I'm glad we got shafted by the AFL. Actually, I don't think we got shafted. We cheated and we got caught.

Were the penalties fair?

No. Not based on precedence.

So?

So what?

I wasn't a member until after Elliott was booted out because I couldn't bring myself to pay money to watch him piss it up against a wall.

But Collo was President at the time of the 2002 draft I hear you cry!

Yep, and I'm glad the decision was made to take what we we given.

Our club culture has stunk for a long time. I've always loved the Carlton Football Club but I've loved it for it's heroics on the field rather than any manufactured bravado from a bunch of right wing political wannabes who spend most of their time working on ways to @#$%&! up companies for their own personal financial gain. By accepting the penalties in 2002 it was a club saying that we're not going to go on pretending that we run the AFL and that we should be subject to a different set of rules.

Are the current rules fair?

Not by a long shot. But I don't want my footy team to be flaunting the rules in order to win. That's not winning. Sure other teams were doing the same thing but the flaw is that they weren't hit with penalties rather than that we were.

There's a system in place and other clubs have been smart enough to use that system long before we cottoned on to the fact that it even existed.

If dropping down the ladder to rise again is the way you do it then do it. I'm not convinced that's the only way but it's certainly one way.

The only way you beat the system is to use the system. It's why watching Campo scream at umpires after EVERY free kick awarded against him is so frustrating. Does he think that's going to make a difference?

If you get on with it and accept the rules that are in place and work within them better than your opposition then you're much more likely to beat your opposition.

If you want to change the rules then fine, use the system to change them. There's a rules committee. Make a submission. Screaming at the umpire and taking out court injunctions doesn't change things. It only puts you further behind your opposition.

I want to support a football club that wins on a regular basis because it did so within the current structure agreed to by a majority of the 16 clubs. I may not agree with that structure and its rules but I want my club to use its brain to work within it rather than constantly screaming about how unfair everything is.

I am not too tied up with the pro-Jack and pro-Collo thing, they both suck. I'll leave that to you guys to decipher, I seriously do not care.
I see things at face value.

The only thing I want is flags, without talent on the list there are no premierships.

I am happy for your ethical stance, albeit, it has nothing to do with ethics taking out an injunction. They are taken out everyday, for one reason or another. When one is dealing with a multi million dollar entity, it becomes a ruthless & cut throat business arena, not a church.

KL, do you remeber how successful fatjack was when we went to court over Diesels suspension? The suspension was outrageous, we got an injunction, he played a few games then the appeal went AFLs way Diesel missed 9 and never played again and it cost us 500k. Good move!

The draft penalities were outrageous because the same penalties couldn't be equally applied. But going to court would have cost a fortune, probably would have just delayed the inevitable,and even if we succeeded in bringing down the whole drafting / salary cap thing, do you think that would be a good thing? Almsot every club in the land could buy and sell us. We're crap and it's not just because of losing draft picks>When have we ever used first round picks wisely ...hardly ever too many times we've either swapped them for hacks or recruit guys who can't or don't want to play.

Getting back to the post....well said BM, credit where it is due.

Then you had Hammill playing in a Grand Final.

Yes, back to the post...

I thought Whitnall and Campo were basically crap last night.

On the other hand...

I've been critical of Kouta in the past but I thought he was fantastic last night. Best game I've seen from him for a long, long time. I reckon you can gauge where he's at based on his willingness to kick goals. Some days it seems as though it doesn't occur to him to put them through himself. Last night he kicked a couple of beauties. Probably the only two high points of the night.

Bloody shame he's not 23 anymore...