Interesting article in view of all that Fev said over the weekend in the papers.

Losing is unattractive to sponsors and members - we have been doing that very well for the past 4 years but the reality is, that its time to start winning if we are going to survive as a financial viable club.

Thanks for the memories Den!

_________________
“It is a state of mind, a system of belief, a way of seeing the world, a deep faith that, because you are Carlton, you belong to something great.” - Mike Fitzpatrick articulating what Out of the Blue means.

Alright, I have a plan.

In the seniors, if a player isn't in form what happens to them?

Yes, they get dropped to the Bullants.

In the Bullants, if a player is running hot what happens to them?

Yeah, they get promoted to the Blues.

SO,

Why shouldn't this be the same for coaches,

IN: Mitchell,
OUT: Pagan,

Paying out Pagan to sit on his arse for two years at 600k is diabolically stupid, let him coach the Bullants, let him be an assistant coach, let him stud-boots, ring up folks for membership, mow MC Hammer Oval, he could be a runner even,

understand that synners my fear is they get rid of Denis and win votes to continue of thier merry nothingness way.

This is the way the club ends
This is the way the club ends
not with a bang but a whimper....


T.S. - great Carlton man.

_________________
This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

Having fears should encourage you to change things.. not to keep them the same..

_________________
Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

yeah but I want to change the Board first!

Not have them scrape out more time using Denis' carcass to buy off the hounds.

_________________
This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

Shouldn't we be interviewing the best candidates instead of appointing Mitchell straight away?

_________________
"You are being watched. The government has a secret system. A machine that spies on you every hour of every day. I know because I built it." - Finch

So this reveiw is being conducted predominately by Sticks & Bear with no input from outside the club. It looks like they will decide to let Mitchell coach without sounding out any external new prospects.
Does not look like a comprehensive review. I'm all for change but I want the best available person to coach the club and the only way to do that is to go out to the market place.
If the review is not done properly then I would seriously have to question the professionalism of the football club and whether I entrust these people with my membership money which has come in for the last 21 years.
Do it properly or else.

Dannyboy,

don't worry - this could be a win-win. If Pagan gets the boot you can just imagine him dropping an almighty bucket all over the Board. He'll go out both fists punching so that he can get another job somewhere else. He'll complain that the Board knows nothing - that they told him this, and then they contradicted themselves with that. This will get the media hopping, and potentially flush out a challenger ticket.

Personally I think that a coaching change will just fan the flames of fire for a change in the Board.

Of course I may just be dreaming - but I could see it playing out as above.

But that doesnt mean you dont take an opportunity when it comes...

I reckon we make sure everyone votes and that way we might give it to a few of them this time...in the neck..!!!

_________________
Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

disagree you must prioritise

My main target is the Board

Denis can stay another year if he must (hey picks 1&2 wouldn't be that bad )

but we new to re-energise this club from the very top.

_________________
This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

That would seem like the most logical process but we are talking about Carlton here - expect a half hearted review

Take the passion out of it, and look at what has happened since he re-signed.

Two wooden spoons. 16th of 16 at a time when he should have been able to bring in players from the draft (which takes time, yes) or through the PSD to lift the performance. Other than the performance of a handful of young stars to be, we have gone backwards. Backwards in game plan, backwards in skills, backwards in terms of planning for our next big time team.

If you argue he was tanking all along for the benefit of the Footy Club (and perhaps as upside for Year 6 of his contract) then I'd have a different view. Unfrotunately the man who may have agreed the tanking strategy is no longer there and there's no proof in it.

Two wooden spoons in succession. Where would the Club be if we had 3 next year with the same Coach?

rready to rumble, that's where

_________________
This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

What a farce.

2 best friends of a coach in waiting doing a review of the coaching structure. 1 of whom doesnt get along witht the incumbent.

It seems the most likely suggestion is to dump the incumbent and appoint someone because he'll "do it cheap". Are we coaching a team in Australia's premier sport or building a verandah.

Why cant we do this properly and get independant experts and look for the best availbale candidiate, Longmire, Mitchell or Pagan, whoever is the best. Why are we looking for the cheapest?

_________________
T E A M

There are two sides to the Pagan conundrum.

On the positive side, I think the man has done well in educating the many young players on our list, and the form of Walker, Simpson and others is testament to good development.

The other side of the argument is that Pagan is seen to be lost on match-day, uses antiquated methods in training, and is blindly loyal to those immediately around him.

One of the reasons Sheedy has had such sustained success and longetivity is his ability to reinvent himself and change the personnel around him. I don't think it's any coincidence that Essendon* has dropped off now that Sheedy is clinging onto names from the past, both on and off the field. Appointing Gary Ayres was an off-field example, as he poses no threat for the senior coaching position, and nor does Dean Wallis. The recruitment of Carlton has-beens are the on-field examples.

Pagan extablished the mentality of the playing list being weak as his comfort zone for failure. While the crap playing list, and culture within that group were the reasons for immediate on-field performance problems, the constant whinging about the draft penalties and not 'batting too deep' became a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Despite Fevola's statement to the contrary, there is a sense that Pagan has lost the respect of the playing group, and that is fatal in most cases.

It's time for Denis to go. I'm not certain that Mitchell is the answer, but I don't think he would be a bad choice either. Whoever we choose, it's time for our team and club to stop having this culture of inevitable failure, because otherwise we might as well change our name to St Kilda or Fitzroy.

_________________
"The old believe everything, the middle-aged suspect everything, and the young know everything." Oscar Wilde

I'm tipping we will know sooner than later!

_________________
Oompa loompa doompety dee
If you are wise you'll listen to me

Well that would make sense. There's no point getting rid of Pagan after trade week when he has swapped pick 1 to WC for Gardiner as a final act of spite.

Is today too soon?

_________________
Happy Days Are Here Again!!

There's a Board Meeting tonight isn't there?

I would have thought - if this was an issue being seriously considered - it would have to be the first point of discussion.

na they'll just set a date when they should meet to set a date when they should.... etc. etc. etc.

or

they'll ask the AFL what they think

_________________
This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!