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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:13 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
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Mrs Caz wrote:
Why on earth would any coach name names on a television program?

We ( as general public) might like to hear it, but it is hardly likely to happen.


Actually, he did name players. My point was that it was a meagre handful. If he could've named more, he certainly would've. In fact the more he named, the better he would have looked.

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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:16 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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99prelim wrote:
TruBlueBrad wrote:
What I dont understand is that you say its clear we've not developed as we'd have liked...and then you want others to tell you why.

If its that clear, then I'm asking you tell us why...but you tell me you can't.



TBB even Ratten struggled with naming players who had come on this year during OTC last week. I cant remember the names of the last one or two he mentioned, but there was a lot of straw clutching. It was obviously considered a fair enough question for Healy and co. Your defensive responses to any criticism labelled at Carlton is embarrassing.


Clearly you didnt read what I posted anyway.

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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:18 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Disagree... . the more he names... the more desperate he looks.

Acknowledge problems..; yes... but details should be kept in house


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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:18 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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Well he was asked who has improved from last year.

Pretty crap question.


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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:26 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
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TruBlueBrad wrote:
99prelim wrote:
TruBlueBrad wrote:
What I dont understand is that you say its clear we've not developed as we'd have liked...and then you want others to tell you why.

If its that clear, then I'm asking you tell us why...but you tell me you can't.



TBB even Ratten struggled with naming players who had come on this year during OTC last week. I cant remember the names of the last one or two he mentioned, but there was a lot of straw clutching. It was obviously considered a fair enough question for Healy and co. Your defensive responses to any criticism labelled at Carlton is embarrassing.


Clearly you didnt read what I posted anyway.


Actually I did read your template response. It reads the same as all the other half dozen templates you trot out when anybody dares question Ratts and co.

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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:31 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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"Everyone keeps telling us how bad we're going," Ratten said after the win over West Coast.

"If you listened to what was going on outside our football club you'd think we're in the bottom four.

"If we keep telling the players or they keep listening to it, they'll start to believe it."


How true it is. Keep telling someone they a crap and they will start to believe it. Some faceless people thrive on telling people they don't know how bad they think those people are. That's sure to bring improvement. :garthp:

Regards Cazzesman

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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 11:01 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:38 pm
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Still think we are developing players - hampson is better than last year as is jacobs

yarran garlett are both better than last year as arguably is henderson

Agree gibbs and murphy havent been as productive this year

Whilst they are in the twos Setanta and robbo have both had a much better year than last year -russell has been a bit ordinary the last few weeks but was really good earlier in the year and I think better than last year

Warnock is better than last year


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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 26, 2010 7:34 am 
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Stephen Kernahan

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Just a couple of points. Development is about progressing the skills and abilities of young players. With some posters calling for the elevation of Zach Tuohey into the seniors, I would have thought that was a big tick for our development coaches.
With regard to Kyle Hardingham, he's older than Bryce Gibbs and more than a year older than Lachie Henderson so lets not get carried away there.
And just on the Jpod, pace was never his issue. In fact, he is the fastest player on Geelongs list. IMO, his issue was a lack of mental toughness and application in his earlier days.

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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 26, 2010 8:28 am 
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Stephen Silvagni
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Zach Tuohy seems to be adapting really well while Yarran and Garlett are obviously thriving.

However I am a bit concerned at the way some others who have come up from the 2s look like deers in the headlights. Obviously can't replicate the AFL tempo level in the VFL but could there be a bit more hustle and bustle in our 2s?


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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 26, 2010 4:02 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Blue Vain wrote:
And just on the Jpod, pace was never his issue. In fact, he is the fastest player on Geelongs list. IMO, his issue was a lack of mental toughness and application in his earlier days.

So you're saying he wasn't running hard enough?

I can only gauge on how he produced his footy on the field, VFL and AFL, and to me he appeared to be lacking a yard for senior standards. Out of interest, what sprint times are you referring to? 20 m or greater distances?

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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 26, 2010 4:12 pm 
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John Nicholls

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verbs wrote:
Well he was asked who has improved from last year.

Pretty crap question.


Agree. What a rubbish question.


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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 1:52 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:53 am
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The club put out a big explanation of the development program after appointing Harris and it appeared on the CFC website.
It revealed it was a very holistic program for players in their 1st 2 or 3 years.

It was posted in a thread here some time back.
It should appear in the archives here and on the CFC website

Some ppl here seem to be over estimating what the development coaches can do.
They can help fast track a player's knowledge base and help with some extra skills work, but they can't turn Casboult into Nick Reiwoldt.

Jezza, Doull, Baldock, Skilton, Nichols, Diesel etc etc never had development coaches, but champions still became champions bcoz of their ability.

The most important work is done by the recruiting team b'coz the cream will mostly find it's way to the top.

Look at Robbie Gray who was drafted late in the 06 draft and had an immediate impact, not because of the wonders from his development coaches, but bcoz he was a great talent despite being drafted late.

A good development program is just icing on the cake.


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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 2:17 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Nick wrote:
Gibbs
Murphy
Austin
Hampson
Grigg
Anderson
Browne
Edwards
Benjamin

Jamison

are the immediate names who come to mind that have either: (i) stalled in their development or gone backwards; (ii) have not come on as much as we expected/hoped after their first season or so on the scene.

Not good enough.


I can't see Edwards or Benjamin improving seeing as though they were de-listed last season.

If you are going to make comments on the list you should at least know who plays for Carlton

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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 2:37 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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:lol: :lol: :lol: too funny...


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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 4:05 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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Dr.SHERRIN wrote:
:lol: :lol: :lol: too funny...


Yeah....might be improvement in Digby Morell and Cory McGrath too........ :grin:

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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 6:17 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 25231
Location: Bondi Beach
We've got a few years ahead of the Dees in list improvement and development...plus we have Judd.

Now, how come the Dees are considered as the next power house and not us?

Ratten or player development the problem/ roadblock or what?

I'm concerned...and I think we may miss the boart (flag) if the progress of the Dees continues as it is.

And I'm a glass is half full kind of guy who is usually accused of wearing rose coloured glasses.

I know our potential and respect the list, but there is more to it, and we're missing that ingredient to expedite our improvement.

I'm concerned.

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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 6:20 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 25231
Location: Bondi Beach
get rid of the hacks wrote:
The club put out a big explanation of the development program after appointing Harris and it appeared on the CFC website.
It revealed it was a very holistic program for players in their 1st 2 or 3 years.

It was posted in a thread here some time back.
It should appear in the archives here and on the CFC website

Some ppl here seem to be over estimating what the development coaches can do.
They can help fast track a player's knowledge base and help with some extra skills work, but they can't turn Casboult into Nick Reiwoldt.

Jezza, Doull, Baldock, Skilton, Nichols, Diesel etc etc never had development coaches, but champions still became champions bcoz of their ability.

The most important work is done by the recruiting team b'coz the cream will mostly find it's way to the top.

Look at Robbie Gray who was drafted late in the 06 draft and had an immediate impact, not because of the wonders from his development coaches, but bcoz he was a great talent despite being drafted late.

A good development program is just icing on the cake.


So is it coaching which helps expedite development along with hardwork?

I don't know. But I think we should be a tad better than what we've shown this year. Plenty of reasons why we should've improved too!

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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 6:48 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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get rid of the hacks wrote:
The club put out a big explanation of the development program after appointing Harris and it appeared on the CFC website.


Better just clarify that that's Darren Harris, not George Harris...


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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 7:49 pm 
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Bert Deacon
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re Melb

* they had quality senior players they could retain where Carlton basically did not. Scotland and Houlihan are the only senior boys considered by the MC in our best 22. The Dees have C Bruce, B Green, McDonald, N Jones and arguably J Rivers. We were coming from further back than the Dees. Our list really was that bad! With out the recruitment of Stevens and Judd we would still be struggling.

* What they have then done is recruited a balanced list with a mix of mids inside/outside and some talls forwards/backs. They could do this because they were able to get multiple top 20 picks in multiple years. The blues may have more No 1's but I am certain Melb has more top 20 picks

I think the Dees have a better balanced list than we do - hence the comments.

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 Post subject: Re: Development?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 8:37 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2006 4:52 pm
Posts: 1857
darknavy wrote:
Nick wrote:
Gibbs
Murphy
Austin
Hampson
Grigg
Anderson
Browne
Edwards
Benjamin

Jamison

are the immediate names who come to mind that have either: (i) stalled in their development or gone backwards; (ii) have not come on as much as we expected/hoped after their first season or so on the scene.

Not good enough.


I can't see Edwards or Benjamin improving seeing as though they were de-listed last season.

If you are going to make comments on the list you should at least know who plays for Carlton


Yeah, I included them because I still thought they played for Carlton :roll:

Ever crossed your mind that Edwards and Benjamin were the type of athletic players i was alluding to that required development yet did not come on whatsoever, especially Edwards after his first handful of games.

But I guess I have to go step by step with big bold headings for you next time :thumbsup:


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