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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 1:47 pm 
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Geoff Southby

Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 1:29 pm
Posts: 5913
Location: Melbourne
In the good old days, the journos would get their stories down the pub. Then write nothing, because they were mates with all the players and coaches.

I'm sure there's a happy medium somewhere, but the world tends to lurch from one extreme to the other instead.


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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 1:52 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Location: Comparing orange boners with Hirdy
Its good that we've got the depth on TC to replace Synbad in the unsubstantiated propaganda stakes

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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 3:12 pm 
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Adrian Gallagher
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Joined: Mon May 23, 2005 9:26 am
Posts: 88
Good leaders will always try and hire a team of people that are smarter than themselves.

Lets hope the other appointments are for equally well credentialled individuals.

The appointment of AR gives us the expertise, experience and technology capabilities to develop individual player skills. I am sure the majority of contributors to this forum are very frustrated by the skill errors that let us down everytime we seem to be making progress. A 5% to 10% improvement in individual skill will make a huge difference to our team.

For eg look at the Dale Thomas and how he has added evasion techniques, a yard of dash and more consistency to his delivery, it has made him much less predictable and much more dangerous. Add some of those subtle skills to some of our guys and we can start to get excited.

Of course individual skill development seems to be AR's core competency. He seems an unknown quantity in regards to overall strategy.

Therefore we also need a strategist, who understands how to construct and deconstruct a zone, a press or a junk rotating defence with double and triple teams.

Our game plan is far to basic for the modern day. Don't get me wrong if you can win the ball out of the middle consistently and roost it into the forward line, or burst clear ahla Judd you will win many more games than you lose. But you can't win finals or premierships until you can play a variety of styles of footy, moreover it is the defensive systems which usually sort out the wheat from the chaff.

Allowing an under manded defence to go one on one isn't going to get the job done.

Lets add the ball pressure, tempo control and channelling the ball with sufficeint rotations and coverage. Take away the soft goals. Make teams kick accurately from set shots on the boundary to beat us. And allow us, by use of zone breaker techniques, to take the heat of the game when we are locked into the opponents forward line.

But more importantly we need to be innovators. The coaches who are bold in their thinking and couragous in their actions are todays winners!

So lets add the strategist.

Then, lets add a leader of men.

If you look at some other sports the best technical coaches can't compete with the legends who know how to lead. Look at Phil Jackson in the NBA 11 titles. He did have some gun players for sure but one star won't win you a title, it is the output he got from players with limited capabilities by clearly defining their role and making them sacrifice for the greater good. Wayne Bennett in the NRL has a simple no nonsense style but has the utmost respect of the men he manages, therefore he gets the results.

Rats still has a key role, to manage. He brings the Blues culture, the history and the responsibility to bring it all together, and work with the Board and adminstration to make sure the whole package is ticking.

One good move to date by the Blues.

Lets hope the other moves are as well thought out.

CB


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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 3:48 pm 
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Bob Chitty
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:44 pm
Posts: 890
buzzaaaah wrote:
JohnM wrote:
(remember the Saints getting rid of Thomas after he got them into successive Preliminary finals?)


After he had got them into the 1st week of finals and beaten by the Dees.


Butterrs got rid of him for nothing more than PERSONAL reasons..... They had a fallout!!

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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:08 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Sun May 22, 2005 11:58 pm
Posts: 4058
Location: South Yarra
Coach B wrote:
Good leaders will always try and hire a team of people that are smarter than themselves.

Lets hope the other appointments are for equally well credentialled individuals.

The appointment of AR gives us the expertise, experience and technology capabilities to develop individual player skills. I am sure the majority of contributors to this forum are very frustrated by the skill errors that let us down everytime we seem to be making progress. A 5% to 10% improvement in individual skill will make a huge difference to our team.

For eg look at the Dale Thomas and how he has added evasion techniques, a yard of dash and more consistency to his delivery, it has made him much less predictable and much more dangerous. Add some of those subtle skills to some of our guys and we can start to get excited.

Of course individual skill development seems to be AR's core competency. He seems an unknown quantity in regards to overall strategy.

Therefore we also need a strategist, who understands how to construct and deconstruct a zone, a press or a junk rotating defence with double and triple teams.

Our game plan is far to basic for the modern day. Don't get me wrong if you can win the ball out of the middle consistently and roost it into the forward line, or burst clear ahla Judd you will win many more games than you lose. But you can't win finals or premierships until you can play a variety of styles of footy, moreover it is the defensive systems which usually sort out the wheat from the chaff.

Allowing an under manded defence to go one on one isn't going to get the job done.

Lets add the ball pressure, tempo control and channelling the ball with sufficeint rotations and coverage. Take away the soft goals. Make teams kick accurately from set shots on the boundary to beat us. And allow us, by use of zone breaker techniques, to take the heat of the game when we are locked into the opponents forward line.

But more importantly we need to be innovators. The coaches who are bold in their thinking and couragous in their actions are todays winners!

So lets add the strategist.

Then, lets add a leader of men.

If you look at some other sports the best technical coaches can't compete with the legends who know how to lead. Look at Phil Jackson in the NBA 11 titles. He did have some gun players for sure but one star won't win you a title, it is the output he got from players with limited capabilities by clearly defining their role and making them sacrifice for the greater good. Wayne Bennett in the NRL has a simple no nonsense style but has the utmost respect of the men he manages, therefore he gets the results.

Rats still has a key role, to manage. He brings the Blues culture, the history and the responsibility to bring it all together, and work with the Board and adminstration to make sure the whole package is ticking.

One good move to date by the Blues.

Lets hope the other moves are as well thought out.

CB


Good post, wrong conclusion.

So we got a leading player developer, need an innovative strategist, and a leader of men. If Ratten is neither, then being a "manager" by your definition is pretty thin stuff to base head coach on.

The leader of men is obviously the role of head coach. If Ratts can't inspire and command respect he's simply not the man to coach. Phil Jackson doesn't work his magic as a subordinate. Neither does Bennett


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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:09 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Sun May 22, 2005 11:58 pm
Posts: 4058
Location: South Yarra
ugh.


Last edited by aramari on Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:09 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Sun May 22, 2005 11:58 pm
Posts: 4058
Location: South Yarra
oops duplicate


Last edited by aramari on Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:10 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Sun May 22, 2005 11:58 pm
Posts: 4058
Location: South Yarra
dupe


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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:49 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2008 12:55 pm
Posts: 2952
Location: Balwyn
Josh Kaplan wrote:
Lets be clear about this- this was definately NOT a Ratten endorsed appointment. It came directly from Swann and the board. A bit of a power play going on which isnt necessarily healthy.. Is Ratten a lame duck coach? Methinks Richo has positioned himself perfectly.

So you're talking as if Richardson has engineered and manipulated the whole thing.

He applied for a job and got it.

How does that make him Machiavelli?? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Too much time on your hands Josh?

Richo's appointment is great for the Club.

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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:57 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2008 12:55 pm
Posts: 2952
Location: Balwyn
Rhys26 wrote:
Can anyone confirm whether there was a crisis meeting at the club last night regarding the appointment of Richardson??

Parko once said there's an average of two crises a week at any AFL Club. Most were dealt with discreetly.

Any meeting's a "crisis meeting" :lol: :lol: :lol:

Big deal.

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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:57 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:00 pm
Posts: 2550
Location: Safe distance away
Greg Denham dropped Gavin Browns name into the mix of potential appointments this morning.


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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 5:24 pm 
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formerly King Kenny
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Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2009 8:35 pm
Posts: 20076
isdonis.george wrote:
Josh Kaplan wrote:
Lets be clear about this- this was definately NOT a Ratten endorsed appointment. It came directly from Swann and the board. A bit of a power play going on which isnt necessarily healthy.. Is Ratten a lame duck coach? Methinks Richo has positioned himself perfectly.

So you're talking as if Richardson has engineered and manipulated the whole thing.

He applied for a job and got it.

How does that make him Machiavelli?? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Too much time on your hands Josh?

Richo's appointment is great for the Club.


I'm with Josh on this. Senior Assistant? Can you smell what Swann is cooking? Plan B.


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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 5:46 pm 
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formerly Josh Kaplan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:19 pm
Posts: 2187
Quote:
So you're talking as if Richardson has engineered and manipulated the whole thing.

He applied for a job and got it.

How does that make him Machiavelli?? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Too much time on your hands Josh?

Richo's appointment is great for the Club.


Talk about well and truly missing the mark. When did I ever say Richardson engineered this whole thing? I said it was a CEO and board led decision, not a senior coach inspired one. And that is a pertinent point.


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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 5:56 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
Posts: 3561
Josh Kaplan wrote:
Lets be clear about this- this was definately NOT a Ratten endorsed appointment. It came directly from Swann and the board. A bit of a power play going on which isnt necessarily healthy.. Is Ratten a lame duck coach? Methinks Richo has positioned himself perfectly.



Was thinking exactly the same thing JK. Perfect strategic move by AR. The 3 year contract means that they can't piss him off if Ratts goes. He'd have to be a shoe in for the caretaker role if Ratts is given the arse during the year (which I pray doesn't happen cause it will then be a wasted year)

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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 6:33 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2008 12:55 pm
Posts: 2952
Location: Balwyn
Josh Kaplan wrote:
Quote:
So you're talking as if Richardson has engineered and manipulated the whole thing.

He applied for a job and got it.

How does that make him Machiavelli?? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Too much time on your hands Josh?

Richo's appointment is great for the Club.


Talk about well and truly missing the mark. When did I ever say Richardson engineered this whole thing? I said it was a CEO and board led decision, not a senior coach inspired one. And that is a pertinent point.
Cimm78 put it beautifully

"Not all appointments are part of a conspiracy and not everyone has a hidden agenda."

I stand by my comments :fight:

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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 6:54 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Sun May 27, 2007 1:48 pm
Posts: 1556
Location: Under the Earth`s Sun...now.
Dr.SHERRIN wrote:
Had nothing to do with Montgomery and Lappin's contracts not being renewed which was a mutual decision by both parties .
Not true.


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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 7:31 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 18030
isdonis.george wrote:
Josh Kaplan wrote:
Quote:
So you're talking as if Richardson has engineered and manipulated the whole thing.

He applied for a job and got it.

How does that make him Machiavelli?? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Too much time on your hands Josh?

Richo's appointment is great for the Club.


Talk about well and truly missing the mark. When did I ever say Richardson engineered this whole thing? I said it was a CEO and board led decision, not a senior coach inspired one. And that is a pertinent point.
Cimm78 put it beautifully

"Not all appointments are part of a conspiracy and not everyone has a hidden agenda."

I stand by my comments :fight:


I've read Josh' post 4 times now and I'm stumped how you came to your initial conclusion. :?

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Last edited by Blue Vain on Thu Oct 07, 2010 8:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 8:26 pm 
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Horrie Clover

Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2005 12:24 am
Posts: 336
Guys have a look at some of th backgrounds of people on the board. Owners or advisors to business and government.

Don't forget the Sports press are press that couldn't hack it in the real press where our board members usually operate.


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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 5:24 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2005 8:23 am
Posts: 48684
Location: Canberra
99prelim wrote:
Josh Kaplan wrote:
Lets be clear about this- this was definately NOT a Ratten endorsed appointment. It came directly from Swann and the board. A bit of a power play going on which isnt necessarily healthy.. Is Ratten a lame duck coach? Methinks Richo has positioned himself perfectly.



Was thinking exactly the same thing JK. Perfect strategic move by AR. The 3 year contract means that they can't piss him off if Ratts goes. He'd have to be a shoe in for the caretaker role if Ratts is given the arse during the year (which I pray doesn't happen cause it will then be a wasted year)


Conversely if a senior gig opens up elsewhere during 2011, or at the end of the year then Richardson might be on the way out anyway.

Who knows, who cares ... all we can do is hope he makes a mark while he is here, however long it may be. :beer:

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 Post subject: Re: Overhaul?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:49 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 9:35 am
Posts: 2125
Josh wrote:
I said it was a CEO and board led decision, not a senior coach inspired one. And that is a pertinent point.


You're always on the money Josh. If this is true I sense a difficult year ahead. I don't think Ratts is up to it and his appointment was a classic old school out of touch exercise, giving a great player a break when clearly he had far too little experience, but wjile he is coach he must be able to assemble his team. If the committee thinks he can't take us forward, let him go and get someone else but the death by a 1000 cuts never helps anyone. He need to approve the appointments and get the people he thinks will help the club forward. I like the appointments, but unless Ratts is strongly in favour of them then in the short term we will have issues. All the caoches need to be on the same page, and that page needs to be written by the senior coach and not anyone else.


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