on occasions. He'll get run down on others. But is physical and aggressive and intimidating when running through a stoppage.

Agree Stef`, the bigger bodies of Robbo, Bell and Levi made a big difference yesterday. Can they/we (coaches) improve their disposal?


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:43 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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Posts: 7297
Blueboy74 wrote:
The Duke wrote:
Bigredisback wrote:
The Duke wrote:
Yesterday was a good win, but let's not get too carried away. They had a much younger side in than we did. So we should have won, but normally we should have been expecting to win that game by 6 goals plus.

If we play to the level we should expect, we'll beat Essendon***** by 10 goals then Port by 3.

Expecting to beat a team fighting for top 4 who just thrashed hawthorn by 10 goals and u think we should be budgeting for a 6 goal win

Lol


It wasn't the same side that beat Hawthorn 3 weeks earlier. the average age of that team was 25y 5m & 88 games ave compared to 24y 4m and 74 games. Makes a massive difference.

IMO Judd hasn't given us anything like the return this year that he has in his past 10 seasons. He was of little loss yesterday. Kreuzer was compensated by Warnock, who, when he works hard enough, is among the top 6 ruckman in the comp.

I was so confident yesterday I put my money on the win. Had we played the same team that beat hawthorn, we wouldn't have had a hope.


Not sure Duke. Changes from the Hawks game:

Out: Newman, Edwards, White and Stephenson
In: Grimes, Pettard, Vickey and McDonough.

Not sure it's that glaring....

...And if is, it's an indictment on their depth if they cant cover those outs.

Absolutely...

Compared to no Judd, Carrazzo, Garlett, Watson, Kruezer

Why can't we just enjoy a win ffs

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:53 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
Posts: 3561
club29 wrote:
BIRDTOWN wrote:
club29 wrote:
It has to mentioned that the tigers have probably lifted their training over the last few weeks to prepare for the finals. Would explain their inconsistent effort today.

Not saying we didn't play good but we should take into account our oppositions position.


How about being blanketed where it mattered? Players actually standing up when the game was on the line. Robbo actually thinking when he had the ball. 5 goals down and then the training load kicked in. Please. Ellis decided not to go near the ball. Riewoldt gave up. Cotchin decided to keep his best until the last 2 minutes. It's why our stars have been so shite this year.
Take your anti MM views into your other threads...enjoy the win


Hi BIRDTOWN,

So you think the Tigers are not thinking about Sept. Not training up for it. Just going through the motions thinking their pre season is enough to get them through.

They are locked in. Foolish to think they wouldn't be preparing. Look through the results of teams in the finals in years gone by. Look for upsets. You will see plenty. Collingwood , Hawthorn and Essendon** have been a lock for a while and look at their results over the last month. The tigers come out flying yesterday and then had concrete legs for 3 quarters.

We played well but we shouldn't get too carried away. Our problems still exist.


Agree that one game never changes anything

Having said that, what will be your anti MM 'get out clause' should we achieve the impossible and win the next two?

And..had we lost, what would your angle have been?

Sounds like you've go the two concrete legs in both camps (just in case the antichrist MM coaches us to a win)

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:59 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
Posts: 3561
Effes wrote:
Blue Sombrero wrote:
When Kreuzer is fit, Warnock will go straight back to the VFL where he belongs.


And Kreuzer will continue to get beaten at centre bounces against the giant rucks.


Warnock, Kruezer are B grade tap ruckmen
Hampson is a C grade tap ruckmen
Warnock is a D grade follower
Kruezer is a B grade follower
Hampson is a C grade follower

Our ruck dept is flowering sh1t no matter which way we look at it. Not one of them is close to A grade as either a ruckman or follower
Would prefer Hampson/Kruezer more than Warnock/Kruezer

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