What crap,Red had nothing to do with today so back off and give him a break

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"Go blues"

Feel my love...............

I reckon if Deluca put on another 5 -6 kg of muscle he'd be ok at CHF, as i can't see Fev playing anywhere else but FF. Fish is a great mark (just wish his kicking was better) and Vin's boy is really coming along. Thought he was one of the few to show some desperation today.

Yep, Lance is on shaky ground. I'd just play him at CHB until we trade him and let Deluca stay on the fwd line, as he is like a fish out of water on the backline.

14 kicks 5 handballs 7 marks even got a clearence. Not a bad effort for a bloke that had crap delivery and three oppoents all day in a team that got smashed.

I would be seriously looking at our second tier players and youngsters for complete lack of defensive effort yesterday.

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A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty" -Winston Churchill

L.M 35-06

As I said in another thread I reckon Lance had a good 2nd half (all relative of course)

Oh an can I just say, very quietly...

To single out players after the most woeful team effort since Rd 22 2003 is a disgrace

I'm happy to heap scorn on the team as a whole because there were 23 weak links out there yesterday.

I guess singling out is just so much easier.

edit: yeah I meant 2003. Thanks...

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Congratulations CK95

Lance played better in the second half when in defence.

Its clear Deluca has no idea down there , i can't figure out why Denis persists with it.

Lance permanently to defence !! I caxnt figure out why Denis didnt put Lance down there when the floodgates where open yesterday as an extra down back either - probably wouldnt have helped that much though anyway.

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*(grow - fun - gah)

Yeah but whatabout your whataboutism.

Not having a go at you here Grrofuncger but weren't we as a site (albeit through TBV) all screaming for Denis to play Lance in the forward line all of last season?

Perhaps the problem is upfield?

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Congratulations CK95

yeah we were bluehammer but i think things have changed slightly

with the emergence of Waite and our continued problems down back i think we need Whitnall in defence, Deluca just doesnt cut it down there.

Our midfielders also all need an uppercut to the jaw.

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*(grow - fun - gah)

Yeah but whatabout your whataboutism.

Lance is not a backman. He's great filling in space, taking marks, helping out, but to play him at CHB is pointless.

Why does Denis persist with playing DeLuca in the backline. Let me see, our other options yesterday included conceding the game and playing Whitnall on Simmonds. He's going to be beaten and we're taking out most potent forward out of the forward line. Otherwise we could have played Wiggins on Simmonds. Now if you think DeLuca had his troubles.

DeLuca was played in the backline because we're height deficient and have no choice, Open your eyes and you can see that. Morrell isn't up to it, Karl isn't mentally up to it and Livo is injured.

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"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

When we lost to Essendon*?

22 players. Who's the 23rd?

L.A would of been the man if his head was screwed on, Whitnal is still a good player however I wish L.A was sensible enough to listen to the warnings and still playing for us.

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A macfart a day helps you work rest and play

Lance doesnt take overhead marks and at 190cm is too short to play CHF......I thought he had turned the corner during the wiizer cup and played the best football I have seen form him but he has gone back to his ooor form of recent years and I dont think we can affod 500K a year for a player whose ouput is nowhere near the great key position forwards of other clubs...

Brown wouldnt have kicked goals becuase of poor disposal..disagree..Brown would straighten our forward line up and demand the ball...he would have outmarked players like Gaspar and Ray Hall because he is a better player than either of them...

Our season depended on midfield clearances.And they were putrid yesterday.Get 1st touch and you are in with a chance.Backline is immediatly under extreme pressure when you get killed in this department.And killed we were.Where the hell does Lance come into this.He is one of the few players with a bit of class at the club......No wonder Lance is pissed off forever being compared to Carey.Reckon Pagan needs to get over it.Lance aint Carey and never will be Carey.Better forget about the paddock and come up with something more in tune to the list you have.You cut your cloth according to the man.

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All my dangerous friends

i thought lance was one of our better players in the 2nd half yday and given our undersized defence chb can and should be his

Lance comes into it because he gets paid 500K a year and that equates to being our Barry Hall, our Warren Tredrae, our John Brown, etc etc etc.....he isnt delivering what they deliver ...thems the facts..we pay him superstar money and get B grade performance.....

Kernahan, Williams, Bradley got paid the big bucks and earned it..we are paying big bucks to two or three players and they are not earning it.....Lance is part of that group...

Well lets just take him out the back and shoot him then. Nothng like a good scapegoat. 22 players let us down yesterday, not just one or two, it was 22.

The comment re gameplan has some merit and worth looking at.

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A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty" -Winston Churchill

L.M 35-06

Lance and co simply cop the heat because they get paid the most. Lance was our best tall yesterday and that is not saying much but he was our best.
The only thing I can hang my hat on is that his last quarter of football was probably the best he played all year. Unfortunately it was at the wrong end of the ground and at the wrong time in the game. We can speculate on his future till the cows come home but in the end it is in the hands of Denis. Lance and his manager. Either way it will be sorted out by the end of the year.
My view is that only a few players are untouchable on our list as long as the deal is right for the club. We need as long term view to trading and drafting and no quick fixes. To take steps forwards sometimes you have to take some steps backwards.

Look I agree with Mick and whoever else suggest the Pagan Paddock concept only works for carey and no one else..Lance doesnt have the mobility or the athletic prowess to play that style of game...the other game plan we have is kick to Fev..everytime....that doesnt work all the time either with a 188cm FF... We need forward/s who can take a contested pack mark and kicks straight......there are going to be days when you cnat play your game plan but still win the game becaue you have players who can take a mark againt the odds.....the good teams have three key forwards who can take marks...overhead marks.....difficult overheads because it doesnt come lace out everytime...

Brown, Lynch Bradshaw
Tredrae,Lade, Thurstans
Gehrig, Reiwoldt, Kosi
Sure they have good midfields steering the ball in their general direction....but good teams have good talls who take marks..check out the stats for contested marks in the forward 50..bet you we are one of the worst at it......until we get a powerhouse CHF who can split packs, take marks we wont be any good...thats why I want Sentanta given the chance to play CHF and develop

How can he do anything when he is getting rubbish out of the midfielders Elwood.Get that clearance rate to a 50/50 ratio and Lance will improve out of site.Lance aint Carey.Fev aint Johny Longmire.Campo aint Stevo.Reckon Dennis needs to get over it.

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All my dangerous friends

Whitnall isn't a CHF, FF, CHB OR a 3rd option.

Whitnall is a midfielder in a big guy's body. Whitnall was at this best zoning off his man and leading deep up the field, especially when *gulp* Trent Hotton/Aaron Hamill provided a marking option around 50.

This is what we need to do up forward.

- Fev at fullforward
- get DeLuca out of the way... and, for mine, out of the side
- Get Waite to play CHF, leading strongly up the corridor, ala Riewoldt. Marking option around 70-80m out.
- Get Fev to lead in the space behind him. Fev is dangerous from anywhere around 55, and he starts his runs from 25-30m.
- then, fill the forward line with quick blokes who can get out of Fev's way and lead their man away. Fish can provide the 3rd marking option when he's back.
- Whitnall: just tell him to go where he wants. All of a sudden, he's not part of the structure. He can play on the ball if he wants, or play back to steady the ship. Give him the Hird role. Whitnall is basically Hird but slower and with poorer foot-skills. Just tell Whitnall to run where he wants (though not in Fev's way). If his man starts (succesfully) zoning off, then look at either dropping him loose in the backhalf, or deeper to goal (or get him off).

We have an awesome weapon up forward in Fev. Fev is a dead-set gun forward, and we keep swallowing space for him. Their loose man dropped infront of Fev is doubly as powerful if there's a crowd around Fev's leading space. We should just be opening up the 50. If they panic and drop someone back, then we have an advantage elsewhere on the park we can exploit

DeLuca is the main culprit.... but Whitnall does it as well. But Whitnall is smart enough to know where to run. Of all the players on our list we can give a free-role to.. its Lance.

SO:
FEV - FF
WAITE - CHF
FISHER/Setanta - 3rd target
LAPPIN/BETTS/etc etc - around them
WHITNALL - anywhere he wants

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Love Cricket? Love me